16:00:01 <rainemak> #startmeeting Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 12th March 2026
16:00:01 <sailbot> Meeting started Thu Mar 12 16:00:01 2026 UTC. The chair is rainemak. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
16:00:01 <sailbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
16:00:01 <rainemak> #info Meeting information and agenda can be found here:
16:00:01 <rainemak> #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/27976
16:00:01 <rainemak> I am the meeting's chairperson today, and will be doing my best to keep time and order. Please respect the timings and bee-hive.
16:00:01 <rainemak> #topic Brief introduction (5 min). Please prefix your name/handle with #info
16:00:22 <direc85[m]> Hello!
16:00:46 <ExTechOp> #info Otto Mäkelä, community
16:01:30 <sebix[m]> #info sebix, community
16:01:37 <rainemak> #info Raine Mäkeläinen, Jolla
16:01:41 <mettska> #info mettska, community
16:01:42 <mal> #info mal, Jolla
16:01:52 <Keto> #info Pami Ketolainen, Jolla
16:02:04 <direc85[m]> #info Matti Viljanen, Jolla
16:02:12 <rainemak> We have 4 topics today. Thank you all for posting questions.
16:03:22 <rubdos[m]> #info Ruben De Smet, community
16:03:37 <dcaliste> #info Damien Caliste, community
16:05:07 <rainemak> alright, let's get started
16:05:08 <rainemak> #topic Unable to set lock pin for Android apps (10 mins -- CLMA31)
16:05:17 <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> This is for sure well known topic for Jolla. And this has
16:05:17 <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> probably been asked already more than once… But hey, one
16:05:17 <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> more? :) I raise this topic again as it might be
16:05:17 <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> problematic/shock for many new comers with the Jolla phone.
16:05:17 <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> There has been some finding done by the community which helps to
16:05:19 <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> mitigate problem in some apps: Unable to set lock pin for
16:05:20 <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> Android apps requiring it - #77 by nick8325 & Unable to set lock
16:05:22 <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> pin for Android apps requiring it - #61 by nekron . You have
16:05:24 <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> probably seen these already, but I wanted to raise this topic
16:05:26 <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> again in case there is some plans regarding this? I am
16:05:28 <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> personally in high hopes that fixing this would allow me to use
16:05:30 <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> for example Microsoft Authenticator, but for many this could
16:05:32 <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> make it possible to use more banking apps etc.
16:05:34 <rainemak> #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/unable-to-set-lock-pin-for-android-apps-requiring-it/15806/77
16:05:37 <rainemak> #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/unable-to-set-lock-pin-for-android-apps-requiring-it/15806/61
16:05:40 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> Thank you CLMA31. Yes, this is well-known by Jolla.  Let's see if
16:05:42 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> & when we have a chance to work on this. As you may understand,
16:05:44 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> there are a lot of different kind of things that we could/should
16:05:48 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> be working.
16:11:52 <sebix[m]> Understandable. Would it be possible to share the current projects that Jolla is working on? Could give some transparency and understanding from the community
16:12:49 <rainemak> Jolla Phone, Camera 2 API, A-GPS, EAS, AppSupport Bluetooth, Startup Wizard improvements ... to name few
16:13:44 <rainemak> and 5.0 update release was one of the topics that we just released
16:14:32 <mal> and the other bigger updates like systemd and pulseaudio are also in the list
16:14:34 <rainemak> sebix[m], honestly, regarding Jolla Phone I dare to say that we have max'ed out the transparency
16:14:44 <rainemak> mal, thanks for adding
16:15:43 <rainemak> alright, time to move on
16:16:01 <rainemak> #topic New customers vs. returning fans on the Jolla Phone (10 mins -- asked by rubdos)
16:16:01 <rainemak> #info <rubdos> The Jolla phone sales are a great success, and the second batch
16:16:01 <rainemak> #info <rubdos> seems to fly out of the window like hot cakes as well.
16:16:01 <rainemak> #info <rubdos> Congratulations! I’ve seen various mentions on X today of new
16:16:01 <rainemak> #info <rubdos> people joining the Sailfish OS community, through buying the new
16:16:01 <Nico> I think the phone still isn't see-through, so clearly it could be more transparent!
16:16:03 <rainemak> #info <rubdos> device. This is great news! As an app-developer, I want to be a
16:16:04 <rainemak> #info <rubdos> bit prepared for the influx of new users. It made me wonder:
16:16:06 <rainemak> #info <rubdos> what is the fraction of returning Sailfish OS fans versus new
16:16:08 <rainemak> #info <rubdos> Sailfish OS users?
16:16:10 <rainemak> #info <rubdos>
16:16:12 <rainemak> #info <rubdos> I suspect that the existence of Whisperfish (sub for any popular
16:16:14 <rainemak> #info <rubdos> app!) could be a driving factor for the new influx. If there are
16:16:18 <rainemak> #info <rubdos> approximately (lets say) 5000 new Sailfish OS users, and they
16:16:20 <rainemak> #info <rubdos> all start using Whisperfish the minute that their phones arrive…
16:16:22 <rainemak> #info <rubdos> I’m going to have to take a month off of work for support (and I
16:16:24 <rainemak> #info <rubdos> probably will), and another month before the first shipments to
16:16:26 <rainemak> #info <rubdos> polish the app (to thwart the bug reports, and I probably will).
16:16:28 <rainemak> #info <rubdos> So my question: can Jolla share any estimates with the
16:16:30 <rainemak> #info <rubdos> community?
16:16:32 <rainemak> #link https://jolla.com/phone
16:16:41 <rainemak> nope not see-through but close if you print your own other half :-)
16:17:22 <rainemak> now it's The Orange, Snow White and Kaamos Black
16:17:54 <rainemak> info <Jolla> Let's first clarify what do you mean by retuning. In our books we
16:17:54 <rainemak> info <Jolla> do consider customers who were using original Jolla Phone (2014)
16:17:54 <rainemak> info <Jolla> but were not using since as new customers not returning customers.
16:17:54 <rainemak> info <Jolla> A lot of things have changed since.
16:17:54 <rainemak> info <Jolla>
16:17:55 <rainemak> info <Jolla> There will be tons of new customers that is for sure. Whether new
16:17:57 <rainemak> info <Jolla> customers finds Whisperfish easily is another question. It would
16:17:59 <rainemak> info <Jolla> be wonderful if it would be available in the Jolla Store.
16:19:15 <rainemak> rubdos[m], any case there will be thousands of new customers however you calculate or define a new customer
16:22:18 <rubdos[m]> So I definitely need to take some time off to polish ;)
16:23:06 <rainemak> Be graceful for yourself. There's also Android Signal app available.
16:23:17 <rainemak> certainly native is always native
16:23:49 <rubdos[m]> What is the timeline again? Early summer?
16:24:20 <rainemak> We have estimated to start of shipments of the batch #1 by end of June 2026 (1H/26)
16:25:13 <rubdos[m]> Let's make it happen then. Harbour, here we come!
16:25:44 <rainemak> Hehe, I love your style !
16:26:37 <rainemak> We need to also check that community created guideline / tutorial app
16:26:48 <ExTechOp> It would be great if more applications could be moved to the official Jolla store or at least to Chum. Could Chum be in the official Jolla store?
16:26:57 <rubdos[m]> With a drill in my left hand and an xperia in the right, you mean?
16:26:59 <Keto> And to be honest, we have not done any direct cross-refrencing between the new phone sales and existing sailfish users, But based on the raw totals, the guestimate is that there is a lot of new users :)
16:27:46 <rainemak> Keto, to complement that, we don't start digging those all datas
16:27:54 <rainemak> Keto, to complement that, we don't start digging those old datas
16:28:58 <rainemak> 1 minute for this
16:29:50 <rainemak> let's move on
16:29:53 <rainemak> #topic Plans for Treat Mobile as WiFi for 10 III AAS (10 mins -- asked by teleshoes)
16:29:53 <rainemak> #info <teleshoes> This crucial feature fixes a very long-standing, painful bug
16:29:53 <rainemak> #info <teleshoes> /defect, but only for C2. The new Android13 AAS finally
16:29:53 <rainemak> #info <teleshoes> coming to 10 III in 5.0.0.73 sadly did not include this
16:29:53 <rainemak> #info <teleshoes> feature, which was a surprise at least to me. Fixing the
16:29:54 <rainemak> #info <teleshoes> network detection and the IP/routing issues in android would
16:29:56 <rainemak> #info <teleshoes> be wonderful of course, but as a stop-gap for the next 4
16:29:58 <rainemak> #info <teleshoes> years, this solution is nearly ideal. This topic is purely
16:30:00 <rainemak> #info <teleshoes> about asking when this feature is coming to 10 III, or making
16:30:02 <rainemak> #info <teleshoes> the case for the importance of it if it is not planned.
16:30:04 <rainemak> #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/release-notes-tampella-5-0-0-76-early-access/28285/20
16:30:06 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> “Treat mobile data as WLAN” requires more work on the AppSupport
16:30:08 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> integration side. Hopefully that is not too overwhelming amount
16:30:10 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> of work and we get it to all supported devices
16:30:12 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> eventually -- crossed fingers.
16:32:42 <ExTechOp> I'm looking at the question on the forum, and it does not seem to link to the "very long-standing, painful bug / defect", what are we talking about here?
16:33:56 <rainemak> There's toggle in Jolla C2 that allows you to treat mobile data as wlan ap towards AppSupport
16:34:12 <rainemak> ^ helps with all sorts weird connectivity issues
16:34:33 <rainemak> Surely, the real fix would be something else
16:35:05 <mal> the connection issue being that moving between mobile network and wlan can sometimes cause connection to stop working in appsupport
16:35:18 <ExTechOp> I believe I've seen this.
16:35:28 <rainemak> personally I have nowadays that toggle always on as here in Finland we do need to care about mobile data usage as they are in practice all flat rate plans
16:35:50 <ExTechOp> (I've always hated how Android phones have a checkbox for "update apps only on wifi", and unchecking it does absolutely nothing, you still have to manually run updates)
16:35:52 <mal> *do not need to care
16:35:57 <sebix[m]> On XA2 switching from mobile network to Wifi does not work in android apps
16:36:15 <rainemak> mal, thank you for correcting
16:37:01 <rainemak> s/in Finland we do need to care/in Finland we do not need to care/
16:37:32 <direc85[m]> Unless it's a prepaid SIM :)
16:37:39 <mal> yes
16:38:18 <sebix[m]> rainemak: in  some cases maybe. Still the downloading and syncing will make everything else slower. Especially in rural areas or abroad
16:40:48 <ExTechOp> There also seems to be a very-long standing issue that Android applications (like Signal) can make the whole OS crash if you go completely out of connectivity, but I don't recall it ever being mentioned anywhere.
16:41:01 <rainemak> certainly there are cases... it's also quite common here in Finland that even the Wlan boxes are backed by 4G/5G SIM card -> especially in rural areas -> wouldn't make any different what do you use
16:41:42 <rainemak> ExTechOp, let's take that in the general section at the end
16:41:51 <rainemak> #topic Unified Attestation (5 mins -- asked by Cryx)
16:41:51 <rainemak> #info <Cryx> see linked topic… Is Jolla aware of this new initiative, may it be
16:41:51 <rainemak> #info <Cryx> possible to implement that in AAS, would Jolla participate in that
16:41:51 <rainemak> #info <Cryx> initiative?
16:41:51 <rainemak> #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/unified-attestation/28249
16:41:52 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> Thank you for asking. We are very well aware :-).
16:45:56 <Cryx[m]> Very good... 😉
16:46:17 <rainemak> let's move on
16:46:18 <rainemak> #topic Open Pull Requests (PRs) to discussion (5 mins -- asked by Jolla)
16:47:05 <rainemak> Already merged PR but thank you all who contributed to the Events view Weather integration
16:49:09 <rainemak> I don't have any PRs to comment. Do you have Keto, direc85[m] , mal , others?
16:49:58 <direc85[m]> I'll have a look at the Nextcloud gallery thumbnail PR
16:50:10 <rainemak> direc85[m], thanks
16:50:15 <Keto> the wayland xdg_shell PR is probably something we should try to get forward
16:50:25 <direc85[m]> https://github.com/sailfishos/sailfish-account-nextcloud/pull/4
16:50:41 <rainemak> https://github.com/sailfishos/lipstick/pull/68
16:51:40 <mal> yes, need to check how that handles device orientation etc
16:52:02 <mal> which is probably the most important thing to be done correctly
16:54:50 <rainemak> let's move on
16:54:51 <rainemak> #topic General discussion (10 mins)
16:56:05 <ExTechOp> So, I'll come back to: there also seems to be a very-long standing SFOS issue that Android applications (like Signal) can make the whole OS crash if you go completely out
16:56:07 <ExTechOp> of connectivity, but I don't recall it ever being mentioned anywhere. I've experienced this for example by going far off into the forest (poor cellular coverage) or into cellars.
16:57:08 <rainemak> ExTechOp, I don't recall seeing
16:57:28 <rainemak> but you're feeling is that it's connectivity related
16:57:33 <rainemak> but your feeling is that it's connectivity related
16:58:39 <Keto> and on which device does that happen?
16:58:40 <ExTechOp> The whole phone of course gets hot (trying to get radio connections), and then begins to slow down. If you're lucky, and connectivity is restored the phone will recover.
16:58:40 <ExTechOp> If not, the thing can just crash "suorilta jaloilta" and then you need to go through the PIN entry rigmarole.
17:00:32 <ExTechOp> I've been doing Geocaching for ages on SFOS, which takes you deep into forests, and this issue has been around for a long while. Some network patches made it better at least for some time, but it seems to be back with current versions.
17:00:38 <mal> ExTechOp: which device?
17:04:38 <CLMA31[m]> Hello, very late (didn't check clock....)
17:04:39 <ExTechOp> Currently Xperia 10III but I think I've experienced it back with the Jolla C and Xperia XA2
17:04:45 <Keto> ExTechOp: might be good to open a forum thread if there isn't one already. to get input from others who might have experienced this and to try narrow down what's causing it
17:05:07 <rainemak> +1
17:05:18 <mal> I have x10iii in use but difficult to find bad reception here
17:05:27 <tuplasuhveli[m]> I'm very late as well, this meeting had totally slipped my mind...
17:06:44 <rainemak> Let's have 5mins more for the general
17:08:13 <direc85[m]> I have a X10III and I know a few places with questionable reception, I can try those out and see what happens. If the reception is bad enough.
17:08:38 <tuplasuhveli[m]> I was going to ask, if supporting A2DP codecs in bluetooth audio is something, that has caught Jolla's attention. There is a forum thread that was started 5 years ago, but hasn't received any reactions:
17:08:38 <tuplasuhveli[m]> https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/support-for-higher-quality-bluetooth-a2dp-audio-codecs-in-sailfishos/5812
17:09:35 <sebix[m]> rainemak: For this reason marking Wi-Fi as metered would be nice :)
17:09:36 <rainemak> We have been occasionally discussing about it yet
17:10:22 <rainemak> it yes
17:10:24 <mal> those all require licensing afaik
17:10:44 <CLMA31[m]> rainemak: I have been fully aware that you are currently really pushing things forward!
17:10:58 <CLMA31[m]> So amazing to see, very impressive times ahead
17:11:56 <rainemak> another 5mins maybe if late comers have something to add
17:12:10 <tuplasuhveli[m]> ^^ Good, good. That's enough for me now :--)
17:12:20 <rainemak> Great!
17:12:27 <Keto> pulseaudio and bluez updates are coming, if that affects the bluetooth codecs in anyway
17:12:39 <CLMA31[m]> Good that you put focus on Jolla phone, hopefully we see surge in orders after first good reviews arrive!
17:12:47 <ExTechOp> I was earlier asking, could Chum GUI be in the official Jolla store?
17:12:59 <Cryx[m]> Sorry that I could just say thank you for the response to my question, was on the road.
17:12:59 <Cryx[m]> Jolla's Answer sound like they are already involved in the initiative....
17:13:13 <CLMA31[m]> I would like to ask, are you planning already patch for October?
17:13:16 <rainemak> Cryx[m], :-)
17:13:35 <mal> some other things I have been working, improvements to sharing things in sfos, via qr codes and also making sure nfc sharing also works, just text/contacts etc for now
17:13:56 <direc85[m]> The new Pulseaudio supports more codecs, so it's a requirement at least for some of them
17:14:27 <rainemak> CLMA31[m], let's see what comes after the first 1000 units of the first normal production run current one being Sep 2026
17:14:44 <Cryx[m]> Rainemak, if it's the case, wouldn't that be good to tell this to public...?😉
17:15:05 <CLMA31[m]> rainemak: That is already sold out!!
17:15:25 <CLMA31[m]> 1034 devices of the 1000 are sold
17:15:57 <CLMA31[m]> I have seen some question online already if they missed the ordering window
17:16:13 <rainemak> alright, are we done for today?
17:16:29 <rainemak> we could schedule the next meeting
17:16:53 <CLMA31[m]> You probably can't say for sure, but are you planning to have one more 5.0 update before 5.1?
17:17:13 <CLMA31[m]> This was last question
17:17:14 <rainemak> Yes, we're planning for one more 5.0 update with EAS fixes
17:17:26 <CLMA31[m]> Thanks for the info!
17:17:45 <rainemak> maybe something else slips in as well... who knows
17:17:57 <rainemak> #topic Next meeting time and date (2 mins)
17:18:02 <rainemak> Proposing Thursday 26th March at 04:00 PM UTC
17:18:34 <CLMA31[m]> Sounds good
17:18:52 <ExTechOp> Standard timing, works4me.
17:18:56 <rainemak> Yeap
17:18:59 <rainemak> #info Next meeting will be held on Thursday 26th March 2026 at 04:00pm UTC: 2026-03-26T1600Z
17:19:24 <rainemak> thank you all! see you in two weeks and keep on posting questions
17:19:31 <ExTechOp> Thank you, everybody!
17:19:44 <CLMA31[m]> Thanks everyone!
17:19:55 <rainemak> #endmeeting