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zGrr | 'bry :) | 08:11 |
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nh1402 | PSA: meeting on splitscreen/PiP multitasking on #mer-meeting at 09:00 UTC (32 minutes time) | 08:28 |
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p4prik4 | any plans for a sailfish for PCs? | 18:25 |
r0kk3rz | what for? | 18:25 |
p4prik4 | so jolla can turn a profit | 18:25 |
blop | what would sailfish offer on a pc that a standard linux distro does not | 18:26 |
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p4prik4 | oops I was thinking more something they can offer across linux distros | 18:27 |
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r0kk3rz | so.. you would pay for sfos on desktop? | 18:28 |
p4prik4 | I posted this on reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/7zdov8/to_capture_more_of_the_desktop_market_linux_needs/duns26h/ | 18:29 |
^7heo | r0kk3rz: I wouldn't pay for sfos on smartphone if there was something else than android, ios, and it. | 18:31 |
^7heo | r0kk3rz: the only reason I got sfos is because it's not (android|iOS) | 18:31 |
^7heo | but it still has huge problems, and doesn't really tick any other box on my list. | 18:31 |
tadzik | but there are other things on the desktop | 18:32 |
^7heo | but, well, it's better than nothing; that's for sure. | 18:32 |
^7heo | tadzik: exactly. That's why I would never use sfos on a desktop. | 18:32 |
^7heo | because on my desktop, I have a lot more options that tick a lot more of the boxes on my list. | 18:32 |
tadzik | a waste of resources it not better than nothing | 18:32 |
tadzik | I don't see what sfos on desktop would accomplish | 18:32 |
^7heo | well, unification between devices. | 18:33 |
^7heo | same OS everywhere accross the spectre of devices. | 18:33 |
^7heo | which I understand, would be cool. | 18:33 |
tadzik | oh, sorry, I mistook you for p4prik4 | 18:33 |
^7heo | but not worth it; by any mean. | 18:33 |
tadzik | I'd rather use something else than walled gardens | 18:33 |
^7heo | I'm fine with walled gardens as long as it's something I can audit. | 18:34 |
^7heo | OpenBSD is something I can potentially audit. | 18:34 |
^7heo | anything bigger... | 18:34 |
^7heo | anyway | 18:34 |
p4prik4 | it would be a curated app store was what I was thinking of mostly | 18:34 |
^7heo | and r0kk3rz, sorry, I also mistook you for p4prik4 | 18:35 |
^7heo | but long story short, please don't try to use humans to curate stuff. | 18:36 |
^7heo | please try to make something scalable AND well design for a change. | 18:36 |
^7heo | I know, it's hard to do both | 18:36 |
^7heo | so anyone would likely fail at that | 18:36 |
^7heo | but by trying more we could have more shots at it. | 18:37 |
^7heo | and potentially succeed. | 18:37 |
r0kk3rz | people have been throwing time and money after that idea for years, and nobody has actually succeeded at it | 18:38 |
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r0kk3rz | i really dont think a diaspora of open source hobbyists can create such a beast | 18:39 |
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p4prik4 | By curated mostly just meant that it's a centralized site that gives community tools. like I would even pay/or not mind freeware type things to have access to a place to look up apps under one roof. something close to like alternativeto.net but exclusively for Linux with fewer clicks to search for and download software. curated only in so far as helping you find software. maybe adding recommendations based on your software + sea | 18:48 |
p4prik4 | curate by adding editors choice etc what the Play store does pretty much | 18:49 |
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beidl | the issue afaict with linux in the hands of "average" users lies deep within technical and historical burden. | 18:55 |
r0kk3rz | meh, give me something by programmers for programmers | 18:55 |
beidl | as Linus himself said, ABI stability is hit and miss, and this would require changes in the way all dislocated projects work torwards a common goal | 18:55 |
beidl | r0kk3rz: you already have, sadly your way kills the possibility of consumer friendly Linux a little | 18:56 |
beidl | not trying to start a flamewar by any means | 18:57 |
r0kk3rz | the 'consumers' i know don't want linux anyway | 18:57 |
tadzik | p4prik4: have you seen snap/flatpak? What are your thoughts? | 18:58 |
beidl | sure, I wouldn't just want a kernel either :P | 18:58 |
beidl | *just a kernel | 18:58 |
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r0kk3rz | yeah yeah, you know i mean kernel + userspace :P | 18:59 |
beidl | ofc :) | 18:59 |
beidl | haven't heard of flatpak being talked about as an alternative on sfos for a long time, how's that going? | 19:00 |
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tortoisedoc | hey | 19:03 |
tortoisedoc | can someone tell if there's a way to create carddav accounts from command line? | 19:03 |
tortoisedoc | it so happens my jollac's screen is not reactive precisely on the username field so I cant enter it | 19:03 |
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tortoisedoc | hmhm radio silence.. | 19:07 |
tortoisedoc | there was some vnc app on openrepos iirc.. | 19:07 |
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tadzik | I have no clue :( | 19:09 |
blop | freenx was better than vnc for a while, i had it running on a psion netbook | 19:10 |
p4prik4 | @tadzik ya snaps and flatpak are great and a step in right direction. appimages are a third option (my prefered). but for Linux to go big repositories need to up their game. And I think the new installation formats make this a ripe time for someone to create an APP store | 19:11 |
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tortoisedoc | also hcitool is not available for community device | 19:13 |
tortoisedoc | JollaC that is | 19:13 |
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blop | p4prik4: you're young. you think app store is way to go. it is not. repositories are. | 19:24 |
p4prik4 | I'm speaking on behalf of average joe not me | 19:25 |
tadzik | tbh, as a user, I don't care whether I'm using an appstore or repositories | 19:25 |
tadzik | as long as there's a nice UI in front of it, who cares | 19:25 |
r0kk3rz | p4prik4: and what makes you spokesperson for average joe? what does he have to say about it? | 19:25 |
tadzik | what does that hypothetical appstore provide that our regular repos don't? | 19:25 |
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r0kk3rz | a web ui and pretty downloader app? these things arent mutually exclusive of course | 19:27 |
p4prik4 | its a good question/if not the question. I can answer it... just bit busy. | 19:28 |
beidl | also consider seperation of system and user applications | 19:28 |
p4prik4 | ya r0kk3rz is on the right track | 19:28 |
blop | on the other hand that brings up a point. since the next generation thinks all software comes from an 'appstore'. call the repository front end an 'appstore'. | 19:28 |
blop | like warehouse | 19:28 |
p4prik4 | think of all the conveniences the Playstore brings really | 19:28 |
p4prik4 | ya a repository front end store | 19:29 |
p4prik4 | would work too. point is a company needs to create it though | 19:29 |
beidl | or the community and wait for consensus to never come :P | 19:29 |
p4prik4 | and appimages for linux can be treated very much like apks do for android | 19:29 |
p4prik4 | exactly @beidl | 19:30 |
beidl | p4prik4: appimages are missing separation, permissions though | 19:30 |
p4prik4 | this is why jolla I feel would be well suited for this. | 19:30 |
p4prik4 | For app images just need extra step right. to make executable? | 19:31 |
beidl | I mean like androids permission system. snaps I have to admit are very good at replicating and improving upon those ideas | 19:32 |
p4prik4 | I'm not versed in this, most just trying to ignite a fire here. If snaps way to go then sure. or a combination of formats. its the delivery that has to be less convoluted | 19:35 |
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beidl | don't get me wrong, flatpaks have similar concepts, though not as versatile as in snap packages afaict | 19:41 |
beidl | and I'm pretty sure jolla won't build an app store upon snaps :) | 19:41 |
tadzik | your nickname sounds familiar beidl, have you created some apps? :) | 19:45 |
beidl | tadzik: haha yea | 19:48 |
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tadzik | ah, owncloud! | 19:49 |
tadzik | cheers :) | 19:49 |
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beidl | tadzik: just pushed a new version, in case you use the app :) | 19:51 |
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tadzik | I do! It confuses me recently though. That owncloud daemon that backs things up, is it configurable or visible in the UI anywhere? | 19:52 |
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beidl | tadzik: the settings UI in the main app should show additional options when the daemon is installed | 19:54 |
beidl | I guess you have additional wishes? :) | 19:54 |
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tadzik | ooh | 19:56 |
tadzik | the settings are at the bottom! | 19:56 |
tadzik | that explains a lot of things | 19:56 |
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beidl | tadzik: ding ding ding :P | 19:58 |
beidl | I'd recommend upgrading to the newest version via openrepos as well | 19:59 |
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tadzik | I think I have the newest one, but I don't think the daemon updated | 20:00 |
tadzik | storeman claims that there is an update for it, but when I click on that it can't find it | 20:00 |
tadzik | and I can't find it myself on the website either | 20:00 |
beidl | best to update via cmd line for the moment | 20:01 |
p4prik4 | https://discourse.appimage.org/t/a-discussion-on-the-chmod-x/162/16 <according to this the distribution has to implement a way to allow the app images ask for permissions. | 20:01 |
beidl | p4prik4: you are talking about a different "kind" of permissions | 20:02 |
tadzik | beidl: but where is that daemon? | 20:02 |
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beidl | tadzik: uploaded afaict | 20:05 |
beidl | do you have developer mode activated? | 20:06 |
beidl | devel-su pkcon update harbour-owncloud-daemon | 20:06 |
beidl | just to be sure, beforehand: devel-su pkcon refresh force | 20:06 |
tadzik | ah, it did install alright (I removed it before to see if it'll change anything) | 20:08 |
tadzik | it still confuses my why it doesn't show on openrepos.net | 20:08 |
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beidl | tadzik: dey don wont tha app tah win, mane! :P | 20:17 |
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tadzik | :o | 20:18 |
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