08:00:10 <ViGe> #startmeeting Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 30th March 2023
08:00:10 <sailbot> Meeting started Thu Mar 30 08:00:10 2023 UTC. The chair is ViGe. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
08:00:10 <sailbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
08:00:15 <ViGe> #info Meeting information and agenda can be found here:
08:00:19 <ViGe> #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/community-meeting-on-irc-30th-march-2023/15013
08:00:26 <ViGe> I am the meeting's chairperson today, and will be doing my best to keep time and order. Please respect the timings and bee-hive.
08:00:30 <ViGe> We have again quite a few questions, but the persons asking the questions didn't reserve a lot of time for discussions, so we should be quite quick today.
08:00:35 <ViGe> #topic Brief introduction (5 min). Please prefix your name/handle with #info
08:01:00 <ViGe> #info Ville Nummela, sailor @ Jolla, chairperson today
08:01:47 <ExTechOp> #info Otto Mäkelä, community
08:02:27 <pherjung[m]> #info pherjung, community
08:03:08 <crun> #info crun, community
08:03:21 <dcaliste> #info Damien Caliste, community
08:03:40 <flypig> #info David Llewellyn-Jones, community
08:04:24 <nas> #info nas nas, community
08:05:26 <abr> #info Andrew Branson, sailor!
08:05:49 <ViGe> abr: I was already afraid I was the only sailor here!
08:05:56 <ViGe> #topic Will there be an official port for Xperia 10 iv? (5 min -- asked by martinbook85)
08:06:04 <ViGe> #info <martinbook85> Jolla / Sailfish has had an official port for all the middle range Xperia phones since Xperia X, continuing with Xperia XA2, Xperia 10, Xperia 10 ii and Xperia 10 iii.
08:06:08 <ViGe> #info <martinbook85> The 10 iii is somewhat difficult to get at a reasonable price and therefore several (5-10 that I have encountered, maybe more) people have gone out to get an Xperia 10 iv.
08:06:12 <ViGe> #info <martinbook85> There has been no promise about a port for Xperia 10 iv but it is still available for purchase at quite an OK price.
08:06:15 <ViGe> #info <martinbook85> It would therefore be good to know if there will be an official port.
08:06:28 <ViGe> And here's the prepared answer:
08:06:32 <ViGe> #info <Jolla> Sony Xperia 10 IV is plausible candidate for the officially supported Sailfish X device.
08:07:44 <ExTechOp> So what would an approximate time frame for this be?
08:09:16 <ViGe> ExTechOp: I can't give any time frame. Except maybe "not anytime soon". It usually takes a few months to make a mature enough port.
08:10:12 <flypig> Is there already a community port?
08:10:12 <ViGe> let's move on
08:10:26 <ViGe> flypig: Not that I'm aware of
08:10:32 <ViGe> #topic Add the ability to change haptics in keyboard / improve reactivity (5 min -- asked by Valorsoguerriero97)
08:10:38 <ViGe> #info <Valorsoguerriero97> The default sailfish keyboard is frustating because of its weak haptics, I ask for having the GUI to change vibration intensity and to improve its reactivity on SFOS forum.
08:10:42 <ViGe> #info <Valorsoguerriero97> Try posting with it on default browser and you'll experience heavy lags.
08:10:45 <ViGe> #info <Valorsoguerriero97> However the biggest thing I would love to see is the option to have low/medium/strong haptic feedback.
08:10:50 <ViGe> #info <Valorsoguerriero97> Thx!
08:11:18 <ViGe> #info <Jolla> The haptic feedback details depend quite much on the hardware.
08:11:22 <ViGe> #info <Jolla> On some it’s nicely fast and precise while on cheaper haptic modules it takes some time to start.
08:11:25 <ViGe> #info <Jolla> The device isn’t mentioned here, but perhaps the device configuration on the amount could be checked.
08:11:28 <ViGe> #info <Jolla> However, increasing the force might mean delaying the lag on feedback start and stop.
08:12:29 <piggz[m]> #info Adam Pigg, community
08:13:00 <flypig> If I recall correctly, we had to tone down the haptics for Fingerterm on the Xperia 10 II/III. ToeTerm still uses the previous settings, so if you want to try out stronger keyboard haptics, it may be worth trying out ToeTerm.
08:14:03 <ViGe> flypig: We had to tone down the haptics for Xperia 10 III everywhere. When you moved your finger on the keyboard it felt like the device was trying to get airborne.
08:14:26 <flypig> Yes, exactly. You can still have that experience using ToeTerm :)
08:14:27 <crun> Is there a global setting for it?
08:15:12 <karry> #info Lukáš Karas, community developer
08:15:22 <ViGe> crun: I have no idea how it's configured, sorry
08:15:43 <ViGe> Time to move on
08:15:49 <ViGe> #topic Right-To-Left Optimization(RTL) (5 min -- asked by mad_dev)
08:15:54 <ViGe> #info <mad_dev> RTL is not yet optimized in SFOS, where input fields and headers are automatically text aligned to the right if the script is right to left.
08:15:57 <ViGe> #info <mad_dev> I have also sent an email on March 13 with the same topic.
08:16:01 <ViGe> #info <mad_dev> My question is, what is Jolla's stance on RTL, and is the patched solution(appending a mirroring declaration) the best way forward?
08:16:09 <ViGe> #info <Jolla> Proper RTL support is definitely a thing we’d like to have, but as we haven’t gotten big enough need for any RTL language yet, the polishing hasn’t been done.
08:16:13 <ViGe> #info <Jolla> On the details we’d likely keep the UI layout otherwise the same but just make sure the text fields work nicely right aligned.
08:16:17 <ViGe> #info <Jolla> Not sure what the mentioned patched solution is specifically.
08:17:08 <ViGe> It seems mad_dev is not here :(
08:18:20 <ViGe> Too bad, as it would have been nice to hear what that patched solution was
08:18:36 <flypig> This thread seems to have more info:
08:18:38 <flypig> https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/unofficial-rtl-support/671
08:19:21 <flypig> So, maybe this is the patch?
08:19:21 <flypig> https://github.com/Logic-gate/unofficial-jolla-language-pack-ar/blob/master/tests/rtls.sh
08:20:01 <ViGe> interesting, need to check that out
08:20:05 <flypig> "It’s main function is to simply append the mirroring declaration at a given line."
08:20:42 <ViGe> Let's move on to next question
08:20:48 <ViGe> #topic - (5 min -- asked by crun)
08:20:53 <ViGe> #info <crun> Sailfish itself is now pretty usable.
08:20:55 <ViGe> #info <crun> However the X10iii has hardware related issues that are showstoppers for me - I cannot use it beyond a secondary phone.
08:20:58 <ViGe> #info <crun> These may all relate to Sony and the Sony AOSP.
08:21:00 <ViGe> #info <crun> Can any of them be fixed at all by Jolla, or are these just AOSP bugs in a now obsolete phone that Sony will never fix?
08:21:04 <ViGe> #info <crun> Standby Battery Drain.
08:21:06 <ViGe> #info <crun> GPS Lock is slow/unable when signal is weak - Side-by-side is different to Android.
08:21:09 <ViGe> #info <crun> Seems to be all Sonys, not just 10iii.
08:21:11 <ViGe> #info <crun> Internet/cell disabled - this is nothing to do with AGPS.
08:21:14 <ViGe> #info <crun> VoLTE does not configure/register on any of the 3 carriers in NZ Android or SFOS - registration appears disabled here, and my carrier blames Sony.
08:21:17 <ViGe> #info <crun> I can probably get the required configuration data from the carrier, but need a way to put it in the phone.
08:21:20 <ViGe> #info <crun> Does Sony block whole countries?
08:21:23 <ViGe> #info <crun> Is the X10iii whitelisted (i.e.
08:21:25 <ViGe> #info <crun> only Sony contracted carriers/regions will every work)?
08:21:28 <ViGe> #info <crun> Is this happening in blobs or is it something SFOS can access?
08:21:31 <ViGe> #info <crun> Do you know how VoLTE configures and registers (i.e.
08:21:33 <ViGe> #info <crun> what is going on here), or is this a block box to you as well?
08:21:36 <ViGe> #info <crun> Does Sony help in any meaningful way e.g answering questions now the X10iii is obsolete?
08:21:39 <ViGe> #info <crun> Can we get a might fix / can't fix acknowledgement?
08:21:42 <ViGe> #info <crun> To date there have not been any requests for tests/info on any of these topics.
08:21:45 <ViGe> #info <crun> I have both Android and SF X10iii's and can side by side compare them.
08:22:15 <ViGe> I just noticed that the script treated "i.e." as end of sentence...
08:22:22 <ViGe> #info <Jolla> Sony does still fix issues in AOSP for Xperia 10 III.
08:22:25 <ViGe> #info <Jolla> We can’t comment on agreements between Sony and carriers.
08:23:19 <ViGe> That's all there is - sorry to say but we really can't speak on behalf of Sony
08:23:27 <crun> The Standby current and GPS have been fairly widely discussed. Are these actually bug tracked by Jolla?
08:24:07 <flypig> Do you have forum links for those crun, just for reference?
08:24:17 <crun> Se my post
08:24:24 <flypig> Thanks!
08:24:29 <crun> https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/standby-battery-high-drain-on-xperia-10-iii/15208
08:24:30 <ViGe> We don't have a single "GPS is bad" bug if that's what you are asking
08:25:37 <ViGe> crun: for the battery drain, we have this: https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/high-battery-drainage-xperia-10-iii/12393
08:26:05 <ViGe> which, like the "tracked" tag suggests, is tracked
08:28:21 <abr> For the VoLTE, the device firmware contains modem configs for each operator, that come from the carriers themselves.
08:28:44 <abr> you can see hem all in /vendor/firmware_mnt/image/modem_pr/mcfg/configs on the device
08:28:57 <crun_> back again
08:29:09 <crun_> computer locked up
08:29:34 <abr> I see some in a 'AUNZ' directory on there, for Optus, Telstra and Vodaphone.
08:29:46 <ViGe> crun: Regarding GPS, I wasn't able to find a single bug report describing what you are seeing with Xperia 10 III, so it might make sense to file one. There are numerous bug reports about GPS in general though.
08:30:31 <crun_> This has been a frustration, as I think that this is the same underlying issue the XA2 has
08:30:34 <abr> but unlike the x10ii, these are automatically loaded by the modem when needed. so if VoLTE doesn't work then your carrier is probably correct - they're just not supported by the device.
08:31:02 <crun_> the phone can be cold started, no network, and the GPS will see many satellites within seconds
08:31:24 <crun_> but it does not lock quickly, and if the signal is wek , it cannot lock at all
08:31:32 <pherjung[m]> ViGe: https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/gps-signal-very-bad/13026
08:32:16 <ViGe> pherjung[m]: Thanks. I was searching our internal tracker, that one is not there
08:32:22 <crun_> As I said, I have both android and SFOS , 10iii, so I can compare side by side.
08:32:26 <pherjung[m]> oh, my bad
08:32:48 <crun_> GPSInfo on SFOS actually shows the sats, faster than the Android
08:33:56 <crun_> So I can create a specific bug report
08:34:01 <flypig> crun_, is it possible to disable AGPS on Android and compare the two that way?
08:34:13 <ViGe> crun_: Out of curiosity, how do you check whether you have lock on Android side?
08:34:48 <crun_> A GPS app shows the same stuff GPSInfo shows
08:35:03 <ViGe> crun_: which GPS app?
08:35:17 <crun_> e.g. "8 of 25 sats used" when it has lock
08:35:37 <crun_> I would have to check
08:35:52 <crun_> I don't have to use it much - as the GPS works.
08:36:12 <ViGe> crun_: I think you can also use the "GPS signal very bad" bug report which pherjung linked above, and just add the details in comments there
08:36:30 <crun_> You will note in GPSInfo that it now shows how long it took to get first lock - I added this for my (late) XA2
08:36:40 <pherjung[m]> I also prefer this way
08:36:56 <crun_> The details are there....
08:37:06 <crun_> https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/gps-signal-very-bad/13026/35
08:37:08 <ViGe> crun_: I'm mostly asking to that I could try to reproduce the issue. I don't really have any issues with GPS either on my Xperia 10 III or XA2, so all information is useful.
08:38:11 <ViGe> Well, we are already quite a lot overtime for this question, let's move on, and continue the discussion on the forum
08:38:27 <ViGe> #topic Untracked bug reports (5 min -- asked by Community Bug Coordination Team)
08:38:29 <crun_> One thing I can't easily test is if Sony AOSP has this issue or it is a SFOS issue
08:38:41 <ViGe> #info <Community Bug Coordination Team> Our regular Community Bug Coordination Team update - see the forum for the links to actual bug reports
08:38:47 <ViGe> #info <Jolla> The Community Bug Coordination Team have done a superb job once again.
08:38:51 <ViGe> #info <Jolla> As a result of their work, we now have:
08:38:55 <ViGe> #info <Jolla> 7 high quality bug reports now recorded internally and tagged as "tracked".
08:38:59 <ViGe> #info <Jolla> 2 bug reports marked as "pending" more info.
08:39:13 <pherjung[m]> There is a missing duplicate, no?
08:39:38 <ViGe> maybe
08:39:44 <pherjung[m]> This one: https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/4-0-1-45-extremely-strange-lock-code-bug-on-jolla-tablet-please-read-the-whole-thread/4808
08:39:52 <pherjung[m]> flypig used to close them :)
08:40:48 <ViGe> oh, right that one. When I looked more closely into it, I don't think it's a duplicate.
08:42:53 <ViGe> #topic Open PR discussion (5 mins -- asked by jolla)
08:43:05 <ViGe> #info <jolla> Any open PRs to discuss?
08:46:03 <crun_> abr: I missed most of what you posted re volte can you repost at the end when meeting is done pls?
08:47:15 <ViGe> #topic General discussion (20 min)
08:47:39 <dcaliste> crun, you can find a backlog at https://irclogs.sailfishos.org/logs/%23sailfishos-meeting/%23sailfishos-meeting.2023-03-30.log.html
08:48:07 <ExTechOp> Has any progress been made with this: https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/4-1-0-23-4-0-1-48-4-4-0-64-4-5-0-16-no-notification-sounds-ringing-sms-alarm/4886/60 ?
08:48:55 <flypig> For Valorsoguerriero97's vibration strength query, there is this folder that seems to have some vibration values in it. I'm not sure if it's the right place to change things though:
08:49:01 <ViGe> #info <abr> For the VoLTE, the device firmware contains modem configs for each operator, that come from the carriers themselves.
08:49:05 <flypig> \/usr\/share\/ngfd\/events.d
08:49:18 <ViGe> #info <abr> you can see hem all in /vendor/firmware_mnt/image/modem_pr/mcfg/configs on the device
08:49:20 <flypig> dif: /usr/share/ngfd/events.d
08:50:17 <dcaliste> ExTechOp, not from my side… Besides the fact, that I didn't encounter the bug again since I'm using https://github.com/sailfishos/qmf-notifications-plugin/pull/2
08:50:32 <dcaliste> But this PR is not a fix, just a try to circumvent it.
08:50:43 <dcaliste> And not a proper way to do it…
08:53:25 <ViGe> ExTechOp: looks like some investigation has been done, but the real reason has not been found yet.
08:54:30 <ViGe> Playing less helps, that's what dcaliste's PR above does
08:54:56 <flypig> Also, concerning vibration, maybe this file is useful (I didn't try editing it): /usr/share//ngfd/plugins.d/50-droid-vibrator.ini
09:03:11 <karry> Hi Sailors, I would like to get some reply to my suggestion to use PSI api for memory monitoring: https://github.com/sailfishos/mce/pull/14
09:04:03 <karry> In future, I may help with switch of lowmemory killer to some userspace implementation (using PSI api)
09:04:58 <ViGe> karry: I'm afraid our specialists in this topic are not here today :(
09:05:25 <dcaliste> karry, this deserves to be discussed in length, in an open PR discussion during a meeting.
09:05:47 <ViGe> #info https://github.com/sailfishos/mce/pull/14 could use some review and discussion
09:07:23 <ViGe> #topic Next meeting time and date (5 min)
09:07:28 <ViGe> Proposing Thursday 13th April at 07:00am UTC
09:07:43 <karry> Ok, I will raise this topic for some future meeting
09:07:52 <ViGe> Please note the time, taking into account the daylight saving time
09:08:18 <ViGe> karry: I could also try to summon someone to review your PR
09:08:54 <ExTechOp> ViGe 2023-04-13T07:00Z works 4 me
09:11:20 <ViGe> Looks like there are no objections
09:11:26 <ViGe> #info Next meeting will be held on Thursday 13th April 2023 at 07:00am UTC: 2023-04-13T0700Z
09:11:47 <ViGe> Thanks everyone!
09:11:51 <ViGe> #endmeeting