Thursday, 2013-07-18

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sledges"The following assumes that you have a Nemo instance with Sailfish libraries installed (note that this is not a promise of us doing that)"12:10
Sfiet_Konstantinsledges: extract sailfish libs12:11
Sfiet_Konstantinfrom the sailfish phone12:11
sledgeswhen people say "we want jolla on n9", means they want sailfish os UX on n9, with all interop to be usable as much as if not more a daily phone12:11
sledgesSfiet_Konstantin, very good point12:11
sledgessadly means time-wise we have to wait till christmas12:11
sledgesand hope it is armv7hl ;)12:12
Sfiet_Konstantinsledges: I wasn't expecting anything before christmas12:12
Sfiet_Konstantinsledges: yes12:12
Sfiet_Konstantinsledges: actually my bet is more on nemo12:12
Sfiet_Konstantinglacier ui12:12
Sfiet_Konstantinwork to bring it on n9xx12:12
sledgesjust dawned on me: it's the only bet possible12:12
Sfiet_Konstantinx = 50 00 or -0012:12
sledgesfor given time now12:13
sledgesglacier should be as attractive/similar/revolutionary (if not more) as sailfish12:16
Sfiet_Konstantindon't think so either12:17
Sfiet_Konstantinglacier will be enjoyable to use12:17
sledgesstart building ecosystem around sailfish - the goal has always been the same12:17
Sfiet_Konstantinand slightly different12:17
sledgesnow we have a challenge12:17
Sfiet_KonstantinI guess that glacier will be more maemoish like12:18
Sfiet_Konstantinhacker friendly ui12:18
Sfiet_Konstantinsledges: what's the challenge12:18
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Sfiet_Konstantinor poweruser ui let's say12:18
sledgesmy goal is that when jolla comes out, it should already have a decent amount of developers and apps12:18
Sfiet_Konstantinsledges: ah12:18
sledgesnow it's hard when you don't have the programmable toy in your pocket yet12:18
Sfiet_Konstantinthat's hard12:19
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sledgesthat's where i'm coming from12:19
Sfiet_Konstantinsledges: SDK beta 2 soon12:19
sledgesyes :) on VM or iconia tab ;)12:19
Sfiet_Konstantinthe only problem is that Jolla don't have the resources to support other devices12:19
sledgesall biggest fans/devs of jolla & family own an n9xx12:20
Sfiet_Konstantiniconia tab is a hacker device for example12:20
Sfiet_Konstantinsledges: +112:20
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Sfiet_Konstantinbut it is harder to have a fully working n9xx image easily12:20
Sfiet_Konstantin1st: problems with nokia12:20
sledgesand that's the challenge12:20
Sfiet_Konstantin2nd: problem with wayland12:20
Sfiet_Konstantinand if the SDK is i45686 based12:20
Sfiet_Konstantinthen it is no use for N9xx12:21
sledgesso to make peeps happy, opensource community needs to chase taillights again and make a sailfish replica12:21
sledgesor brainstorm a cunning alternative win-win plan ;)12:21
sledgesso yes, glacier is main hope now12:21
sledgesthe aim should be simple:12:22
sledges1. show how cool glacier is12:22
sledges2. make n9xx users install it12:22
Sfiet_Konstantinthe problem with glacier is that you don't have silica to dev on it12:22
sledges3. create qtcomponents which are easy to port to sailfish once they get their jolla phones12:22
Sfiet_Konstantinbut it can be a very nice "drop-in" replacement for harmattan12:22
sledgesyup, see 3 ^ :)12:22
sledgesdrop-in replacement - that's for sure12:22
Sfiet_Konstantin3 is hard, especially if Jolla want to keep their ui12:23
sledgesbut would be nice aiming to kill two birds with one stone12:23
Sfiet_Konstantinlike a simple silica port12:23
sledges3 is hard, but not impossible, or at least could be worked towards that direction12:23
sledgesyes, subset, or similar stuff12:23
sledgesas glacier hasn't got its components (yet ;))12:23
Sfiet_Konstantinbut there is a need of glacier before12:23
Sfiet_Konstantinand least something working for N912:23
sledgessure :)12:23
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Sfiet_Konstantinand before christmass, I guess that glacier won't be ready either12:24
sledgesone step at a time, but nice to have bigger picture12:24
sledgesvery good point12:24
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sledgesunless enough persuasion ensue12:24
sledgesthat is12:24
sledgessmall amount of devs make PoC of glacier12:24
sledgesto attract bigger amount12:24
Sfiet_Konstantinand well, I would love to hack glacier, but we are like 5 devs, and doing it with free time12:24
Sfiet_Konstantinbut now ... free time goes to Jolla :/12:24
sledgesah, your social apps :)12:25
Sfiet_Konstantinbut I would love to do social for glacier12:25
sledgesim totally enthused about glacier :)12:25
Sfiet_Konstantinme too12:25
Sfiet_Konstantinespecially that we have a pretty solid mw in Nemo12:25
sledgeseven thought of cutting out icons from PNG to make a theme already :D12:25
sledgesbacked up by jolla12:25
Sfiet_Konstantinso an UI could be "easily" done12:25
Sfiet_Konstantinsledges: :D12:26
Sfiet_Konstantinsledges: you should talk to qwazix in order to get icons files and start hacking maybe12:26
sledgesrikanee to be precise, sure! will do12:26
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Sfiet_Konstantindidn't qwazix and rikanee did the design together ?12:27
Sfiet_KonstantinI'm just waiting for more detailed infos about glacier guidelines to start hacking12:27
sledgeshell yes :)12:28
Sfiet_Konstantinlike size / positions / theming elements (like the backgorunds etc)12:28
sledgesbest to take sailfish guidelines and work from there towards mockup12:28
Sfiet_Konstantinhowever, I would need a nemo device12:28
Sfiet_Konstantiniconia tab will do12:28
sledgeswhere are your n9xxs? :)12:28
* Stskeeps suggested starting in VM12:28
Sfiet_Konstantinsledges: don't think so12:28
* sledges has no idea what guilelines entail, so12:29
Sfiet_KonstantinStskeeps: N9xx : no N900, N9 in France, N950 bricked12:29
sledgesnavigational aspects are as important as visual12:29
Sfiet_Konstantinsledges: I would love very precise design related to position of text (margins, size), etc12:29
Sfiet_Konstantinbut iconia is here :)12:29
Sfiet_KonstantinStskeeps: don't like VM :(12:29
sledgesyou're not in france?12:29
Sfiet_KonstantinVM on my computer is not good: not enough ram12:30
Sfiet_Konstantinsledges: nope12:30
StskeepsSfiet_Konstantin: it's a stable hw adaptation which is really important for development12:30
Sfiet_KonstantinI'm not in fr12:30
sledgesok :)12:30
Sfiet_KonstantinStskeeps: +1 for that, but I have that iconia tab that could do the job12:30
Sfiet_Konstantinwill fallback to vm if problems12:30
sledgesSfiet_Konstantin, margins & size are normally all encoded into properties12:30
sledgesso they can be changed by master designer12:30
sledgesand your app should not explode12:30
Sfiet_Konstantinsledges: +112:30
Sfiet_Konstantinsledges: btw, you don't know where I am ? :O12:31
sledgesin nemo they are properties (still remember their names *meego*..*margin_* ... :))12:31
sledgesSfiet_Konstantin, can only guess :) APAC?12:31
sledgesor maybe Tampere? ;D12:32
sledgesEMEA silicon valley :)12:32
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Sfiet_Konstantinsledges: :/
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sledgesehehey!!! :D I was on holiday that week :P12:33
sledgeswell done mate, congrats12:34
sledgesdidn't know jolla did internships12:35
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Sfiet_Konstantinsledges: consider applying :D12:36
sledges:D i wish i was a student again12:37
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sledgesworth becoming one lol12:37
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HartziSfiet_Konstantin: so, how is techopolis? Do you like the place?13:03
Sfiet_KonstantinHartzi: it is nice :)13:03
Sfiet_KonstantinI like the chair I'm sitting on and the screen I'm looking at, and the rest, I care less honestly :)13:04
Hartziyes it is. The roof sauna has very nice view to south13:04
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Sfiet_Konstantinthere is a roof sauna ? :O13:08
Sfiet_Konstantinbut I still have to try what a sauna is13:08
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Hartziyou never tried?!13:09
Sfiet_Konstantinno :$13:12
Hartzimein gott13:12
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Hartziyou really should try13:16
HartziSfiet_Konstantin: btw do you have CV somewhere online? I'd like to see what is requires to get internship at jolla :D13:18
ottulonenif you got no idea what's it about, don't expect too much... some people need a bit of time to get used to it13:19
ottulonenI know several people who moved to/visited Finland and had to try more than a couple times before they could enjoy sauna13:19
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sledgesif you don't do sauna regularly, it takes several sessions to get back on track as well13:21
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sledgesor just not put too much heat at first ;)13:22
sledges(water poured on hot stones in my homeland)13:22
sledgesalso time spent in it is crucial13:22
sledgeshey, do you jump into cold lake afterwards? :D13:22
sledgesthat'ß the most awesome part :)13:23
Hartzisledges: ofc13:23
sledgesif frozen - through a hole in the lake :)~13:23
Hartziespecially in wintertime13:23
Hartzihell yea!13:24
sledgesdipping into a deep snow suffices if no lake around :)13:24
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ottulonenfor me the problem seems to be I don't really get warm enough in sauna :<13:27
ottulonenhad to sit for ages last time I visited a lake and still didn't feel very hot13:27
sledgesmaybe you need to find the type of sauna that fits you13:29
sledgesdifferent humidities etc13:29
ottulonenoh, it's not that, I've had plenty of saunas etc13:29
ottulonenjust lately none of them seem to do it13:29
sledgeshmph interesting, wonder if has something to do with metabolism/blood pressure/whatnot13:30
ottulonencould be about the weather, our apartment stays very hot throughout the year, only nearing lower 20's in winter, even then never below that13:30
sledgesa so you are acclimatised13:31
ottulonenusually it's my wife who gets cold very fast in the water, but last time it was me who started shivering13:31
ottulonenjust a few weeks before that I was swimming in the same lake with no sauna and the water was about the same, didn't get cold at any point13:32
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faenilanyone willing to contribute to Nemo,
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sledgeswith obvious importance in mind that sailfish port is viable only through nemo supported devices (n9xx etc), and nemo needs to go wayland first :)15:35
faenilsledges, thanks for making things more real :D15:36
sledgesworth writing to ml as well (sailfish and nemo)15:37
sledgesi.e mer15:37
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faeniloh crap, I hate writing :D15:40
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* dm8tbr has been telling this to everyone who asked about sailfish on X. Want that? Make Nemo work, then it will work easily16:01
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faenilemail sent o/16:04
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faenilhope it's clear, I didn't even read it twice lol16:06
sledgesi think you should reconsider your hatred for writing ;P16:07
Hartzifaenil: did you send an application?16:10
faenilHartzi, what?16:10
Hartzifor jolla16:15
sledgesjust discovered this awesome sailfishos artwork:
faenilHartzi, ahmmm...August 2012? :D16:17
Yanielthat's hot16:17
faenilnever got a reply though :P16:17
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Hartzifaenil: ah, ok :D16:23
faenilHartzi, :D I'm still busy with university16:23
faenilso that would be one more problem16:24
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Hartziokay, so you're not studying in finland16:26
faenilHartzi, unfortunately not...Italian16:27
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Hartzifaenil: you applied and didn't get a reply? Not nice :|16:29
faenilHartzi, well, what I got told every time I asked was16:32
faenil"if we didn't reply, it means you're still in the hiring pool" :)16:32
faenilso it's also a positive thing16:32
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faenilbut, but :D16:44
Hartzidonno if they want hire studends?16:45
faenilexactly ;)16:46
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Hartzior lets put it this way: why would they want hire studendt when they can hire experienced professionals :| that's why I haven't applied16:54
YanielI'd assume they would16:56
faenilHartzi, yeah ;)16:57
faenilwell, a passionate student could be better than a boring professional16:58
faenileven if only for the morale ;)16:58
Hartzifaenil: true, but that's not the whole truth17:00
Yanielhiring students is probbably cheaper too :D17:00
faenilYaniel, actually, if things didn't change, everyone gets same salary at Jolla17:00
faenilflat structure17:00
Yanielhm yeah17:01
Yanieljolla is kind of an exception :D17:01
Yanielin most ways17:01
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Morpog_PCAkademy videos are uploaded! Mer SailfishOS,_Open_Source_and_Sailfish_OS.webm All videos
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