================================================================================= #sailfishos-meeting: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 6th November 2025 ================================================================================= Meeting started by rainemak at 16:00:00 UTC. The full logs are available at https://irclogs.sailfishos.org/meetings/sailfishos-meeting/2025/sailfishos-meeting.2025-11-06-16.00.log.html . Meeting summary --------------- * Meeting information and agenda can be found here: (rainemak, 16:00:00) * LINK: https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/25254 (rainemak, 16:00:00) * Brief introduction (5 min). Please prefix your name/handle with #info (rainemak, 16:00:00) * Raine Mäkeläinen, Jolla (rainemak, 16:00:11) * Peter G., Community (nephros, 16:00:56) * Otto Mäkelä, community (ExTechOp, 16:01:08) * Matti Viljanen, Jolla (direc85[m], 16:01:16) * mal, Jolla (mal, 16:01:58) * 247, community member (legacychimera247, 16:03:25) * Jolla C2 order backlog (5 mins -- frankps) (rainemak, 16:05:01) * Could Jolla give us an update on the backlog situation? Estimated (rainemak, 16:05:06) * shipping time October 1st was 6-8 weeks. Where are we now? When #info will you start shipping out ordered devices? (rainemak, 16:05:06) * This is covered by https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/25420 (rainemak, 16:05:11) * (rainemak, 16:05:11) * A manufacturing slot for the next production batch Q4/25 of Jolla (rainemak, 16:05:11) * C2 has been confirmed to take place at the week Nov 17, 2025. (rainemak, 16:05:11) * Following from there we should be able to continue shipments by the (rainemak, 16:05:11) * end of November. (rainemak, 16:05:12) * (rainemak, 16:05:14) * Let’s have open discussion. (rainemak, 16:05:16) * LINK: https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/25420 (rainemak, 16:05:18) * GTK support (10 mins -- pherjung) (rainemak, 16:10:00) * The Librem 5 supports an increasing number of GTK apps. While (rainemak, 16:10:00) * they do not adhere to Sailfish OS UI/UX guidelines, they are (rainemak, 16:10:00) * Linux apps and would increase the number of apps available on (rainemak, 16:10:00) * Sailfish OS. Are there any plans to support GTK, and how much (rainemak, 16:10:00) * effort would it take? (rainemak, 16:10:02) * Thank for this good question. Sorry for the long answer. (rainemak, 16:10:23) * (rainemak, 16:10:23) * The problem behind the scene is that we’re lacking xdg-shell (rainemak, 16:10:23) * support from Qt. Thus, also from our compositor (lipstick). (rainemak, 16:10:23) * Implementing xdg-shell support would be a good starting point and (rainemak, 16:10:23) * then we should have means to support other toolkits than Qt for app (rainemak, 16:10:25) * development. (rainemak, 16:10:27) * (rainemak, 16:10:29) * Some years back we started a project to split homescreen (lipstick) (rainemak, 16:10:31) * properly to a homescreen and a wayland compositor. Why to split? (rainemak, 16:10:33) * Mostly due to robustness and performance. Composition and gestures (rainemak, 16:10:35) * should never stall. Also freezes or crashes on homescreen should (rainemak, 16:10:37) * not affect to the other applications. Eventually this project (rainemak, 16:10:39) * didn’t materialize. With this project we could have received also (rainemak, 16:10:41) * xdg-shell support. (rainemak, 16:10:43) * (rainemak, 16:10:45) * We should try to think out-of-the-box, try to find other possible (rainemak, 16:10:47) * solutions and use existing projects when possible. Then comes (rainemak, 16:10:51) * projects like Weston. A Wayland compositor that is broadly used. (rainemak, 16:10:53) * Thus, it would have more developers working on it when comparing to (rainemak, 16:10:55) * us (Jolla & Sailfish Community). (rainemak, 16:10:57) * (rainemak, 16:10:59) * Conceptually we could have a Weston compositor and the “current” (rainemak, 16:11:01) * homescreen as a wayland client (an app among the other apps). On (rainemak, 16:11:03) * the compositor side we should deal for example window management, (rainemak, 16:11:05) * shell, gestures and effects with very limited dependencies. Surely, (rainemak, 16:11:07) * there are also things like text input support. (rainemak, 16:11:09) * (rainemak, 16:11:11) * If all this would happen, then we should also be very close to a (rainemak, 16:11:13) * situation where we actually could have support for other toolkits (rainemak, 16:11:15) * (easily or relatively easily) for example for GTK. Surely, changing (rainemak, 16:11:17) * compositor architecture would be most bigger task than implementing (rainemak, 16:11:21) * xdg-shell support for the current compositor. (rainemak, 16:11:23) * LINK: https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/wayland/weston (rainemak, 16:11:38) * dodoradio, community/asteroidos (dodoradio[m], 16:15:22) * pherjung, community (pherjung[m], 16:29:53) * Sony Xperia 10 IV/V port status (10mins -- ExTechOp) (rainemak, 16:32:32) * A functional Sony device port has now been “real soon now” since (rainemak, 16:32:32) * Love Day 2 in August 2024, but they still suffer from serious (rainemak, 16:32:32) * issues because of Sony binary blobs. Also, a Jolla announcement (rainemak, 16:32:33) * on the status of the Sony devices port has now been teased for (rainemak, 16:32:33) * months, but even this hasn’t materialized. This is just getting (rainemak, 16:32:34) * embarrassing. Please put out an official statement outlining (rainemak, 16:32:36) * some kind of time scale when things will begin to happen, or (rainemak, 16:32:38) * just admit it’s never happening. If all this fails, at least (rainemak, 16:32:40) * give a time scale when you’ll be able to clarify things. (rainemak, 16:32:42) * We fully acknowledge, we have promised to deliver Sailfish to (rainemak, 16:32:46) * Xperia 10 IV/V and we remain committed to do our part with it as (rainemak, 16:32:46) * far it takes and what can be feasibly done by us. By far, not all (rainemak, 16:32:48) * can be done by us and with the currently chosen approach there has (rainemak, 16:32:52) * been several unexpected up and downs in this project e.g. with the (rainemak, 16:32:54) * vendor blobs: there has been blocker issues with battery indication (rainemak, 16:32:56) * missing, camera not working, VoLTE not working and fingerprint (rainemak, 16:32:58) * missing. (rainemak, 16:33:00) * (rainemak, 16:33:02) * Maybe we have totally wrong approach with the adaptation software (rainemak, 16:33:04) * of this particular device project? Maybe it shouldn’t be done (rainemak, 16:33:06) * primarily by Jolla and using the Open Device Program vendor blobs? (rainemak, 16:33:08) * (rainemak, 16:33:10) * We have also been thinking about completely different approaches by (rainemak, 16:33:12) * enabling this thru an “officially supported community port” - (rainemak, 16:33:14) * community port and we enable AppSupport to it – would that work for (rainemak, 16:33:16) * the community? (rainemak, 16:33:18) * (rainemak, 16:33:22) * What is the definition of done in this project? What do you think (rainemak, 16:33:24) * should be done to call it ready for the expected use? (rainemak, 16:33:26) * (rainemak, 16:33:28) * E.g. fingerprint – won’t be done, other examples? (rainemak, 16:33:30) * Security patch level updates of the Android runtime (10 mins -- balta) (rainemak, 16:50:01) * Google releases monthly security patches for Android, but sadly (rainemak, 16:50:06) * these are never applied to the android app support runtime of (rainemak, 16:50:06) * SailfishOS. You can check your security patch level in Settings → (rainemak, 16:50:06) * Android App Support. As these patches contain security fixes they (rainemak, 16:50:06) * should be included regularly in SailfishOS updates as well. Right (rainemak, 16:50:06) * now on the 10V the level is from August of 2024, I think on older (rainemak, 16:50:08) * devices this will be even older. Also some apps will check this and (rainemak, 16:50:09) * refuse to start, e.g. I cannot use Teams for my job right now (rainemak, 16:50:11) * because of a too old security patch level. Is this a big effort for (rainemak, 16:50:13) * Jolla to provide an update or is it something like simply (rainemak, 16:50:15) * triggering a CI chain? (rainemak, 16:50:17) * AppSupport security patch level is usually updated on bigger (rainemak, 16:50:30) * releases (4.5. ,4.6., 5.0...). Currently we are working on (rainemak, 16:50:30) * AppSupport 13 security patch level update. Unfortunately, (rainemak, 16:50:30) * AppSupport 11 no longer receive security patch level updates from (rainemak, 16:50:30) * AOSP and it is currenty using the latest patch level. All in all, (rainemak, 16:50:31) * it’s not a simple as triggering a CI chain. When going forward we (rainemak, 16:50:33) * should think whether we could / should update AppSupport security (rainemak, 16:50:35) * patch level also upon hotfix updates (when an update is available (rainemak, 16:50:37) * and integrated). (rainemak, 16:50:39) * How shall we deal with trolls in the forum (10 mins -- Fellfrosch) (rainemak, 16:56:29) * Trolls quite often ruin a discussion in the forum. It is quite (rainemak, 16:56:29) * easy for them to do so, because threads get blocked when they (rainemak, 16:56:29) * get flagged. This is stopping quite often good and helpful (rainemak, 16:56:29) * conversation. So the question is how do we want to deal with (rainemak, 16:56:30) * this problem in future. For me the better solution instead of (rainemak, 16:56:31) * freezing threads would be temporary bans for people who (rainemak, 16:56:33) * misbehave and don’t cling to the forum rules. (rainemak, 16:56:35) * I already started a thread about that problem here: (rainemak, 16:56:37) * Please stop closing threads because of trolls (rainemak, 16:56:39) * LINK: https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/25369 (rainemak, 16:56:41) * Let’s have an open discussion on this. (rainemak, 16:56:43) * Starting point could be Sailfish OS Forum FAQ. (rainemak, 16:56:45) * LINK: https://forum.sailfishos.org/faq (rainemak, 16:56:47) * Open Pull Requests (PRs) to discussion (5 mins -- asked by Jolla) (rainemak, 17:16:04) * General discussion (10 mins or something) (rainemak, 17:22:51) * Next meeting time and date (2 mins) (rainemak, 17:32:40) * Next meeting will be held on Thursday 20th November 2025 at 04:00pm UTC: 2025-11-20T1600Z (rainemak, 17:34:26) Meeting ended at 17:35:19 UTC. Action Items ------------ Action Items, by person ----------------------- * **UNASSIGNED** * (none) People Present (lines said) --------------------------- * rainemak (216) * dcaliste (18) * ExTechOp (12) * pherjung[m] (12) * nephros (10) * abr (10) * mal (9) * legacychimera247 (9) * dodoradio[m] (5) * direc85[m] (3) * sailbot (2) * Keto (2) * roundedrectangl (1) Generated by `MeetBot`_ 0.1.4 .. _`MeetBot`: http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot