16:00:06 <rainemak> #startmeeting Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 26th March 2026
16:00:06 <sailbot> Meeting started Thu Mar 26 16:00:06 2026 UTC. The chair is rainemak. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
16:00:06 <sailbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
16:00:06 <rainemak> #info Meeting information and agenda can be found here:
16:00:06 <rainemak> #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/28325
16:00:06 <rainemak> I am the meeting's chairperson today, and will be doing my best to keep time and order. Please respect the timings and bee-hive.
16:00:06 <rainemak> #topic Brief introduction (5 min). Please prefix your name/handle with #info
16:00:14 <rainemak> #info Raine Mäkeläinen, Jolla
16:00:20 <ExTechOp> #info Otto Mäkelä, community
16:00:54 <mal> #info mal, Jolla
16:01:11 <Nico> #info Nico, community
16:02:59 <abr> #info Andrew Branson, community
16:03:41 <AffeNull[m]> #info Affe Null, community
16:04:34 <sebix[m]> #info sebix, community
16:05:07 <rainemak> We have 8 topics today. Thank you all for posting questions.
16:05:12 <rainemak> let's get going
16:05:26 <rainemak> #topic Shipping options for the new Jolla J2 to Greece or Serbia (5 mins -- PolatBirdal)
16:05:26 <rainemak> #info <PolatBirdal> I live in Türkiye and buying phones from abroad is prohibited.
16:05:26 <rainemak> #info <PolatBirdal> I plan to travel to Greece or Serbia to pick up my J2 order.
16:05:26 <rainemak> #info <PolatBirdal> Is it possible to have it sent to a ‘Poste Restante’ or a
16:05:26 <rainemak> #info <PolatBirdal> specific cargo point there, and which shipping company (DHL,
16:05:27 <rainemak> #info <PolatBirdal> National Post, etc.) does Jolla use for these countries? I am
16:05:29 <rainemak> #info <PolatBirdal> not a full citizen of that country, but when I go there from
16:05:31 <rainemak> #info <PolatBirdal> Türkiye, do I have the option of picking up the order there?
16:05:33 <rainemak> #info <PolatBirdal> Or could I encounter situations where I cannot receive it?
16:05:56 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> The sales markets are EU, UK, Switzerland and Norway. Entering other
16:05:56 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> markets are to be decided due course based on potential interest
16:05:56 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> from the areas.
16:05:56 <rainemak> #info <Jolla>
16:05:56 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> The shipping address will be requested upon final payment. You'll
16:05:57 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> receive a personal email regarding the final payment. We're
16:05:59 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> currently using UPS for Greece and we're not shipping to Serbia
16:06:01 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> (outside of EU). Hard to say anything definite regarding 'Poste
16:06:03 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> Restante' or similar -- probably depends on how long you're staying
16:06:05 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> and how long a service keeps parcels.
16:06:08 <HengYeDev> #info HengYeDev, community
16:08:43 <rainemak> If there are new comers, also worth noting that we're not online super store which would deliver in 24hours.
16:08:53 <abr> xD
16:09:34 <HengYeDev> Is shipping to forwarding addresses allowed?
16:10:13 <rainemak> let's say that shipping address country matters
16:10:18 <rainemak> #topic pre-order question (5 mins -- PolatBirdal)
16:10:19 <rainemak> #info <PolatBirdal> In the pre-order section, they ask for our billing address
16:10:19 <rainemak> #info <PolatBirdal> instead of our delivery address. Does this mean we’ll only ask
16:10:19 <rainemak> #info <PolatBirdal> for your delivery address when you want to pay the full price?
16:10:20 <rainemak> #info <PolatBirdal> And will DHL generally be the shipping company? How can I get
16:10:22 <rainemak> #info <PolatBirdal> complete information about this, because I don’t have an
16:10:24 <rainemak> #info <PolatBirdal> address or contact anyone in that area where I’ll be placing
16:10:26 <rainemak> #info <PolatBirdal> the order, and I want to pick it up from the branch.
16:10:28 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> The shipping address will be requested upon final payment. You'll
16:10:30 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> receive a personal email regarding the final payment. DHL is not the
16:10:32 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> only used courier service. Currently used service is not user
16:10:34 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> selectable.
16:10:36 <rainemak> changing to next topic as this is almost the same
16:14:39 <rainemak> this is pretty much covered
16:14:41 <rainemak> moving on
16:14:45 <rainemak> #topic Chat protocols (15 mins -- asked by frankps)
16:14:45 <rainemak> #info <frankps> * For me phones are mainly for communication, photos and reading
16:14:45 <rainemak> #info <frankps>   (news etc), and I try to only use native apps.
16:14:45 <rainemak> #info <frankps> * What initiatives are ongoing for chat clients by Jolla and the
16:14:45 <rainemak> #info <frankps>   community?
16:14:48 <rainemak> #info <frankps> * What projects are active?
16:14:50 <rainemak> #info <frankps> * What should we focus on improving (bug fixes, new functionality
16:14:52 <rainemak> #info <frankps>   and translations) before the new phone and new community members
16:14:54 <rainemak> #info <frankps>   arrive?
16:14:56 <rainemak> #info <frankps>
16:14:58 <rainemak> #info <frankps> Examples on clients:
16:15:00 <rainemak> #info <frankps> * SailfishOS has a pretty good Nextcloud implementation, but lacks
16:15:02 <rainemak> #info <frankps>   a decent Nextcloud Talk client. It was last updated in Dec 2022.
16:15:04 <rainemak> #info <frankps> * Europe seems to go for Matrix. There are some development on
16:15:06 <rainemak> #info <frankps>   Sailtrix, but it lacks a lot of functionality (as a good
16:15:08 <rainemak> #info <frankps>   encryption implementation). It was last updated in Dec 2025.
16:15:10 <rainemak> #info <frankps> * The Mattermost client has not been updated since 2021, but is
16:15:12 <rainemak> #info <frankps>   still possible to use.
16:15:14 <rainemak> #info <frankps> * The XMPP implementation has not gotten love for years.
16:15:18 <rainemak> #info <frankps> * Signal - Whisperfish is actively maintained.
16:15:20 <rainemak> #link https://openrepos.net/content/blizzz/nextcloud-talk
16:15:22 <rainemak> #link https://openrepos.net/content/hengyedev/sailtrix
16:15:24 <rainemak> #link https://openrepos.net/content/sashikknox/mattermost
16:15:26 <rainemak> #link https://openrepos.net/content/rubdos/whisperfish
16:15:28 <rainemak> #info <frankps> Where do Jolla want to go?
16:15:30 <rainemak> #info <frankps> Where do the community want to go?
16:15:32 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> This topic contains many questions / ideas. Let's have open
16:15:34 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> discussion. There are probably good ideas from you, Sailfish
16:15:36 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> community, regarding this. We should consider open sourcing XMPP
16:15:38 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> account integration.
16:15:40 <rainemak> #info <Jolla>
16:15:42 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> Getting chat clients to official Jolla Store would be beneficial for
16:15:44 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> us all.
16:15:48 <rainemak> I think I mentioned XMPP in some previous community meetings as well
16:16:50 <HengYeDev> I might be pushing out Sailtrix latest version this week if I'm not too busy
16:17:22 <HengYeDev> In general I think it would help to better document the thing that integrates other chat platforms into the built in messages app
16:17:38 <HengYeDev> is there any chance that may happen?
16:19:18 <rainemak> HengYeDev, that's quite tricky path... especially when thinking how much functionality various chat apps have gained over the year.
16:19:54 <rainemak> having native chat clients would be nice available from Jolla Store
16:20:35 <rainemak> going there towards Messaging / Phone app integration would be another ball game
16:20:40 <ExTechOp> I remember back in prehistory getting my first Jolla (after a rainy afternoon, standing in a queue) and being impressed by the way all the communication protocols
16:20:40 <ExTechOp> (text messages, emails, xmpp…) were combined into one coherent view, and I liked it. Unfortunately these days, protocols seem to to have split apart again into separate apps.
16:21:54 <rainemak> ExTechOp, exactly. I also loved it
16:21:54 <nephros> #info naphros, community, very late-comer
16:21:59 <nephros> hello! :)
16:22:10 <rainemak> nephros, not too late... I guess we have an hour to go still
16:22:16 <HengYeDev> Perhaps if the integration is documented we could figure out a clever way to have the native chat app send/receive data from the the Messages app, so that the notifications would be unified
16:22:34 <sebix[m]> I also not sure if a central place for all messaging protocols is useful. the platforms themselves also differ a lot in how they work, so unifying the UI would be a challenge anyway, to put it mildly
16:23:12 <nephros> Messages is still based around Telepathy. Telepathy was a good idea but nowadays is pretty much obsolote/dead.
16:23:27 <abr> IIRC there are architectural things to get over - Telepathy doesn't have the concept of groups
16:24:13 <abr> but I guess it being dead means you wouldn't have to care about changing APIs if you wanted to add all the missing stuff :)
16:25:00 <HengYeDev> On another point, it would be great if there was a unified way for apps to deal with audio and push notifications. Yes we have a notifications API but in Sailtrix i have to do polling which is not the best and cant receive audio calls quickly. I'll have to look at how whisperfish does it though
16:25:08 <rainemak> abr, yes, indeed it works that way as well
16:25:08 <sebix[m]> also, there will always be separate apps, because for example they provide functions that the messaging app cannot provide (very specific stuff), they get updates more frequently, or just because the integration isn't ready yet. So some messaging platforms are then in the messages and some are not. that's neither easy to use
16:25:18 <rainemak> and I think there's room to cleanup as well
16:25:32 <HengYeDev> I have been away for a while and maybe something was figured out with push notifications. IIRC there was a voip app that could receive calls too
16:26:26 <rainemak> frankps, would you like to add something here?
16:26:30 <abr> I always thought the MMS backend would be a good one to work with to add groups, as that supports them and the rest of it is implemented. But I guess only if they're free to send for you.
16:27:04 <abr> I think there was a guy who extended it to Telegram at one point
16:29:49 <Keto> even with somewhat uniform things like email, calendar, and contacts, it seems quite complicated to fit different protocols and providers in the same shape box
16:30:14 <rainemak> Keto, good comparison
16:30:29 <rainemak> I guess we could move to the next topic
16:30:33 <ExTechOp> The integration for SMS/MMS isn't very good: afaik you cannot continue a SMS conversation with a MMS message, you have to start out writing a new MMS and it'll only afterwards turn up in the same SMS chain.
16:31:37 <rainemak> #topic Future for events view (10 mins -- asked by rubdos)
16:31:37 <rainemak> #info <rubdos> Now that we have Mastodon in the eventsview (thanks @abranson), I
16:31:37 <rainemak> #info <rubdos> think we might see a lot more integrations! I’d love to integrate
16:31:37 <rainemak> #info <rubdos> Signal stories (through Whisperfish). However, some media are
16:31:37 <rainemak> #info <rubdos> notably more slow compared to Twitter or Mastodon: Signal stories
16:31:39 <rainemak> #info <rubdos> hop on once every blue moon for me, and I wouldn’t want them to be
16:31:40 <rainemak> #info <rubdos> drowned in Mastodon retoots. I’d love some discussion on a modern
16:31:42 <rainemak> #info <rubdos> take of the event view. Can we prioritize certain media, or maybe
16:31:44 <rainemak> #info <rubdos> pin story-like events? This kind of events have an expiry date.
16:31:48 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> Let's have open discussion for this as well.
16:33:09 <rainemak> pinning events view thing could be interesting to explore
16:34:51 <mal> ExTechOp: that seems like a bug, need to check why there is such a limitation
16:35:10 <rainemak> Having Whisperfish providing content to the events view would be nice
16:37:28 <nephros> My idea about the events view would be to add RSS/Atom feed support.
16:38:06 <rainemak> nephros, that would work
16:38:07 <nephros> Then use that as a "base API", i.e. apps could present an RSS Feed to notifications.
16:38:09 <abr> that's always been sorely absent! nextcloud news would be nice, but a plain RSS feed like the simple web calendar URL would be essential
16:38:29 <Keto> I haven't had any social media style thing there in ages, so don't remember how that works... Are those separate from the normal app notifications there?
16:38:46 <rainemak> Keto, yes they are
16:38:53 <nephros> In theory, then there could be another app which could "filter" or "mix-and-match" content from different apps.
16:39:26 <abr> they each have their own group, rather than being mingled in a single timeline
16:39:54 <abr> but I guess there could be different options for how they are displayed
16:41:33 <rainemak> I'll give 5mins more for this one
16:43:19 <abr> when I get some things merged, then hopefully there will be some public components for those feed things so they'll be easier for other folks to make
16:43:34 <abr> it'd be great to see all sort of feeds on the events view. like it was meant to be
16:44:24 <rainemak> +1
16:44:32 <rainemak> alright, let's move on
16:44:37 <rainemak> #topic Using swipe gestures in browser (10 mins -- asked by tuplasuhveli)
16:44:37 <rainemak> #info <tuplasuhveli> SFOS’ design philosophy is centered around swipe actions.
16:44:37 <rainemak> #info <tuplasuhveli> Browser is understandably a bit of an outlier in this regard,
16:44:37 <rainemak> #info <tuplasuhveli> but perhaps there is room for adopting at least some. For
16:44:37 <rainemak> #info <tuplasuhveli> example, a patch maintained by @Kuba77 provides a
16:44:39 <rainemak> #info <tuplasuhveli> functionality to swipe on URL / toolbar to move back and
16:44:40 <rainemak> #info <tuplasuhveli> forth between pages. My questions are as follows:
16:44:42 <rainemak> #info <tuplasuhveli> 1. Do you find the functionality provided by the previously
16:44:44 <rainemak> #info <tuplasuhveli>    mentioned patch to be in line with SFOS’ design
16:44:48 <rainemak> #info <tuplasuhveli>    philosophy?
16:44:50 <rainemak> #info <tuplasuhveli> 2. If yes, do you think this functionality could be provided
16:44:52 <rainemak> #info <tuplasuhveli>    out of the box in an upcoming SFOS version?
16:44:54 <rainemak> #info <tuplasuhveli> 3. Have you considered some other gestures to be utilised in
16:44:56 <rainemak> #info <tuplasuhveli>    browser?
16:44:58 <rainemak> #link https://coderus.openrepos.net/pm2/project/browser-history-swipes
16:45:00 <rainemak> #link https://openrepos.net/content/cornerman/patch-browser-history-swipes
16:45:30 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> Thank you for raising this topic. We can certainly discuss this over
16:45:30 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> here in the community meeting. The link to the patch2 didn't work
16:45:30 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> but it's likely the same as the above other link. Browser is an open
16:45:30 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> source and contributions are welcome. Whether to implement this
16:45:30 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> exactly like done in the patch is another topic of it's own.
16:45:31 <rainemak> #info <Jolla>
16:45:33 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> We were thinking quite a bit of different gestures for browser a way
16:45:35 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> back. Lately we haven't have time for that.
16:45:37 <rainemak> #info <Jolla>
16:45:39 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> This patch could be turned into a pull request for browser and be
16:45:41 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> discussed there.
16:47:31 <abr> good idea
16:47:55 <rainemak> I kind of like the idea of utilizing the toolbar for this. That makes event handling simpler as one would not need to worry about the event handling happening in the web context
16:49:03 <piggz[m]> Angelfish does this already
16:50:15 <Keto> could possibly drop the back/forward buttons and replace them with them usual silica page indicators?
16:50:28 <rainemak> gb
16:50:38 <rainemak> those are there in the patch if I remember right
16:51:09 <Keto> ok, probably need to try that out
16:53:52 <rainemak> let's move on
16:53:53 <rainemak> #topic Possibility to minimise phone app during the emergency call (10 mins -- asked by CLMA31)
16:53:53 <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> There are reports from community ( Reliable emergency calls - #23
16:53:53 <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> by kari.einamo ) that during emergency call it is not possible to
16:53:53 <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> minimise the phone app which makes it impossible to access any
16:53:53 <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> further information from phone. Is this bug or planned feature?
16:53:55 <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> Either way, would it be possible to make minimisation of phone app
16:53:57 <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> possible so we could use phone still otherwise? I have only called
16:53:59 <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> emergency services few times, but during all of them I had to
16:54:01 <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> access my phone otherwise (coordinates are quite crucial).
16:54:03 <rainemak> #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/reliable-emergency-calls/26085/23
16:54:05 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> It's intentionally implemented like that. In the past there was an
16:54:07 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> issue on performing an emergency call from SIM PIN query view and on
16:54:09 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> going call went to background.
16:54:11 <rainemak> #info <Jolla>
16:54:13 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> We should revisit and/or re-test. The point raised is absolutely
16:54:15 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> valid.
16:56:48 <rainemak> No comments, let's move on
16:57:25 <rainemak> #topic Home screen app grid (minimized apps) 3x2 instead 2x2 for new Jolla phone (10 mins -- asked by CLMA31)
16:57:25 <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> @MartiMasaKoegx raised good poll regarding the minimised app grid
16:57:25 <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> whether it should be 3x2 or 2x2. This consideration was about new
16:57:25 <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> Jolla Phone. Second idea regarding this topic is from @fingus
16:57:25 <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> Community meeting on 26th March 2026 - #13 by fingus . This would
16:57:27 <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> allow user to zoom in/out to have smaller or larger app grid tile.
16:57:29 <rainemak> #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/home-screen-app-grid-minimized-apps-3x2-instead-2x2-for-new-jolla-phone-as-well/28624
16:57:32 <rainemak> #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/community-meeting-on-26th-march-2026/28325/13
16:57:34 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> To clarify MartiMasaKoegx's poll it was about the bigger size cover
16:57:36 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> and how many of them there should be. Currently there's unused space
16:57:38 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> at the end of the Switcher when 4 apps are open. 5th opened app
16:57:40 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> changes Switcher to small cover mode. This is already visible with
16:57:42 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> the Jolla C2 Community Phone.
16:57:44 <rainemak> #info <Jolla>
16:57:48 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> Yes, we should be using the screen estate efficiently. So preferably
16:57:50 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> two big covers side by side and in three rows.
16:57:52 <rainemak> #info <Jolla>
16:57:54 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> Maybe a gesture could be introduced for zoom in/out.
17:03:44 <rainemak> let's see if could do something about the pinch-to-zoom
17:04:05 <rainemak> further adjusting cover size would be much preferred
17:04:10 <rainemak> sizes
17:06:08 <rainemak> let's take next topic
17:06:22 <rainemak> #topic The screen specifications of this phone have not been disclosed. (5 mins -- asked by PolatBirdal)
17:06:22 <rainemak> #info <PolatBirdal> Hi, the Jolla J2 phone is currently just a prototype. I’ve
17:06:22 <rainemak> #info <PolatBirdal> come across promotional videos of the phone and it seems there
17:06:22 <rainemak> #info <PolatBirdal> are only 9 prototypes. My question is: What will the screen
17:06:22 <rainemak> #info <PolatBirdal> refresh rate of this phone be? If I’m giving my opinion,
17:06:23 <nephros> personally I don't thing the current behavior needs any changes. But if something is done there, maybe is could be 2 rows of N covers, and then a third row with N*2-1 small covers.
17:06:24 <rainemak> #info <PolatBirdal> please let it be at least 90Hz.
17:06:26 <rainemak> #info <Jolla> Yes, screen refresh rate is 90Hz.
17:07:05 <rainemak> nephros, it's more about the unused space
17:07:25 * nephros does have a bad speling day today.
17:08:19 <rainemak> screen refresh rate is probably covered
17:08:36 <rainemak> next topic
17:08:36 <rainemak> #topic Open Pull Requests (PRs) to discussion (5 mins -- asked by Jolla)
17:08:55 <rainemak> Keto, abr, direc85[m] , anybody?
17:10:03 <nephros> not here ... :)
17:10:38 <mal> pulseaudio update is possibly going to be merged soon, I know people have been waiting for it
17:10:55 <rainemak> mal, that's a good point
17:11:11 <rainemak> potentially before 5.1 branching
17:13:14 <abr> how's the xdg-shell one doing?
17:14:14 <abr> I have the adaptive streaming ones still hanging in gst-droid and qtmultimedia too. if anyone fancies trying those out in their video streaming apps :)
17:14:51 <abr> they let HLS media switch between streams more easily. not perfect but much better than it was
17:16:58 <rainemak> let's move on
17:17:05 <rainemak> #topic General discussion (10 mins)
17:18:18 <piggz[m]> I have a question :) .... any update / discussions/ progress with the UA project?  Do you think its useful for appsupport/sfos? I know another OS joined the effort this week, seems like something good to be onboard with?
17:18:30 <ExTechOp> And now for something completely different: I'm interested to know what happened with Here Maps, specifically, are their map tile servers no longer available for Jolla phones (as shown by eg. Jollaopas)? https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/jollaopas-v0-9-4-and-missing-map-tiles/22677
17:21:32 <rainemak> piggz[m], Unified Attestation is a good initiative... we have been super busy here this week once again. I'm not here to comment the status.
17:21:38 <ExTechOp> Scratch that previous comment, it seems the whole thing may be switching over to OSM.
17:22:11 <rainemak> ExTechOp, and using OSM or similar is good
17:22:17 <piggz[m]> rainemak: ok :)
17:24:49 <rainemak> let's start wrapping up
17:26:43 <rainemak> #topic Next meeting time and date (2 mins)
17:26:43 <rainemak> Proposing Thursday 9th April at 04:00 PM UTC
17:27:43 <rainemak> after Easter
17:27:43 <ExTechOp> The usual time, seems appropriate.
17:28:12 <rainemak> #info Next meeting will be held on Thursday 9th April 2026 at 04:00pm UTC: 2026-04-09T1600Z
17:28:23 <rainemak> Thank you all!
17:28:34 <rainemak> #endmeeting