07:00:02 <rainemak> #startmeeting Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 5th June 2025 07:00:02 <sailbot> Meeting started Thu Jun 5 07:00:02 2025 UTC. The chair is rainemak. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 07:00:02 <sailbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic. 07:00:12 <rainemak> #info Meeting information and agenda can be found here: 07:00:13 <rainemak> #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/community-meeting-on-5th-june-2025/23265 07:00:13 <rainemak> I am the meeting's chairperson today, and will be doing my best to keep time and order. Please respect the timings and bee-hive. 07:00:13 <rainemak> #topic Brief introduction (5 min). Please prefix your name/handle with #info 07:00:25 <rainemak> #info Raine Mäkeläinen, Jolla 07:00:50 <ExTechOp> #info Otto Mäkelä, community 07:01:18 <yusssufff> #info Yusssufff, community 07:01:29 <direc85[m]> #info Matti Viljanen, Jolla 07:04:21 <rainemak> We have two topics today. Next roadmap checkpoint will be in two weeks (19th June). I'm reserving today 10mins for the next meeting scheduling so that we have time to discuss there. 07:04:34 <flypig> #info David Llewellyn-Jones, community 07:04:45 <rainemak> hi flypig 07:04:51 <flypig> Hello! 07:05:00 <rainemak> let's get going 07:05:05 <rainemak> #topic State of jack audio with latest Sony binaries / blobs v6a (Xperia IV and V) (5 mins -- yusssufff) 07:05:10 <rainemak> #info <yusssufff> Wishing to know if with latest blobs v6a the audio jack is 07:05:10 <rainemak> #info <yusssufff> now working (camera works as already shared in latest meeting) 07:05:28 <rainemak> <Jolla> Getting audio jack working should not have anything to do with the blobs. 07:05:28 <rainemak> <Jolla> It should be about Android audio configuration xml. We had a semi 07:05:28 <rainemak> <Jolla> well-working version of audio routing changes whilst back but we have not 07:05:28 <rainemak> <Jolla> had time to finalize it. 07:07:25 <yusssufff> Okay! thanks for the enlightenment. 07:09:28 <rainemak> audio routing things make it also harder to move away from pulseaudio towards pipewire 07:10:11 <rainemak> next topic 07:10:12 <rainemak> #topic Releasing licence for Xperia V and IV before VoLTE work is ironed? (5mins -- yusssufff) 07:10:21 <rainemak> #info <yusssufff> In the May 8 community meeting, it was answered to the question 07:10:21 <rainemak> #info <yusssufff> “Is there any progress on the Sony Xperia 10V firmware / binary 07:10:21 <rainemak> #info <yusssufff> blobs update?” that “07:16:43 <rainemak> ExTechOp, Not too much 07:10:21 <rainemak> #info <yusssufff> to say. With newest blobs camera works but there are still work 07:10:21 <rainemak> #info <yusssufff> needed with GPS, NFC, sensors and VoLTE... And VoLTE is the 07:10:23 <rainemak> #info <yusssufff> tricky one. This due to that HIDL ↔ AIDL changes that happened #info <yusssufff> same time.” 07:10:37 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> What kind of license you're expecting? If you're thinking about 07:10:37 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> perpetual (one time fee license), let's see what makes sense. That 07:10:37 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> said, we have enabled AppSupport already for Xperia 10 IV and 10 V. 07:10:37 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> To compensate the delays, we offer to discount the subsription fees 07:10:37 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> for the first 6 months for any orders made by end of June. 07:10:39 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> Using device without VoLTE is not too feasible. 07:10:57 <rainemak> #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/enabling-appsupport-for-sony-xperia-10-iv-and-10-v/22541 07:11:59 <yusssufff> Okay, yes when speaking of "licence", i meant like non beta version of Sailfish for V and IV 07:12:14 <rainemak> There will be tons of complains regarding quality if we'd have license available without VoLTE 07:13:23 <rainemak> If we would not have GPS, NFC, sensors and VoLTE, it's pretty much beta I think 07:13:54 <rainemak> yusssufff, from your point of view what would be the trigger to move out of beta? 07:15:07 <rainemak> It's the same Sailfish OS version that we available for all supported devices (5.0.0.67). 07:15:26 <rainemak> extending topic by 5mins 07:16:12 <rainemak> It's the same Sailfish OS version that we have available for all supported devices (5.0.0.67). 07:16:30 <yusssufff> Hum out of beta would mean for me functionning Audio Jack, Camera, and ironned issues such as the "known issues" published for Xperia V and IV in latest release notes of sailfish 5 (similar to the first betas on sailfish 4 actually for those models..) 07:16:42 <ExTechOp> Can you detail a bit what progress HAS been made on this project (Sony Xperia 10IV and 10V)? 07:18:21 <rainemak> yusssufff, those API/ABI breaks that were there between blob updates require work. Let's see how it turns out to be. 07:18:22 <yusssufff> issues (but you know them) where such (and kind of justified beta i guess?): Camera is disabled Fingerprint detection does not work on Xperia 10 V; hence removed from the UI Battery status doesn’t update (it does by restarting the phone) on Xperia 10 V eSIM support is not yet implemented; hence the eSIM slot is disabled Avoid using the Flight mode as the phone loses the SIM card Restarting the phone may last up to 07:19:16 <rainemak> ExTechOp, not much lately but it's still there 07:19:45 <rainemak> and July probably even calmer due to summer time 07:19:46 <yusssufff> rainemak Okay sure, good work then :). I wondered just if the VoLTE was the one that was the most time consuming, if that could b edelayed to a later fix. 07:20:24 <yusssufff> But i understand the wish to avoid complains from the community if VoLTE isnt released at the same time 07:20:30 <flypig> It sounds like you were thinking about prioritisation yusssufff? 07:20:36 <rainemak> yusssufff, ExTechOp : how this gave a bit better understanding of the state 07:20:52 <yusssufff> Yes flypig 07:21:00 <rainemak> yusssufff, ExTechOp : hope this gave a bit better understanding of the state 07:21:33 <rainemak> eSIM is not implement in Sailfish OS -> surely won't be implemented soon 07:22:08 <flypig> I agree yusssufff, if there's low-hanging fruit, I'd be happy to see progress on those too (but I don't know if these other aspects actually are low hanging!) 07:22:15 <ExTechOp> Is there even an outline of a schedule? 07:22:54 <yusssufff> Yep sure, esim is irrelevant... But a first release with Camera+Audio Jack+GPs+Batterystatus could be very usable i would have personally tought VoLTE/NFC could wait for later fix... 07:23:22 <rainemak> extending another 5mins 07:23:31 <rainemak> two mins left 07:24:02 <rainemak> yusssufff, noted... then the battery draining is one which you did not mention 07:24:33 <yusssufff> yes and the airplane mode loosing simcard. 07:25:02 <rainemak> yusssufff, and there is good amount of other things 07:25:18 <yusssufff> Those 'basic' functions would make a nice working device already, enough to wait few more month for NFC and VolTE (for my opinion) 07:25:43 <rainemak> yusssufff, we should be able to live with some airplane mode issues... as long as those are recoverable 07:26:06 <rainemak> yusssufff, in Finland VoLTE starts to be must have 07:26:38 <yusssufff> Yeah i know, especially with Elisa... 07:26:59 <rainemak> these kind of things are matter of prioritization 07:27:10 <rainemak> yusssufff, also with Telia 07:27:15 <yusssufff> But overall my comment was to propose that maybe a "second beta" could be nice lets say, with some little improovements, if the non beta seems to arrive after summer... 07:27:34 <direc85[m]> there's no 3G at all in Finland any more 07:28:30 <yusssufff> I still have some 3G with DNA in lapland...But maybe irrelevant to the discussion :) 07:28:52 <rainemak> yusssufff, we're hearing you. Thank you for your input. 07:29:01 <rainemak> and surely others as well 07:29:07 <yusssufff> Welcome! Thanks for the hard work! 07:29:17 <rainemak> #topic Open PR discussion (5 mins -- asked by Jolla) 07:29:37 <rainemak> I'm not seeing dcaliste 07:29:42 <rainemak> I don't have any 07:30:59 <rainemak> anybody else any PRs that you'd like to discuss? 07:33:22 <rainemak> sounds that we move forward 07:33:24 <rainemak> #topic General discussion (10 mins) 07:35:45 <yusssufff> Maybe i have a little question here, is topics are now free: when flashing devices, some users (Olf) insist that we shall flash with 'latest fix' of the android version (ex latest fix of android 11), while Jolla doesnt seem to write it as such an important thing 07:36:43 <yusssufff> On jolla documentation i usually read the version of android wished for flashing (eg 11), but no insistance of updating to tha latest android 11 fix from within android before flashing 07:37:14 <yusssufff> I dont know how clear are my words, i hope its understandable... 07:37:48 <rainemak> yusssufff, there are two things. One is the Android OS version before flashing and another more important is the Android blob version 07:38:13 <yusssufff> Yep. I am not speaking of the blob here 07:38:23 <yusssufff> Just the OS version before flashing 07:38:33 <rainemak> I just want to write this down... as other may not know 07:39:31 <yusssufff> Oh okay yes sure. Thanks. So i wonder Iif technically that makes 'any sense' to actually upgrade to the 'latest fix' of the needed android version, of if thats just OCD and irrelevant :) 07:39:32 <rainemak> using "randomly" newer Android vendor blobs might work but it may also break bad as that specific hybrid-based Sailfish OS adaptation is build against Android xyz 07:40:31 <rainemak> updated Android OS before flashing to the latest let's say Android 11 is perfectly ok. 07:41:34 <yusssufff> I see, so its perfectly okay, but does it makes any difference with flahshing on the lets say in that case the first verison release of Android 11? 07:41:58 <rainemak> using Android OS (for example starting modem or GPS) may write some states to the hw causing changes from user to user. 07:43:14 <rainemak> my gut feeling is that some GPS related observations from community members are exactly due to above 07:45:14 <rainemak> yusssufff, I don't think makes too much of a difference given that the Sailfish OS adaptation itself is working 07:46:09 <rainemak> yusssufff, but as a rule of thumb updating to the latest version of Android 11 when Android 11 is recommended is good 07:47:16 <rainemak> I'd like to ask about this time slot 07:47:44 <flypig> The timeslot for the fortnightly meeting? 07:47:45 <rainemak> It has been very nice to hear new voices over here every-now-and-then. I think we could attract more community members by adjusting the time. Asked this topic in the newsletter last week but no week feedback. 07:48:00 <rainemak> flypig, yeap 07:48:16 <rainemak> we could cover that discussion on the scheduling as well 07:48:26 <yusssufff> Okay. Thank you for the insight. So I guess flashing Sailfish mostly makes a difference when on different android versions (11/12) but the fix within the version may not matter much to Sailfish flashing 07:49:38 <rainemak> We have had 7 am UTC for quite some time... Should try for example 5:00 PM CET? Meaning 3PM UTC 07:50:01 <Nico> Yeah, the meeting is currently like 20 minutes before I get up and when I have a work meeting scheduled. Later would be nice :D 07:50:27 <rainemak> ^ I guess we can have this discussion on the general 07:50:36 <flypig> I'm personally very happy with the time as it is, but I'm certain that whatever time is chosen, there will be a bunch of people who are excluded because they can't make it then. 07:50:44 <rainemak> Nico, so 5 PM CET would be better for you 07:51:04 <Nico> rainemak, yes, or even just 1h later :) 07:51:24 <rainemak> flypig, that's true but many are working. Thus, cannot participate 07:51:32 <flypig> Yes, I agree. 07:52:15 <rainemak> I'm also flexible on having this meeting at evening 6 or 7 HKI time 07:52:24 <Nico> Well, one day I will just get up early enough... 07:52:25 <rainemak> ^ pm that is 07:52:55 <rainemak> ExTechOp, you're usually participating. Would evening slots work for you 07:53:06 <ExTechOp> Just as well, thanks. 07:53:12 <rainemak> how about direc85[m] ? 07:53:32 <direc85[m]> that works for me as well 07:53:50 <rainemak> let's move to scheduling 07:53:57 <rainemak> #topic Next meeting time and date (5 mins) 07:55:05 <rainemak> Should we give try like 6:00 PM CET. That would be like 7:00 PM HKI time, 6:00 PM in Germany, 5:00 PM in UK, and so on. 07:55:48 <flypig> I like that, personally. 07:56:23 <rainemak> sorry 8PM HKI that is 07:56:25 <Nico> Sounds good to me to try it at least :) 07:56:40 <direc85[m]> that sounds good 07:56:54 <direc85[m]> 8PM also works fine 07:58:21 <flypig> This is an exciting change :) It must have been in the morning for 5, maybe 10 years or even longer? 07:58:45 <rainemak> yeap 07:59:26 <rainemak> let's test first something and adjust as needed 07:59:31 <rainemak> Proposing Thursday 19th June at 04:00 PM UTC 07:59:35 <rainemak> #info Proposing Thursday 19th June at 04:00 PM UTC 08:00:32 <rainemak> 5PM UK, 6PM DE, 7PM HKI, 08:01:48 <direc85[m]> lgtm 08:01:52 <flypig> +1 08:02:17 <rainemak> #info Next meeting will be held on Thursday 19th June 2025 at 04:00pm UTC: 2025-06-19T1600Z 08:02:49 <rainemak> have a great rest of the week! thank you all! 08:03:02 <rainemak> #endmeeting