Monday, 2015-01-12

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nycat-what is responsible for starting the wayland server?02:17
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saidinesh5sandsmark: btw. what are you working on wrt skeyer?06:03
saidinesh5i have a few more experiments to run with our edit distance algorithm06:03
saidinesh5today i am testing them out... mainly 2 improvements : 1 is an early return kind of thing in the edit distance algorithm based on  the threshold06:04
saidinesh5that should bring down the complexity of editDistance from O( m*n ) to O( k * min(m,n) )..... and since k ~ 5-6 ; while m and n are around 30, i think this will fix a  lot of performance issues06:06
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saidinesh5the second improvement is a more interesting one.....06:06
saidinesh5i m thinking of making substitution cost 1 - distance(keys) or something like that06:07
saidinesh5this should be interesting ... BUT i think it would ruin our BK trees because then editDistance would not behave well with the triangle inequality06:08
saidinesh5like PIT and SIT are of edit distnace 1 from each other06:09
saidinesh5but FIT wont be the same edit distance as it is from PIT or SIT06:10
saidinesh5like it is closer to sit than pit06:11
saidinesh5lets see though06:11
saidinesh5first the cutoff one should be interesting06:11
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tortoisedochow to debug app reactivity?06:34
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tortoisedochow to compare runtime requirements (RAM / CPU) in general? monitoring /proc?06:51
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Armadilloisn't Python already allowed in Harbour?08:01
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Yanielgpodder was just published there08:05
Armadilloso someone should update the Harbour FAQ^^08:05
Nicd-I missed the memo on that08:05
Armadillocheck the new apps frequently :P08:05
Nicd-no, on the python compatibility08:06
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Armadilloah ok08:08
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nadleyhi all08:20
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pketolai_Armadillo: update to harbour faq coming probably today :)08:52
Armadillopketolai_ sounds good, what will be changed? :)08:53
pketolai_Armadillo: the python part :)08:53
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nadleyis it possible to use the caldav of sailfish os with davmail ?09:01
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coderustortoisedoc: dependency on harbour package not possible09:09
coderusbecause harbour won't give you list of packages until you not installed it09:09
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tortoisedoccoderus : yeah, thanks09:09
tortoisedoccoderus : I think you could still put a dependency in the openrepos pkg tho (referring to a package available from harbour)09:10
tortoisedocyou would loose the automatic fetch09:10
tortoisedocbut meh09:10
tortoisedocits a minor problem09:10
tortoisedocI have a funny situation now09:11
tortoisedocwhen quickbar is autostarted09:11
tortoisedocit freezes09:11
tortoisedocor is only partly usable09:11
tortoisedockilling it and starting it normally09:11
tortoisedocmakes it fully ok09:11
tortoisedocI wonder if autostarted apps have different runtime limits (RAM / CPU?)09:11
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coderusi don't know09:19
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tortoisedoccan anyone help with some runtime performance analysis?10:47
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daithefluhi !11:09
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SK_worktortoisedoc: what kind ?11:14
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tortoisedocSK_work : I would like to gain insight on why my app's runtime behaviour is different when started by systemd vs when started normally11:16
tortoisedoc(by different I mean : unresponsive, only certain actions working)11:17
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sandsmarksaidinesh5: the second idea sounds very interesting11:19
sandsmarkand I'm not working on anything atm., haven't had much spare time left over for much lately :(11:19
SK_worktortoisedoc: using invoker in both case ?11:19
tortoisedocSK_work : good point, invoker used only when started normally11:20
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SK_worktortoisedoc: invoker do some trics11:24
SK_workbetter use it all the time11:24
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tortoisedocSK_work : ok i see, problem seems to happen independently if i use invoker or not11:35
tortoisedocSK_work : what kind of tricks does invoker do?11:35
SK_worksetting some env var ?11:38
SK_workmaybe suid too11:38
SK_workwhat's the problem ?11:38
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tortoisedocSK_work : well, basically once started by systemd, scrolling stops working and sliding left on list items stops working12:05
tortoisedoc(independently if through invoker or not)12:05
entilthis gave me an idea.
entilto what extent does alien dalvik see jolla's eg. calendar data? can that be separately configured?12:06
entillike "sure, bullshit application du jour, do your nsa thing" and little does it know it's actually sealed shut from the actual environment12:08
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tortoisedocentil : you could go further of that, and feed it with fake data ;)12:19
entilas jolla boasts being the more private company, would something like that be feasible?12:20
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entilI'm sure there are a lot of non-trivialities, like what to do when the app asks for access to your camera and you've used Jolla Dalvik Blocker to deny sharing the camera. a black image over the camera protocol?12:24
entilsome apps want this to add a profile pic, so should you be able to set an image as the camera feed?12:24
entilmaybe a black image from the camera, empty phone book, empty messages, empty call log12:25
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SK_worktortoisedoc: weired12:55
tortoisedocSK_work : you mean weird? :P12:56
tortoisedocyes it is weird12:56
tortoisedoccause its not even qml errors12:56
tortoisedoc(i have specific handler to log errors but nothing comes out)12:56
tortoisedocits like only some events are processed12:56
tortoisedocbut only very specific ones12:56
tortoisedocand always the same ones12:57
SK_workhum ...12:57
SK_worktortoisedoc: just to be sure, are you starting it as user ?12:58
SK_worknot as root12:58
SK_workfor systemd12:58
tortoisedocsystemd -> dbus -> User=nemo12:58
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Armadillowhat's the best way tu push an array of information into a ListView? Currently I'm appending them calling a function on the page from the DB class, which doesn't look very professionell I think :-/13:09
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Armadillodata comes from LocalStorage13:10
Nicd-the list page should do dataList = DB.getListOfData();13:13
Nicd-then do whatever with the dataList13:14
anandrkrisHi - Just, for my understanding. Other than Maps app, no other native apps can use Location?13:17
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Nicd-they can13:18
Nicd-harbour didn't approve QtPositioning previously but it should now13:19
anandrkrisOkay... I was told by Tweetian developer that 'Attach Location' feature is only in openrepos13:19
Nicd-some apps resort to asking geoclue over dbus and that's how they got into harbour13:19
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anandrkristjc post does not suggest that its already available...released in new SDK perhaps13:21
ArmadilloNicd- thanks, just was confused by myself^^13:22
Nicd-anandrkris: well, that post is really old13:22
Nicd-harbour FAQ says "It will be available for Harbour apps with the software update that introduces Qt 5.2."13:22
Nicd-and we already have Qt 5.213:22
Nicd-maybe someone responsible of harbour / jolla QA can confirm13:22
anandrkrisand close the topic as well13:22
Nicd-harbour FAQ also seems to state python apps are not allowed but they are now13:23
Nicd-who needs up to date documentation anyway?!13:23
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anandrkrislol...maybe many such apps are available only on openrepos for said reason...13:26
Nicd-I wonder who's responsible for harbour nowadays13:26
Stskeepsiekku: ^13:27
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anandrkrisFolks - if this helps, have listed some of regression issues in
Nicd-iekku: summarized for you: harbour is not clear if QtPositioning is allowed. also harbour FAQ states that python is not allowed but someone here said it is13:28
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anandrkrisyes, gpodder already uses python i read13:29
anandrkrisi observed xfade_ also answered couple of harbor related TJC posts :)13:31
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pketolai_as I already mentioned earlier today, the harbour faq will be updated soon :)13:33
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iekkuNicd-, thanks <313:33
Nicd-good :)13:34
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Nicd-there's one simple GPS app I need and might as well submit it to Harbour if I get around to making it some weekend13:35
iekkuNicd-, see conversation starting from 15:05:
iekkuNicd-, i asked to update FAQ  so it's more clear13:38
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Nicd-ok, so QtPositioning is actually not allowed? sad :/ the quote I pasted would imply it is13:39
anandrkrisNicd-: so i was right :)13:41
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iekkui think we had some discussion about that on previous meeting too, let me check13:44
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iekkufrom collaboration meeting 7/1/2015: QtPositioning has gone a step closer, I'll poke the right parties (sorry stemming from past topic, but I know how sore this is)13:46
iekkusaid by sledges13:47
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Nicd-well, I'm not in a rush since my laptop doesn't run the SDK anyway so I'll have to wait till I get a new one :P13:59
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Nicd-I'm still on some old SDK from last summer I think13:59
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sledgesyes, i pinged, i'll ping againl)14:24
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wickwireHi guys, I'm trying to manage power consumption on my app for jolla15:51
wickwirewhich uses sensors15:51
wickwireI've been trying to use nemo-keepalive as a tip15:51
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wickwirefor dealing with states in C++15:51
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wickwireapart from the current code which won't deploy cleanly on a jolla using SailfishOS IDE, does anyone have any other approaches,15:52
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faenilmaybe spiiroin can give you a hint15:53
wickwiresome basepoint I could use to start with the events and then incorporate into my app?15:53
wickwirefaenil: thanks15:53
wickwireas I've been struggling with this, I'd be willing to document any successes with this,15:54
wickwireshould that help everyone else15:54
wickwireat least in not having to spend the time I have/will, if at my level15:54
wickwireas a developer for the platform15:54
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faenilwickwire, I think nemomobile-keepalive repository has at least an example15:59
faenilhave you had a look?15:59
wickwirefaenil: yes, I tried to build the examples but they generally fail on deployment15:59
wickwirethen I found a sailfishOS devel thread15:59
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wickwirewhich had some loose steps on how to do it,16:00
wickwirebut was mostly oriented back to QML16:00
wickwireit seems nemo-keepalive requires libiphb16:01
wickwireI'm not sure if it's included in the jolla OS build16:01
wickwireI've been searching16:01
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wickwireI'm under the notion that I should use Background Activity from nemo-keepalive, based on previous suggestions16:02
faenilI can't help sorry :/16:02
wickwirefaenil: it's ok, I'm not ready to give up just yet16:03
OlpeCan somebody help me with this: [W] unknown:108 - file:///usr/lib/qt5/qml/Sailfish/Silica/Page.qml:108: ReferenceError: __silica_applicationwindow_instance is not defined16:04
wickwirejolla, sailfishos, nemo, mer - so many pieces, I end up not knowing where to ask the questions :p16:04
faenilwickwire, this is the channel for sailfishos app development questions ;)16:04
wickwirefaenil: so at least now I'm at the right place at least ;)16:05
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Olpenow I only see a white screen...16:08
daithefluOlpe: to me that would mean your app doesn't have a window16:09
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Olpefacepalm! I tried opening FirstPage.qml instead of appname.qml where the appwindow was created.16:11
daithefluOlpe: I did the same a few days ago, but I didn't remember the error since I corrected it quite quickly16:11
daithefluglad you solved it :)16:11
SK_workwickwire: what do you mean about sensing ?16:12
SK_workwickwire: for your app do you want to target harbour16:12
SK_workand are your app open-source ?16:12
wickwireSK_work: the app will be open sourced yes, once I get to finish it, like the previous one also is16:13
wickwireI'm reading Accelerometer data16:13
wickwireand proximity sensor data16:13
wickwireusing C++16:13
wickwireand applying filters16:13
SK_workyou want to read it periodically ?16:13
SK_workyou can dynamically / statically build nemo-keepalive from nemomobile16:13
wickwireI would like to stop reading values once the app is running in the background16:13
SK_work(static linking is better)16:14
SK_workwell, if you want this you use ApplicationWindow iirc16:14
SK_worksomething like that16:14
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wickwireSK_work: basically I'd like to fix power consumption when the app is in stand by i.e. with the cover16:14
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kimmoli ??16:15
SK_workwickwire: what kimmoli said ^16:15
wickwireyes, I found and similar for QML16:16
wickwirehowever I ended up developing the sensor reading and filter corrections in C++16:16
wickwireand would like if possible16:16
SK_workwickwire: you can transfer the QML applicationWindow state to C++16:16
wickwireto handle the sensor->start() / ->stop() there16:17
SK_workvia a sort of bridge16:17
SK_worknemo-keepalive won't be useful here16:17
wickwireI thought about emitting a signal from QML16:17
wickwireback to C++16:17
wickwirebut it seemed redundant I thought16:17
wickwireas I was under the impression16:17
wickwirethat if QML knows about the app state16:17
wickwireso should C++...?16:17
wickwireincorrect assumption maybe...?16:18
SK_workwickwire: silica C++ knows the state16:18
SK_workbut we don't have access to C++ silica16:18
SK_workso what we can do at best is to do this bridge back16:18
SK_workeven if it is redundant :(16:18
wickwireSK_work: ok that makes more sense16:18
wickwireno no, that is ok, if there is no other way16:18
kimmolionApplicationActiveChanged: your.qinvokable(applicationActive) ??16:19
wickwireI guess I'm still understanding what is accessible on jolla and what is not16:19
wickwirekimmoli: from what you all have been explaining, then it makes sense to go that way16:19
wickwireand hopefully, the app could be accepted by the jolla QA16:19
wickwirewhich is also something I'd like to ensure16:20
kimmolidid your app got rejected due powerconsumption?16:20
wickwirenot this one, but the previous one did16:20
kimmolibeen there ...16:20
wickwireand it was a redundant animation I had on the cover16:20
wickwirewell I liked it16:20
wickwireanyways, I'd like to be able to stop the elements, I think my notions are clearer now16:21
wickwire<SK_work> wickwire: silica C++ knows the state16:21
wickwire<SK_work> but we don't have access to C++ silica16:21
wickwirethanks to SK_work16:21
wickwireso I will try to handle it like you were suggesting, kimmoli16:22
wickwireif the app gets published in the end,16:22
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wickwireI will document the whole thing - at least these notions of what should be and what is actually available16:22
wickwireunless there's some wiki/reference clearly indicating this issue and I've missed it16:23
wickwirethank you for your help16:23
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daithefluhey guys, I'm kinda sorry to ask this here but does someone know where I could find someone to review code ?16:30
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giucamthat depends on which code it is16:36
daithefluwell I had some issues with a pure QML/JS app that I want to make. SK_work + some others gave me the advice to code my model in C++16:39
daithefluI don't know C++, so basically, this is my first C++ code16:40
lukdirtwalkerdaitheflu: do you have it on github?16:40
daithefluI have a class that inherits from QAbstractListModel, another one for the list items, another one that queries JSON data and the last one does things with a SQLite DB16:41
daitheflulukdirtwalker: it's all there :
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daithefluI'd like all that stuff to be correct before I go on :)16:43
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dpurgindaitheflu, if you want to use a DB table or query as a model, you may use QSqlTableModel or QSqlRelationalTableModel16:45
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daithefludpurgin: my model is a bit more complicated, I have some data that comes from the DB, and some other that it is queried from JSON17:10
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daithefluthanks again for your help and hints, bye !17:26
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King_DuckZhello, today by chance I connected my jolla phone to an ubuntu pc and I noticed it shows up in the notifier widget, but on my gentoo pc it never did that20:32
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King_DuckZany idea of what I need to install/configure to have the phone recognized by the system?20:32
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cryoratKing_DuckZ, lsmod lsusb dmesg20:33
cryoratlook it up :)20:33
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King_DuckZcryorat: I already have those20:34
cryoratdid you find anything useful20:34
cryoratdifference when you connect your phone?20:34
King_DuckZah lol I see what you meant20:34
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King_DuckZI didn't check no, I can do that, but if you have a link to a wiki or some list of dependencies, it would save me lots of time20:35
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tortoisedoc_whats the average memory footprint of an app on sailfishos?20:41
tortoisedoc_(Assuming the app is just a very basic hello world app)20:42
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tortoisedoc_checking with pmap20:57
tortoisedoc_gives me 85 MB for a standard C app20:57
tortoisedoc_does that sound realistic?20:57
tortoisedoc_the most interesting part20:58
tortoisedoc_is also that this standard c app20:58
tortoisedoc_seems to load  libQt5Core20:58
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tortoisedoc_qtcore is dropped ONLY after QT -= core gui is added to the pro file21:03
tortoisedoc_which at that point results in a memory footprint of only 3 MB21:03
tortoisedoc_(byte plus byte minus)21:03
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tortoisedoc_I wonder if Qt pre-loads all modules21:09
tortoisedoc_instead of jit-inserting them into ram?21:09
* tortoisedoc_ wonders if he should head over to qt21:10
r0kk3rztortoisedoc it will load whatever the config item tells it to21:10
r0kk3rzwhich is usually core21:10
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tortoisedoc_r0kk3rz : which config file?21:13
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tortoisedoc_*item as well :P21:14
tortoisedoc_ah you mean config from .pro file21:14
tortoisedoc_but that's the point here21:14
tortoisedoc_i created a plain c project21:14
tortoisedoc_and still qt core and gui are loaded21:15
tortoisedoc_or better pre-loaded21:15
tortoisedoc_(unless I remove them explicitly with QT -= core gui)21:15
tortoisedoc_which itself is ok21:15
tortoisedoc_you just need to know about this21:15
tortoisedoc_but then if you apply this same pre-load pattern to all qt libraries21:15
tortoisedoc_it basically means qt pre-loads all libraries the app is linked against21:16
tortoisedoc_which on low memory devices is kind of a waste..21:17
M4rtinKtortoisedoc_: aren't those shared with all others ?21:17
tortoisedoc_M4rtinK : Its a good point21:18
M4rtinKtortoisedoc_: also don't you need to run it with a booster enabled launcher booster to do that ?21:18
tortoisedoc_apparently not21:18
M4rtinK(scratch one booster)21:18
M4rtinKwell it all goes through Lipstick21:18
tortoisedoc_a simple non-qt app compiled in qtcreator loads qtcore (probably due to bug in qtcreator)21:18
M4rtinKor you could hook it even somewhere lower21:19
tortoisedoc_this is executable runtime mething21:19
tortoisedoc_*methinks as well21:19
tortoisedoc_if you explicitly remove qtcore and qtgui21:19
tortoisedoc_the result will not use more than 3 mb of ram21:19
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r0kk3rztortoisedoc the 'config' line in the pro file21:24
r0kk3rzit might say sailfishapp21:24
r0kk3rzwhat that does is load a file21:25
tortoisedoc_r0kk3rz : i tested with non-sailfish, non-qt app21:25
r0kk3rzwhich contains things like telling it to add qtcore and other things21:25
tortoisedoc_file / new project / non-qt-project21:25
r0kk3rzwhat does it say in config?21:25
tortoisedoc_this is the .pro for the "correct" file21:27
tortoisedoc_(ie stripped of all qt stuff)21:27
tortoisedoc_M4rtinK, thinking of it, pmap might actually include virtual memory into the memory footprint21:27
tortoisedoc_(which would mean shared libraries would count as double)21:27
tortoisedoc_(for pmap)21:28
r0kk3rzyou shouldnt need - gui21:28
r0kk3rzas its already removed in console config21:28
tortoisedoc_r0kk3rz : yes I know :P21:28
r0kk3rzbut core is included21:28
tortoisedoc_it is just a test app to check memory foot print21:28
r0kk3rzas in, that line does nothing21:29
tortoisedoc_you mean the QT -= core and gui21:29
tortoisedoc_ok ill test21:29
r0kk3rzyou need -core, but not -gui21:30
tortoisedoc_r0kk3rz : correct21:33
tortoisedoc_how does the fact that I link in core21:33
tortoisedoc_bloat the memory consumption up to 80 MB?21:34
r0kk3rzbecause it will load a boatload of qt stuff, and the event loop .etc21:35
r0kk3rzqt is also a runtime21:35
tortoisedoc_the point is21:37
tortoisedoc_why does it do this even if its not used21:37
r0kk3rzbecause its told to21:38
r0kk3rzSailfishOS\mersdk\targets\SailfishOS-armv7hl\usr\share\qt5\mkspecs\features\console.prf << this is what the CONFIG += console loads21:38
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r0kk3rzwhich includes core21:39
r0kk3rzif you're not using core, then you obviously shouldnt be linking it in21:39
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tortoisedoc_its not about using or not using core21:40
tortoisedoc_its about the fact that a whole bunch of stuff is loaded by default21:41
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tortoisedoc_independently from the fact that it will be used or not21:41
tortoisedoc_i mean21:41
tortoisedoc_ofc qt crt needs to know what to load if you tell it "use core" via QT += core21:41
tortoisedoc_(which comes from .prf)21:41
tortoisedoc_but at runtime21:41
tortoisedoc_it should load only the strictly necessary modules21:42
tortoisedoc_in a smart ways21:42
tortoisedoc_and not in a pre-caching way (at least not on memory -limited devices)21:42
r0kk3rzso have a whole part of the MOC simply to remove unneeded includes?21:42
tortoisedoc_im talking about runtime not compile time :)21:43
r0kk3rzhow do you know it doesnt?21:44
tortoisedoc_i just did a test app21:44
tortoisedoc_pure c21:44
tortoisedoc_no qt code21:44
tortoisedoc_one main21:44
tortoisedoc_and sleep21:44
tortoisedoc_in version without the QT -= core21:45
r0kk3rzyeah but you cant do runtime voodoo without core21:45
tortoisedoc_pmap -x <pid> gives 80 MB21:45
r0kk3rzwell, no more than straight C21:45
tortoisedoc_in version with the QT -= core21:45
tortoisedoc_it gives about 3 MB21:45
r0kk3rzcore is a bad example is what im saying21:45
tortoisedoc_but core is not only a bad sample21:45
tortoisedoc_its badly engineered  if it eats 80 MB :P21:45
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tortoisedoc_i mean21:46
tortoisedoc_a dyn library21:46
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tortoisedoc_to eat about 80 MB must have alot of stuff in it21:46
tortoisedoc_or am i wrong21:46
r0kk3rzis whats in it21:48
r0kk3rzand the fact that you're using qmake, generally means you want qtcore21:48
r0kk3rzcould it be engineered to be more lightweight? probably21:49
tortoisedoc_i'd almost expose myself and risk to say yes it shoud21:51
tortoisedoc_should :P21:51
r0kk3rzin which case i suggest you go talk to the qt guys about it21:52
tortoisedoc_yes I was pondering about it21:52
r0kk3rzthe source for it should be somewhere21:52
tortoisedoc_removing the QT -= core21:55
tortoisedoc_does not link the test app back with qtore21:55
tortoisedoc_does not link the test app back with qtcore21:55
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tortoisedoc_Jonni : how can I know the real memory consumption of a process22:00
tortoisedoc_(i.e. without shared libraries)22:01
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SaberAltriaQuestion about the sailfishos default pageStack23:41
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SaberAltriaGenerally, swipe from left to right means go backward and pop that page23:42
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SaberAltriais it possible to go backward but not pop the page?23:43
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