#jollamobile log for Monday, 2017-01-30

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AL13N_workif i wanted a new sailfishos phone, what should i look for? oneplus X ? oneplus one? is such a phone still sold?10:37
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HelleAL13N_work: Fairphone 2 possibly10:42
AL13N_worksomething cheapish that i can still buy new10:43
AL13N_workfairphone2 is quite expensive iirc10:43
HelleAL13N_work: 650 euro or so10:43
HelleApple prices10:43
Nicd-really expensive for what it is10:43
AL13N_worki was looking at https://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Adaptations/libhybris10:44
HelleNicd-: true, but check the office space they are renting off of it10:44
AL13N_worki want a cheap phone with sailfishos10:44
AL13N_workfor work10:44
Nicd-Helle: what?10:44
AL13N_workboss will need to ok it, so must be cheap, it can be older, i don't mind10:44
HelleNicd-: They are in one of the most expensive parts of Amsterdam to rent office space10:44
Helleno wonder their phone is expensive :P10:44
AL13N_workbut, i fear most of these phones, i will not be able to buy somewhere10:44
AL13N_workin that table, is the bottom one the most recently ported?10:45
tadzikAL13N_work: I'd go for Aqua Fish, but it's a bit of a PITA to get10:45
Nicd-aqua fish is sold out, no?10:45
HelleNicd-: and yes, part of that is joking, given sales volume it shouldn't be that big of an impact10:46
tadzikoh, I had no idea10:46
Nicd-it was in the news that the batch they made is sold and there's no plan to make new10:47
AL13N_workxiaomi seems to have good support looking at the table10:47
HelleI've been pondering getting in touch with Fairphone 2 and some other parties and seeing what it would take to put 500-1000 FP2's out with SailfishOS pre-installed and semi-supported (via a non-profit as developer devices, so EU regulations allows less then full support)10:48
AL13N_workbut maybe xiaomi is not easily available in EU10:48
HelleAL13N_work: xiaomi is reasonably well availible10:48
AL13N_workah, ok10:48
Helleespecially on Amazon10:49
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Hellethe reason to go FP2 btw for such a new Sailfish dev phone would be because the port has been done and Fairphone has long term hardware support10:49
Hellealso, no dealing with Chinese or Indian companies with a major cultural barrier10:49
mornfallaaaand the port is still unofficial and no dalvik?10:49
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Hellemornfall: yep, so the port would need to be made official (so licensed from Jolla), and lack of dalvik to me is a "whatever"10:50
Hellemornfall: I'd rather have an option, without dalvik, then no option10:50
mornfallHelle: well, whatever :)10:51
Nicd-pretty strong faith in SFOS if you're willing to pay a hefty premium just to get a mediocre device with no Android support10:51
HelleNicd-: hence the low unit count10:51
HelleNicd-: but the problem with the Android support is that it's third party10:51
Helleso until we have sfdroid10:52
HelleI am not going to try and get three companies on board for a low volume deal10:52
Helletwo would be hard enough10:52
mornfallubuntu is probably a more viable platform if you are willing to ditch android10:52
Helleanyway, I am in talks with some people who might be willing to back this project and provide some funding and material support (handling legalese, etc)10:53
Helleanyway, I am in talks with some people who might be willing to back this project and provide some funding and material support (handling legalese, etc)10:54
Helleoops, keypress error10:54
larstiqmornfall: mobile ubuntu seems a bit held up10:54
mornfalllarstiq: and sfos isn't?10:54
Helle(with funding being paying for the creation of a foundation and such matters)10:55
larstiqmornfall: much less, but then I have asymmetric information10:55
larstiqhmm, can't find the link immediately10:56
larstiqmornfall: anyway, snappy work postponing ubuntu touch10:56
HelleUbuntu mobile from what I heard is essentially postponed10:56
Hellewhile SailfishOS is just stalled out a bit from what we can see10:56
Hellewithout a "nope, we won't work on this at the moment"10:57
larstiqhttp://opensourceforu.com/2017/01/canonical-make-ubuntu-touch-snappy/ not exactly what I had in mind, but roughly that10:58
pp_lessee how meh MWC will be :-)10:58
zebbiz_piHi!10:59
zebbiz_piI found a github repo of an app I want10:59
zebbiz_piHow do I install it10:59
zebbiz_pi?10:59
tadzikyou'll need the sailfish sdk11:00
mornfalllarstiq: so what's up with sfos? I haven't heard anything for months11:00
tadzikclone the repository, open the project, build it and deploy to your device11:00
zebbiz_piOk, thanks11:00
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tadzikit's probably way easier to get it from warehouse :)11:00
tadzikwhich app is it?11:00
larstiqmornfall: 2.1.0 is in beta11:01
zebbiz_pitadzik: https://github.com/sandsmark/bluefish11:01
mornfalllarstiq: anything interesting in it? is a roadmap/changelog/anything available on the interwebs?11:02
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zebbiz_piOnly native snapchap app I've found11:02
mornfall(and most importantly, does it fix the browser flicker bug? :p)11:02
Hellereminds me, I need to try out SailfishOS on one of my tablets11:02
tadzikzebbiz_pi: indeed, seems like it's not released anywhere11:02
tadziklet us know if it works :)11:02
larstiqmornfall: Qt and Bluetooth upgrades, changelog should be public when it goes into early access11:03
mornfallI suppose ubuntu is trying to do something about the rise of docker with snap... I guess that's worthwhile :)11:03
larstiqmornfall: do you have link for the flicker bug so I can check?11:03
Helleoh, reminds me, Bluez announcements on Bluetooth LE ?11:04
mornfalllarstiq: dunno, I thought it was universally known (and hated)... I have to restart the browser all the time on both the tablet and the phone11:04
mornfallhttps://together.jolla.com/question/149683/bug-browser-freezing-andor-blinking-after-updating-to-fiskarsinjoki/?sort=votes&page=1 probably11:04
Hellealso, anyone have a suggestion to reverse engineer Bluetooth LE communications ? (while I don't absolutely need to, it would be handy)11:04
mornfallapparently 67 of the 70 people that still use TJC voted on it :P11:05
Hellemornfall: I can't replicate it11:05
Hellemornfall: I saw the bug, but don't have it happening on mobile11:06
locusfHelle: any signal analyzer should work or a sdr stick11:06
Hellelocusf: presume the lowest budget route11:06
larstiqmornfall: doesn't have a tracking bug on it11:06
Hellelocusf: and no existing bits and pieces11:06
locusfHelle: hcidump :p11:06
locusfdunno if it tells anything about ble11:06
Hellelocusf: Bluez has BLE support to some extent, but I need to snoop on Android app to BLE device11:07
mornfalllarstiq: well, seems like a pretty major problem to me, and since it's been around for what, 3 months... you see why people think sfos is basically a wasteland :P11:07
locusfHelle: tough luck then11:10
Hellelocusf: well, I said low budget, not "I am not willing to invest"11:10
mornfallHelle: BLE won't work on the Jolla phone until a kernel upgrade (which is not happening)11:11
locusfHelle: yeah and tough luck from my part is that this where my skills stop :)11:11
Hellelocusf: ah :)11:11
Hellemornfall: *pout*11:11
locusfand re-certification11:12
mornfallHelle: Jolla C might be better off, I don't have one11:12
locusfwhich is always fun11:12
Hellemornfall: I have one11:12
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Helleah, Adafruit has a $30 BLE sniffer11:13
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Hellekernel update needed is a bit of a meeeeh though, wonder if it is possible to just get it working with a fresh module11:14
mornfallnope11:14
mornfallthe kernel on jolla 1 is way past its expiration date11:15
mornfallthe only apparent way forward is to ditch the qualcomm kernel and try rebasing to a current kernel with DRI/freedreno11:16
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mornfallit's a lot of work and jolla is not willing to do it11:16
Hellebit of a shame, I tend to prefer using my Jolla 111:16
larstiqmornfall: it _could_ be https://github.com/sailfishos/sailfish-browser/pull/52511:16
Hellebut having my Heart Rate Monitor actually talk to it would be nice11:17
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mornfalllarstiq: maybe, can't really tell11:24
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zebbiz_piI have no idea what I'm doing...11:28
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zebbiz_piI've opened the project in QtCreator11:29
zebbiz_piI press the build button11:29
zebbiz_piNow what?11:29
mornfallzebbiz_pi: now would be a good time to go get a degree in CS :-)11:29
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zebbiz_pimornfall: I already have a bachelor's degree in CS ;)11:31
zebbiz_piBut I've never used this tool before and nothing happens when I build11:31
zebbiz_piWait11:31
zebbiz_piI found out that I get errors11:32
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SfietKonstantinWzebbiz_pi: :)11:42
zebbiz_piOh, damnit11:43
zebbiz_piIt won't start the MerSDK because it's looking for the wrong kernel version11:43
zebbiz_piIt's looking for 4.8 but I have 4.911:43
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zebbiz_piI'll try to reboot and then reinstall11:44
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SfietKonstantinWzebbiz_pi: isvirtualbox correctly installed ?11:49
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zebbiz_piSfietKonstantinW: It was, but I updated linux at the same time11:53
zebbiz_piSo I think it configed itself after the old version11:53
zebbiz_piNow I've restarted the computer and reinstalled VB11:53
zebbiz_piSo now that work, but there's something wrong in the code...11:53
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zebbiz_pi"Project ERROR: gstreamer-0.10 development package not found"11:57
maldo not use gstreamer 0.1011:58
Tegulooks like that bluefish has not been updated in 2 years so it uses old libraries11:59
zebbiz_piYeah12:00
zebbiz_piNow I need to find what use that so I can change it to a newer version12:00
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zebbiz_piI found it, now to get it to work with the new version12:06
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zebbiz_piHave anyone here tried to build in qtcreator on archlinux?12:58
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AL13N_workawesome! my app is approved! i already have downloads and comments! \o/13:19
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louisdkWe haven't heard anything from Jolla HQ since new year. I hope they're up to something big :)13:40
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Nicd-or there's nothing happening :P13:41
larstiqhow do you define Jolla HQ?13:42
Nicd-@jollahq twitter?13:42
louisdklarstiq: well the headquarter of Jola :)13:45
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mornfalllouisdk: apparently an update is coming at some point13:51
mornfallbut ~0 press13:51
mornfalllouisdk: I even hear from larstiq that it might fix the browser flicker bug13:52
* larstiq poked press people13:52
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louisdkmornfall: let's hope so :)13:57
mornfallzebbiz_pi: well, the SDK isn't very well thought out, and even less portable13:58
mornfallzebbiz_pi: I got it running with some awful hacks on NixOS before, but openbsd is completely out of the question :P13:59
zebbiz_pimornfall: I got in touch with the developer of the project I was trying to build14:00
zebbiz_pi14:34:36 < sandsmark> zebbiz_pi: that implements an ancient version of the snapchat protocol14:00
zebbiz_pi14:34:51 < sandsmark> and I did it when semi-drunk on a plane, so the implementation is not very nice14:00
zebbiz_pi14:36:00 < zebbiz_pi> sandsmark: So you don't think it will work anymore?14:00
zebbiz_pi14:36:21 < sandsmark> probably not14:00
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mornfallyeah, well, snapchat14:05
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mornfallis the android app busted?14:06
zebbiz_piDon't think so14:06
mornfallit's ICQ all over again14:06
zebbiz_piI installed the android app but it wanted google play services14:08
zebbiz_piWhich I don't have14:08
zebbiz_piSo I went looking for a native app14:08
mornfallah, play services14:08
mornfallyes14:08
mornfallfucked either way I guess14:08
* zebbiz_pi nods14:08
zebbiz_piUnless sandsmark decide to update the native version :)14:09
mornfallyou could always not use stupid proprietary services14:09
zebbiz_piI don't use snapchat14:09
mornfallwhy do you want a client then?14:10
zebbiz_piSomeone wanted me to try14:10
zebbiz_piNow I can't be nothered14:10
zebbiz_pibothered*14:10
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Nicd-mornfall: telling people not to use something is not really the most useful answer14:16
mornfallNicd-: it's either "don't use jolla" or "don't use snapchat" I guess14:17
mornfallwhere snapchat really is basically a standin for any proprietary app/protocol14:17
mornfallsince those that sfos supported at start, none work at this point14:17
Nicd-or any open app/protocol for which jolla has no implementation? :P14:17
mornfallthere are some options for open things, for proprietary there are typically none14:18
mornfall(at least if you restrict yourself to options where you avoid breaking laws)14:19
Nicd-that attitude just annoys me14:19
mornfallget a better one?14:19
mornfallgot*14:19
Nicd-instead of saying "there's no support" you just have to say "well you could stop using that stupid thing"14:19
Nicd-heard it too many times in the open source circles14:20
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mornfallNicd-: well, you are doing nothing to fix the attitude (actually you make it worse)14:22
Nicd-I'm calling you out on it. how you deal with that is up to you14:23
mornfallyou make it sound like OSS is the bad guys because they don't have enough respect for proprietary technology, all the while the said proprietary tech has 0 respect for OSS14:23
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Nicd-it's not like that14:24
mornfallnah, not at all14:24
Nicd-it's not about open source vs proprietary. it's just about what helps and what doesn't. telling people their choices are stupid is a good way to alienate them from the community14:25
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tadzik+114:27
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SfietKonstantinWlouisdk: something big from @JollaHQ could be 2.1.X14:28
mornfallNicd-: you underestimate people... they usually know the thing they try to get running is stupid, but they are being forced into it by network effects or whatever14:28
SfietKonstantinWor even better: 3.X.Y14:28
mornfallNicd-: you could have had a point, 3 years ago, when a few “normal” people purchased jolla devices and those probably would be surprised that a “thing” everybody is using is not working on jolla14:32
Nicd-so now we can tell the rest of them to bugger off too? :D14:35
mornfallthat's one point of view... another is, don't worry about it, the service is stupid anyway, you can live without it14:37
mornfallthere's literally nothing that can be done to get it work, so the choice really is ditch sfos or ditch the service14:37
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AL13N_workok, so redmi2 and mi4 seem not available anymore (it's all later versions)14:51
AL13N_worktoo bad all the ported stuff is older14:52
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phlixi_oi did not follow all of the conversation, but AL13N_work you are looking for a device, right? for the case it has not been mentioned, i just stumbled upon this thread... https://together.jolla.com/question/136143/wiki-available-devices-running-sailfish-os/15:06
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AL13N_worksounds interesting15:15
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AL13N_workphlixi_o: :-(15:18
AL13N_workphlixi_o: the ones mentioned are just not available anymore :-(15:18
phlixi_oor not avail yet15:18
AL13N_workexcept fp215:18
AL13N_workyeah15:18
phlixi_oi just thought i might as well mention the thread15:18
AL13N_workthx15:19
AL13N_workphlixi_o: btw: just got an app through harbour for following manga/comics \o/15:19
phlixi_oi know15:19
phlixi_o:-)15:19
AL13N_workbtw: anyone at FOSDEM?15:19
AL13N_worknext weekend?15:19
locusfaye15:24
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AL13N_workis there a meeting this time too? official talks? a dinner?15:27
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mornfallwell, I caught a glimpse of Carol Chen in a Jolla hoodie two days ago at devconf.cz :P15:28
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locusfhttps://together.jolla.com/question/154586/fosdem-it-together-2017/ AL13N_work15:30
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M4rtinKnew modRana is out: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1522634#post152263421:32
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