#jollamobile log for Sunday, 2014-02-02

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* pahartik tries to upgrade "Sailfish" to "1.0.3.8" but it tells there is "problem with store" and fails to transfer data01:27
cvpQuu damn i cant find nothing about this what you write :(01:27
Yanieloh no, this "term quoting" again01:27
Yanielpahartik: from what version are you updating=01:28
cvpi go sleep... night01:28
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pahartikYaniel: It has been running "1.0.2.5" for 34 days01:33
Yanieland store used to work?01:34
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pahartikYaniel: Store works, I started it and can browse application lists01:38
Yanielretry updating after a while01:39
Yanieldo you have developer mode enabled?01:39
pahartikYaniel: Yes01:41
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Yanielthen the output from journalctl might provide some insight01:42
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pahartikYaniel: It is timeout with "https://store-repository.jolla.com/"01:56
Yanielsailors: ^ ?01:57
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* pahartik even tried rebooting "Jolla Mobile" device in case IPv6 routing and Bluetooth PAN would have left something on way of HTTPS, but it did not help03:19
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Pnuuhmm, why is together asking me to sign up instead of letting me sign in :-P08:27
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sejois there a way to import your sms from android to jolla?09:11
CoderCandyHmm, is messages with images on its way to jolla?09:12
Quumessages with images.09:12
Quudid you mean: email?09:12
sejoI think he means mms09:13
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tango_Quu: SHAME ON YOU EMAIL IS PLAIN TEXT09:19
tango_why am I shouting?09:19
tango_I mean, it _is_ a serious matter, but still ...09:19
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PnuuCoderCandy: mms is on the roadmap09:36
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attahHas anyone tried chromecasting from the jolla?09:53
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CoderCandyPnuu, ah, awesome!09:57
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QuuPnuu: but Jolla is boat, it should be on cruise schedule10:04
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walokrajolla is a small sailing boat, if there's no wind, it goes nowhere :)10:06
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* CoderCandy takes a deep breath and blows at the general direction of Jollas headquarter.10:10
StskeepsCoderCandy: bad breath, or what broke in your device?10:10
CoderCandyStskeeps, well, I have 2 rather annoying issues. Random sudden shutdowns, and blank screen.10:11
CoderCandyThe blank screen sometimes happen when I try to wake it. Killing lipstick and forcing it to restart works if I have access to ssh. Otherwise I can try to spam the lock-button or do a reboot10:12
CoderCandyThe random sudden shuttdown (symptoms like a loose connection to the battery) I have no clue...10:12
CoderCandyshutdown*10:12
StskeepsCoderCandy: sudden system shutdown, try to pull battery for 10 minutes?10:13
QuuStskeeps: told him to do that yesterday10:13
Stskeepsthe blank screen is probably a bug, does the LED blink?10:13
alteregoCoderCandy: shutdown or hard power off?10:13
CoderCandyhard power off10:13
CoderCandyStskeeps, yeah, the led and touch is working10:13
CoderCandy(I can hear the sounds of pulley-menus and shit)10:14
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Stskeepsokay, lemme rephrase10:14
Stskeepsis the LED blinking when it goes blank?10:14
CoderCandyNo, it blinks green when I kill lipstick10:14
Stskeeps:nod:10:14
CoderCandyotherwise it operates as intended10:14
Stskeepsfwiw killing lipstick might make the symptom worse over time10:14
CoderCandyHmm10:14
CoderCandyhow so?10:14
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Stskeepsi can wave my hands and say 'buggy framebuffer management in qualcomm' and you'd be okay with that?10:15
Stskeepsit doesn't like not cleaning up after yourself10:16
CoderCandyAhh10:17
CoderCandybut a reboot should... reset the problems?10:17
cb400fI've had the "blank screen" on unlock a couple of times.. the first time I rebooted... the second time, it seemed to snap out of it after I swiped down to sleep from the blank screen, and then tapped to wake up10:17
clauhmm, the messaging app just froze on me10:17
clauthough, I think I've seen this reported on TJC already10:17
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StskeepsCoderCandy: yes10:19
CoderCandySweet10:19
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CoderCandyI really hope the hard-power-off problem is software10:19
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CoderCandyIt would suck to need to send my phone in for repairs :(10:20
QuuStskeeps: uh btw, can i delete the "unsent whatever-log-thingies" so it wont notify about 300 unsent things? :p10:20
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StskeepsQuu: yes10:20
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Quuwhere/how? :)10:21
Quulifelogs?10:21
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StskeepsQuu: rm10:27
Stskeeps:P10:27
Quubut but what i need to delete? D:10:27
Stskeepsrcore.lzo probably10:28
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Quumakes sense. why didnt i figure that out.10:29
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stephghey Stskeeps how'd the talk go10:37
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Stskeepsstephg: good thanks10:39
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stephglooking forward to a video if one surfaces :)10:41
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jubo2I have no ringtone on incoming calls11:00
jubo2and yes the device is not on mute11:00
jubo2what's wrong?11:00
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claujubo2, check the ringtone volume both in settings *and* in your Ambience settings11:02
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Nokius1is any one running modrana / monav on a Jolla? there Mer//nemomobile bulids11:04
QuuNokius1: iirc some people talked about it here and installed it11:06
Quucant remember if they got it working or not11:06
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Nokius1okay obs says there a 2 erros in the bulid proces :-/11:06
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Nokius1may have to try to get in touch with the Project members11:08
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Nokius1Quu:  a the code is on github11:10
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Quuyeah noticed11:11
jubo2where can I access the "ambience"-settings ?11:11
Quuthere seems to be packages too, might try to install and test it11:11
Yanieljubo2: gallery11:11
Yanieland ringtone volume is on the first page of settings as well by default11:11
jubo2Yaniel: ringtone volume on max in ambience too11:12
jubo2I have zero ringtone on incoming calls..11:12
jubo2except in the headphones I can hear the ringtone if that helps11:12
Yanieloh you have headphones attached?11:15
jubo2Yaniel: The bug is with or without headphones attached11:15
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jubo2pretty major bug, unable to rely on the phone playing a ring-tone on incoming call11:17
Nokius1Quu: ? where? cant see them on the github page11:17
Quuhttp://modrana.org/trac/wiki/SystemDownloadEN#InstallationpackageforNemoMobile11:18
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Nokius1Quu:  saw this will try it later … no Jolla around11:20
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jubo2Halp me with my Finlan föyn. Nou ringtoun at ööl.11:24
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Nokius1Quu: thanks for your tips :D have nice one will report my resulte later today11:26
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QuuNokius1: np :)11:28
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Yanieljubo2: try again in an actual language?11:51
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QuuYaniel: "such problem. very annoy. wow."11:52
Quubetter?11:52
jubo2Yaniel: Finlan is what the chinese say11:52
jubo2or more like Fänlan if written in phonetic script11:52
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Yanieljubo2: and it was about the only word I recognized the first time I read it11:53
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Yanieland it would be Fēnlán11:54
YanielQuu: that is at least in use on the internet11:55
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javisailmeh to people impressed re wine on android12:17
javisailwe did that on n90012:17
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Yanielyay battery life is a lot better with 1.0.3.812:19
Yaniel100% -> 97% in 9h12:20
mikmaquite more if you celebrate it with heebo like i did12:21
Yanielhehe no12:21
Yanieljust idling12:21
Yanielwith wlan/3g off12:21
FireFlyMine went 8% → 0% in about an hour last thurdsay :\ (with tohd disabled)12:26
FireFlyThough I don't think the battery depletion is necessarily linear?12:26
FireFlyso I guess that's why12:26
friesehumm, mines at 94% right now, last charged 10 hours ago, basically idling with just 3g/w-lan on....12:26
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ShadowJKYou can probably expect the last percentages will be "sudden death"12:28
kehnoowhy would you run your phone that low anyway?12:29
FireFly..in which case getting a notification about low battery at 10% isn't terribly helpful :p12:29
kehnooI turn mine off when it gets to under 10% to preserve battery health12:29
FireFlyI was sitting around on a lecture and forgot that I left weechat over mosh open, running on 3G12:30
FireFly...until I noticed the phone was at like 10%, at which point I shut down everything and hoped it'd survive the rest of the lecture12:30
kehnooyeah, but I don't get people who charge their phones until it's in the low-10s :)12:31
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ShadowJKMine runs down to 3% iirc12:31
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ballockI've got some mp3 playback issues12:32
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ballockboth the built-in player and Sabas skip over parts of the track12:34
tbrI've had that too, also with ogg/vorbis files12:34
ballockonce seeked to the part that had issues it walks over correctly12:35
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ballockand damn, I got usrd to closing apps from the camera to the speaker12:35
ballock(i've just shutdown my mosh screen session runnng in landscape again)12:36
ballocktbr: 'had' sounds like past tense?12:37
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tbron my flight to brussels12:37
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tbrhaven't verified after upgrading to current version12:38
tbralso I had A2DP on, so not sure if that was related12:38
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ballockI had that on 1.0.2.5 and now on 1.0.3.8, no headsets12:39
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tbrwill try on my flight back12:39
tbrnow have a wired set of headphones from the Xen project ;)12:39
ballockbtw, once I press 'play' the counter stays at 0:00 value until I pause. Expect2d behaviour?12:40
ballockperhaps I should add some gstreamer plugin if the current one does not handle mp3s that well?12:41
* tbr ponders why "ssu s" claims 1.0.3.8, while GUI claims 1.0.2.5 and upgrade dialogue fails12:42
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ballock... weird. now the action of background/close is back to what it was in 1.0.2.5...12:43
friesetbr: xen project?12:44
tbrtime to hunt some food. bbl12:44
tbrfriese: swag from their FOSDEM table12:44
frieseah okay, nice :)12:44
friesemissed it this year :(12:44
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Nokius2Quu: there are also a packed with the habour Label in obs of modrana12:54
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QuuNokius2: ok, probably missed that one12:55
Nokius2Quu: https://build.merproject.org/package/show?package=harbour-modrana&project=home%3AMartinK%3Asailfish%3Amodrana12:55
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Quucool :)12:55
Nokius2rpm https://build.merproject.org/package/binaries?package=harbour-modrana&project=home%3AMartinK%3Asailfish%3Amodrana&repository=sailfish_1.0.2.5_armv7hl12:56
Siddedoes anyone know any progress to fixing the 22kHz mono-bug?12:56
Siddemany audiobooks are in that format and they are not working correctly. Lots of stuttering12:57
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jubo2Looks like I'm going to need to get a data-only package for the Jolla yks-piste-nolla and keep using my phone for phonethings12:59
jubo2I mean if turning the ringtone back on isn't happening then how can I use this as phone12:59
Quupretty sure you just user-error'd something12:59
Quuand blame it on the phone.13:00
jubo2Quu: I've checked that the sounds are on13:01
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Yanielthere are multiple "sounds on" settings13:01
jubo2Yaniel: I checked both in Gallery and in Settings13:01
Quudo you have the file in the phone? :p13:02
jubo2the phone does not ring13:02
Quuis the correct ambience set?13:02
jubo2Ambiance is just fine13:02
HarhaanJohtajasilent mode?13:02
Quudoes the ambience say that file is the ringtone?13:03
jubo2HarhaanJohtaja: checked gazillion tillion times from glow menu in up-screen13:03
kehnoocan you play the ringtone with the media app13:03
jubo2Quu: I haven't touched the settings13:03
Quuok. thats the problem.13:03
jubo2kehnoo: I don't have media app yet..13:03
Quuyou need to set the ringtone from ambience.13:04
jubo2Quu: remind meagain where do I find this "ambiance"13:05
jubo2ambiance != moods ?13:06
YanielGallery -> Ambiences13:06
Yanielor Tunnelma in finnish13:06
Nokius2Quu: see u later will try the rpm13:06
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jubo2Yaniel: It just gives possibility to star that Ambiance and the ringtone volume.. I don't see where I can access the settings13:07
Quumark it as favorite13:08
Quuor create one13:08
Quubecause you cant edit the default ones13:08
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Quuand if  you are using default, it might not have ringtone if you have messed with stuff13:09
Quuhence, user-error13:09
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javisailanyone planning to attend tracker's talk?13:11
jubo2Quu: I haven't messed anything.. I never touched the ringtone and now it doesn't play at all on incoming sms or call13:11
jubo2where is the settings for the ring tone.. well hidden prlly..13:12
Quujubo2: if you remove the tutorial-app, you will delete default ringtones13:12
Quuso just create the fucking ambience and test if it works13:12
AntiHawkHello, yesterday I was talking here about problem with my Jolla; Crashing every minute or two and sometimes it's just crashes and turns off and sometimes restarts. This usually happens when I'm using the phone, it doesn't matter what I do seldomly it crashes even when I'm not using the phone. Yesterday I was told here that I should take off the battery for 10 minutes and see how it goes after that; well yesterday crashes stop13:13
javisailbtw I got a 3rd uldate notification moments ago, it installed something and rebooted13:13
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Yanieljubo2: ringtone settings are in Settings -> System -> Sounds and Feedback13:14
Quuor just create the ambience, change the settings there and TADAH! it works without any problems13:15
jubo2Yaniel: looks like the files are gon13:15
Yanielthere you go13:15
jubo2Quu: where can I create one.. there is no glow menu in the Ambience selection screen13:15
kehnooAntiHawk, so it worked? :)13:15
Quujubo2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELMztxUHFjc13:15
Quujubo2: RTFM ok.13:16
AntiHawkBattery removal fixed temporally the problem, now it's on again...13:16
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jubo2how much memory does the Jolla have?13:20
jubo2I have an 16 gig sdhc card in mah old NOK phone but I want to keep it13:21
jubo2get a new card for this new phone13:21
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kehnooget good one and test it before using or you'll have strange behaviour, I had to swap mine because the previous one was fake13:22
jubo2It's not reasonable that accidentally or unknowingly closing the tutorial app kills urr tone collection into /dev/null13:23
Yanielit is a good idea to follow the instructions on screen13:23
Yanielor rtfm13:24
jubo2where is tfm?13:24
Yanielit is in the box13:24
* jubo2 goes to check the sales package13:24
Yaniellike the first thing you could not avoid seeing when you opened it13:24
Yanielin fact it is not possible to extract the phone from the box without either destroying the box or grabbing the manual13:25
kehnoosounds like a challenge!13:25
Yaniel(iirc)13:26
Yanielplease post results online13:26
Yanielwith pics13:26
attahFrack! Chromecasting netflix almost works from the jolla. All except for actual video.13:27
Yanielso about the font thing: http://i.imgur.com/kGZA7OT.jpg13:27
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AntiHawkkehnoo: I did the battery trick again and crashing stopped .. again :)13:28
kehnoowell, try longer next time, maybe the longer you keep it unplugged, the longer it works without crashing? :D13:28
AntiHawk:D13:29
Yanielthe difference is even more visible on the phone13:29
AntiHawkI will get an another unit if this doesn't stop and convert this one to do something else13:29
AntiHawkI have a digital led strip project in progress so that could have use for GUI device13:30
jubo2how do I get the lost ringtones and the tutorial app back ?13:31
Quujubo2: pkcon install jolla-starupwizard-tutorial13:32
jubo2Quu: and I run that where...? Shell? I dunno how to get to shell ..13:33
Yanielfactory reset then13:33
jubo2Yaniel: From the settings.. what kind of info will be lost.. not the phonebook I hope13:33
Quueverything will be lost13:34
Quuworld is going to end13:34
Yanieleverything13:34
FireFlyYaniel: size difference, you mean?13:35
YanielFireFly: size and colour intensity13:35
Yaniellatin looks much fainter/dimmer13:35
jubo2Next time put a red and yellow sticker "Accidentally or unknowingly closing the tutorial app all your default sound files WILL BE DELETED13:35
FireFlyYeah13:35
Yanieljubo2: that is not even the worst thing that could happen13:36
Yanielactually wait store works for you, right?13:36
kehnooYaniel, http://youtu.be/iJQ93VaXDX013:36
Yanielif so, then you can enable developer mode13:36
jubo2Yaniel: Jolla store works yeah13:36
Yanielkehnoo: hah, okay you win :D13:36
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QuuYaniel: gl with helping him trough that13:37
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YanielQuu: I have time13:37
Yaniel(not really)13:37
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jubo2Quu: where do I run 'pkcon install jolla-starupwizard-tutorial' ?13:39
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jubo2but that won't bring the deleted sounds back will it?13:40
Yanielin the terminal that got installed when you enabled dev mode13:40
jubo2Yaniel: but doesn't entering dev mode mean that more stuff is going to get broken ?13:41
jubo2or that I am at risk of doing something stupid unknowingly13:41
Yanielif you break it13:41
jubo2I've been on-and-off using Linux since '96 .. I think I could manage13:41
Yanielit is a basic bash shell that you are going to get13:41
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jubo2"Dev mode may nullify the guarantee."13:42
Yanielit allows you to do stuff that can do that13:43
Yanielthat's why there is a warning13:43
jubo2Yaniel: and I'm not going to do anything experimental13:43
Yanielyep13:43
jubo2and obviously need some shells13:43
Quujust buy iphone..13:43
tango_where if you fsck up you have no way to recover 8-D13:44
jubo2I has ssh server ?13:44
jubo2that's sorta impressive13:44
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Yanielhey openssh is one of the best things about this thing13:45
jubo2ait.. got Fingerterm 1.0.313:45
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jubo2rebooting phone..13:49
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jubo2Is there no other way to get the sound files back besides putting factory defaults13:50
Yanielreinstall the tutorial app13:51
MorphyDoes anyone else have this problem with their Jolla: When trying to unlock the phone, all that happens is that the screen backlight activates but the screen remains blank, and the phone has to be restarted in order to be used?13:51
Yanielas you just were told13:51
jubo2Yaniel: I did that13:52
Yanieldid it succeed?13:52
QuuMorphy: someone said to do the app-close-wipe13:52
jubo2Yaniel: yes13:52
MorphyQuu: Thanks, worked like a charm13:52
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Yanielanother thing to try would be to detach and reattach the other half while the phone is on13:52
Yanieland unlocked13:52
Yaniel(attach while unlocked)13:52
Yanielthat should prompt you to reinstall the ambience contained on it13:53
Yanielwhich has ringtones AFAIK13:53
jubo2Yaniel: removing and attaching TOH does nothing13:54
jubo2once it worked13:54
jubo2it asked if I want snow white ambiance and installed it13:54
jubo2other then that the TOH ain't speaking to me13:54
Raimshouldn't you see the Snow White ambience in the store then?13:55
StskeepsMy talk from FOSDEM'14: releases.merproject.org/~carsten/SailfishFOSDEM2014_vfinal.pdf , http://releases.merproject.org/~carsten/niceview.png13:55
Raimbut... hm, that won't bring back the other default ambiences13:55
QuuRaim: no, it wont13:56
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Stskeepshttp://releases.merproject.org/~carsten/SailfishFOSDEM2014_vfinal.pdf for those wanting to be able to click :P13:56
Quuinstalling the tutorial app fixes all of it13:56
jubo2I call friend to call me13:56
jubo2he no answer13:58
Quujubo2: please, just create new clean ambience and do the settings on it.13:58
PeperJohnnyStskeeps: will there be a livestream or a recording of the talks?13:59
StskeepsPeperJohnny: there's a recording of it but it takes a few weeks to appear typically13:59
jubo2I'm running a 1 minute timer to see if the sound files are back13:59
PeperJohnnyStskeeps: ok looking forward to it14:00
jubo2timer sound is back14:00
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jubo2I assume the ringtone as well14:00
Quuand this shit took almost 2h to fix \o/14:01
Quuhurray14:01
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jubo2I like that I have bash14:15
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jubo2How do I access the sshd of the phone from the internet ?14:15
NokiusQuu: is installable and runs but looks like TODO is needed |modraba14:16
Siddejubo2: use a public internet adress for the phone or port forward a port to your phone14:16
Yanielsettings->developer mode shows your ip14:17
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QuuNokius: neat, probably will wait some time then :)14:17
Yanieland allows to set a password14:17
jubo2and then I do 'sudo rm -rf /' right?14:17
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jubo2kiddin' kiddin'14:18
NokiusQuu: Yes but its working so time will bring us the next feature like navigation14:18
Nokius:D14:18
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rangoyjubo2: No, use "devel-su; rm -rf /"14:19
Yanielwithout the ;14:19
jubo2what is difference between 'su' and 'devel-su' ?14:19
Yanieldevel-su is the equivalent of sudo on sailfish14:19
jubo2'k gotcha14:20
faenilo/14:20
jubo2hiya faenil14:20
javispadhelo14:21
stephgStskeeps: thx14:21
Yanielehlo14:21
CoderCandyOkay, so 4g is battery intensive?14:22
CoderCandyHow do I hacktivate it?14:22
Yanieldunno about battery intensive14:22
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Yanielbut horribly broken I have heard14:22
CoderCandyI'm trying to drain as much battery as I can atw14:23
CoderCandyatm*14:23
StskeepsYaniel: broken?14:23
jubo2The ability to have many timers is really helpful in cooking tasks14:23
Yanielwell people have said that it is no good idea to enable it14:23
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YanielCoderCandy: install python ;)14:23
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Yanielthen run something like while True: pass14:23
CoderCandyeh, I could try14:24
Yanielor random.randint14:24
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CoderCandyHmm, yeah14:26
jubo2The Jolla Ykspistenolla needs protective cover that doubles as a triangle shaped stand to show the phone in landscape form14:26
CoderCandyI'm trying to figure out if my hard-poweroff problems are due to high powerusage14:27
kehnooI tried to get that 3G/4G switcher but the Install button just doesn't work14:28
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jubo2is there support for bluetooth keyboards like the folds-into-your-suit-inner-pocket http://www.amazon.co.uk/VERBATIM-97872-Wireless-Bluetooth-Keyboard/dp/B006ITE9OK/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1391351799&sr=8-1&keywords=verbatim+foldable+keyboard14:38
jubo2If I'da designed this product I'd make it so that the Bluetooth is turned on whenever the keyboard is opened14:39
CoderCandywell, does not look like battery usage is related to hard poweroffs14:40
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CoderCandyI.14:40
CoderCandyI'm currently testing removing android14:41
QuuCoderCandy: everything has been tested14:41
Quueven with fresh device (not updated, nothing installed) it happens14:41
CoderCandyHmm, have we came to any conclusions?14:42
Quuno. :)14:42
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Quupeople claim to have find stuff on together.* but day later they post "oh, it happened again"14:43
Quui cant write.14:43
CoderCandywell then, I'll just continue debugging14:43
Quuiirc, it only happens when screen is on and you have touched the screen after the screen turned on14:43
CoderCandyI mean, it can't hurt, ecen if it won't lead to anything14:44
Quutrue true14:44
CoderCandyYeah, I've noticed that toi14:44
CoderCandytoo*14:44
jubo2That verbatim middle-foldable bluetooth kbrd comes with US setup, not gonna work out for entering Finnish14:45
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CoderCandyAnd from what I can tell it feels like a deeply rooted software problem14:45
jubo2at £76 there clearly is demand for competition in this category14:45
CoderCandysince removing/reinserting battery makes it work for a while14:46
QuuCoderCandy: yes, i think its kernel or gpu-drivers14:46
CoderCandyand then gradually getting worse14:46
CoderCandy(sometimes I can't ecen enter pin...)14:46
CoderCandyeven*14:46
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CoderCandyWell, I have mu hopes up for a fix :P14:49
CoderCandymy14:49
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CoderCandy(as opposed to it being hardware error and nothing would be doable about it)14:50
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CoderCandyWell, I'll be looning out for more info15:08
CoderCandylooking*15:08
CoderCandyFor now... I hace to live with battery hack-thing15:08
CoderCandyhave*15:08
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Nicd-http://mustaheppa.sarjakuvablogit.com/2014/02/02/kaikki-muuttuu-mikaan-ei-muutu/ kinda related :)15:20
jubo2I think this would be a nice phone if I got the Yandex store and email working and a really user-friendly calendar I could edit on computer and view in phone15:20
Nicd-translation: ennen=before, nyt=now15:20
Nicd-jubo2: it already has google calendar sync15:21
Nicd-and exchange calendar sync15:21
jubo2Nicd-: I don't have access to a exchange server15:22
Nicd-caldav is supposed to be coming at some point in the future15:22
jubo2osoite.fi would be selling it for 5€ / month 1st 12 months and 10€ after taht15:22
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newinchem|st: my connection to account is solved: the phone date was set to 2013 instead of 2014 so the ssl handshake was failing16:10
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SpeedEvilnewin: :)16:19
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clauI just hit the connection looping problem and only a reboot fixed it :(16:38
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clauI do hope we'll see soon a fix for the important things: at the least this connection looping and the messaging app freeze16:39
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Quuclau: iirc airplane mode fixes connection problems16:45
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clauQuu, I'll keep that in mind, thanks16:46
clauthough, it was quite difficult working with it. the UI was lagging badly.16:47
Quuokay, that might be another problem then16:48
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JommiHi all. is it ok to ask questions in finnish  here?16:51
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Yanielyou may or may not get an answer16:53
Yanielenglish is the preferred language16:53
Jommiright, this is the brother in law's account, he doesnt speak english, so lets see how he gets  on.16:54
Yanielyou can translate for him if necessary ^^16:55
Jommiyep16:55
* artemma seems to remember that swearing in Russian worked fine here16:55
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tango_I thought everybody up there north could speak english16:57
TurskiJommi: check #jollasuomi16:58
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ln-tango_: everybody except those who don't16:59
petantikwhat does a rapidly blinking green light mean on the jolla?16:59
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ajaijjajpetantik: it's missed call17:01
ajaijjajaccording to http://jolla.com/guide/17:01
petantikajaijjaj: hmm, i thought it might have been that, but there were no mised calls, and my phone froze up.17:02
tango_ln-: figures17:03
ajaijjajpetantik: looks like a bug. It could be that you missed a call, but there is no record of it, apart from the blinking17:03
petantikajaijjaj: Ahh. okay.17:03
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ajaijjajpetantik: take a look at https://together.jolla.com/question/22783/bug-green-led-blinking-phone-yammed/17:05
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jubo2where can I look at the logs regarding the email-not-working issue17:12
claujournalctl17:12
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jubo2I need my home box and my school box accessible17:13
clauwhat is the problems more specifically?17:13
jubo2clau: it says something like "Unable to sync"17:13
clauproblem*17:13
jubo2no inbox available17:13
clauhave you tried changing the settings?17:13
jubo2I've the IMAP password correct for sure and I'da left the SMTP username and password blank but that did not let me to proceed17:14
clautry journalctl -a -f17:14
jubo2How primitive can you be that you don't have red asterisk to indicate required fields17:14
claushould give you the log17:15
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claunot sure how much info you get though; at some point in the past I could get full IMAP exchange, but I think that went away with some update17:17
jubo2clau:  "Showing user generated messages only. Users in the group 'adm' can see all messages. Pass -q to turn this message off."17:17
claudevel-su first17:17
jubo2how can I ctrl-KEY ?17:17
jubo2I want ctrl-c, ctrl-d and whathaveyou..17:17
jubo2ctrl-z17:18
Pnuutry: ctrl + key17:18
Pnuu:-P17:18
jubo2Pnuu: right.. my bad again17:18
jubo2did not try if the ctrl is sticky17:18
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jubo2You guys need professional help17:19
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faenilStskeeps: you around?17:19
jubo2that's why I'ma apply to work for DNA17:19
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jubo2Chathelp is so superior to phone help that one can paste URLs17:19
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Stskeepsfaenil: see sms17:20
jubo2So I apply with open letter to any position and perhaps as DNA webshop customer shopper service as my proposition for entry level title17:20
jubo2How much hardship one is supposed to experience for rooting for the FLOSS underdog ?17:22
jubo2But there are some awesome features in the phone17:23
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EztranPreferably no hardship, but it'll take time to get there, and we won't if nobody rooted for 'em in the first place.17:23
jubo2#1 the cursor focusing in the zoomed view to make placing cursor easier17:23
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jubo2#2 sshd is also coolness in föyns17:24
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jubo2Eztran: I've been with the same operator ( DNA ) for 13 yrs this April17:25
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EztranDon't see operator loyalty much these days :)17:26
jubo2Eztran: I've never been turned down when I've phoned their customer service to ask for discounts based on customer loyalty and lost free minutes and sms'es that I'da gotten if I was operator hopping all the time17:26
EztranCan't argue with that.17:27
jubo2One awesom 12:08 phone call to operator got me 12 x 20 discount17:27
jubo2now that's what I call earnings if you get 240€ for a 12:08 phone call17:27
jubo2I was like: "Pricing base is aged. Gib discount:"17:28
jubo2they were like "I'll see what I can do..."17:28
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jubo2then he sez I can get -50% on my sms, calls über-program17:29
jubo2Now I've upgraded to unlimited sms + minutes account17:29
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jubo2what kind of daemons I can start on my phone ?17:30
jubo2sshd is quite the coolness in early 201417:30
Yanielwhatever you have installed17:30
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jubo2anonymized location based walking servers would be pretty awesome17:31
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jubo2"Find notes in the neighbourhood." in the glow menu17:31
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jubo2anyone could stick a note to any geographical object17:32
Yanielyay for digital vandalism17:32
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jubo2then one could explore them like: "Find notes with #goodrestaurant" in the neighborhood"17:32
jubo2they have time and location data17:33
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* jubo2 gets the leipäjuusto and farine sugar out, drool's at mikkoh's machine17:36
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jubo2Jolla Oy..17:40
jubo2Start making those foldable bluetooth keyboards17:40
jubo2a normal standart 270mm AAPL keyboard ( or with the genius idea of Sam sung to move the <> keys to the right side of space bar to have it map with our wetware firmware properly17:41
jubo2that fit's in a suits's pocket17:41
jubo2You have manufacturing capacity available in China17:42
jubo2If an English set up foldable bluetooth keyboard costs £76 that reads there is money to be made in these17:43
jubo2Verbatim seems to be one of the few available foldable keyboard17:43
jubo2that and the 3-joint front cover that also works as triangle that keeps your device at an angle in the other position and you've got a killer minimalist on-the-road computational solution17:46
jubo2can you see it?17:48
jubo2I can see stuff a kid could see17:48
jubo2there is not demand for this in the working market17:48
jubo2are you going to get into phone protective and functional padding solutions or are you going to let Golla et al take care of that market?17:49
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Abby24 I give you some pictures. I hope you like! http://bit.do/my_videos6917:49
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sejo1/617:53
QuuAard ^17:53
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gabriel9why cant i see jolla in my linux?17:57
gabriel9how to mount it?17:57
ggabrielgabriel9: it uses mtp, so you need something that talks that protocol17:58
gabriel9like android?17:59
ggabrielyup17:59
ggabriel(i think, i don't have android)17:59
EztranYeah, Android devices often do these days.17:59
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gabriel9strange17:59
YanielI prefer sshfs ^^18:00
gabriel9i can see nexus 718:00
gabriel9but jolla not18:00
EztranCould try simple-mtpfs or similar.18:00
gabriel9:/18:00
ggabrielfwiw, it works on mine18:00
EztranYaniel: just started using sshfs for my N9 last night, wondering why I ever went for another solution :)18:01
ggabrielbtw, is there a link to the recording of Stskeeps's talk yet?18:01
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gabriel9i only saw some presentation from that mer dude18:01
Tofeggabriel: I guess they'll put that in place tomorrow18:01
ggabrielta18:01
Tofebut it was recorded, for sure18:01
gabriel9it says sync and connect in use18:02
gabriel9hm18:02
Quuggabriel: he said it might take ~week18:03
ggabrielQuu: understandable, it took me 3 weeks to edit my holidays video :P18:03
ggabrieljust give me the raw option :D18:03
Tofeggabriel: it would take a week to download it anyway ;)18:04
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ggabrielTofe: i've got decent internet, i don't have enough storage for what i can potentially download in a week ;-)18:08
ggabrielbut yeah, looking forward to it18:09
Tofelucky you18:09
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gabriel9anyone uses18:33
gabriel9KDE MTP KIO Slave18:33
gabriel9for mtp18:33
Tofegabriel9: for info, I've used my Jolla (latest update) with my gnome without problem today to retrieve some photos18:36
mornfallhm, the mail check bug is not fixed btw.18:37
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gabriel9in the end i just used ssh18:43
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Jommihow does one turn on the landscape orientation for browser`? Just updated and it doesnt seem to happen?18:50
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clauit should be working, nothing extra should be needed18:52
Jommihrm, weird, just needed a restart18:53
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Sail0rare there any numbers how much jolla was sold ?19:06
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claudon't think so. and for some reasons I have yet to understand, this kind of information is secret. it's like companies are afraid not to jinx it.19:14
EztranThat could well be the reason.19:14
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clauI think maybe all MBA's are taught this in school, out of inertia. And the original reason is that it's safer to keep as much financial information secret, just in case you want to do some tax evasion. ;)19:16
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EztranI was being somewhat sarcastic originally, but inertia might not be far from the truth. That and this sort of thing can be tied up in contracts with other companies.19:20
Quuiirc there was news article about them hoping to sell total of 20k units before year ends19:22
clautied up, as in they are forced to keep some information from the public?19:22
EztranPretty much, yeah. Might not be the case with the sales numbers, but it has been for other figures they haven't revealed.19:23
EztranAnd even when you are allowed to disclose stuff, it might not be 'good business' to do so, so we're back around to inertia.19:24
tango_hm I think I read somewhere that they were in the order of the hundred of thousands, but wish I remember where I read about it19:30
tango_anyway19:30
tango_is the arrow to hide the keyboard a new thing in 1.0.3.8? Don't remember it from before19:30
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Quuwell, there were about 13k clock/android support installs 2 weeks ago19:30
Quuthat doesnt say much, but.19:30
EztranIt's a guideline as to magnitude, at least.19:31
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Quuindeed.19:31
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gabriel9if there is some Serbs here i created Serbian Cyrillic keyobard. :)19:44
gabriel9https://bitbucket.org/gabriel9/sailfish-serbian-keyboard19:44
sejodoes anyone know if jroivas is on twitter?19:45
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clautango_, what arrow?20:04
tango_clau: oh apparently it's a clock thing20:05
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tango_if you are setting the name of an alarm, there's a down arrow instead of the enter key to close the keyboard20:06
clauyes, I see what you mean20:06
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clauthough, having a button just for hiding the vkb wouldn't fit very well with the UI philosphy20:07
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EztranMmm... what happened to Harmattan's 'swipe keyboard down to close'? Conflicts with pulley menu or something, maybe?20:18
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Stskeepsi thought you could do this20:19
tango_clau: how so?20:19
clauyou can, of course.20:19
SageEztran: works for me at least20:19
claudrag it down from somewhere around the 't' key20:19
TurskiEztran: nothing? works fine20:20
clauin fact, it works from anywhere.20:20
EztranOK, cheers. Just an arrow there to avoid confusion, I guess?20:20
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Tegunot from the suggestion bar for example20:20
FireFlyI don't see any arrow20:21
clauthere isn't20:21
clautango_, Saillfish OS is about gestures.20:23
tango_clau: yeah but a kb is a kb20:23
EztranFireFly: when setting alarms, see scrollback. I was confused as it seemed like duplicating the effect of a swipe down.20:23
Turskitango_: button just to hide kb would be waste of space20:23
HarhaanJohtajai always tried to do that from the suggestion bar or whatever it is20:23
tango_Turski: but not having a way to hide it is extremely annoying20:24
claubut you have a way.20:24
clauin fact, two:20:24
clau1) you drag it down20:24
Turskitango_: you have a way20:25
clau2) you touch something outside of the keyboard, in most apps20:25
tango_wait you can drag the kb down?20:25
Turskitango_: i don't see any problem20:25
clausay, in browser you tap on the page, and the kb goes away20:25
FireFlyYes20:25
Turskitango_: that's what we've been talking about here20:25
tango_since when?20:25
EztranSince... Harmattan, actually.20:25
FireFly1.0.0.5 I think20:25
FireFlyat least20:25
clauyes, this works on N9 too.20:26
clauthough, I must confess, I liked more the looks of N9 vkb, with separated buttons.20:26
tango_hm it doesn't work for me?20:26
Turskisure it does20:26
claualso, I must say that the vibra was crisper on N9, and it gave a better feedback on keypresses.20:27
gabriel9it works here also20:27
HarhaanJohtajastart it from the top row of the keyboard20:27
tango_oh wait20:27
gabriel9just swipe from t20:27
tango_I managed20:27
clau\o/20:27
gabriel9:D20:27
tango_I was dragging from the clipboard/suggest thingie20:27
TeguI guess everybody tries to naturally drag it from the suggestion bar or the empty space and not from the keys20:27
tango_and it doesn't work that way20:27
tango_yeah20:27
tango_you have to grag from the actual keys20:27
EztranThat or doesn't notice the gesture at all.20:27
Teguit would be useful if it worked from the bar too20:27
tango_true20:28
FireFlyI agree20:28
clauthe first suggestion on the suggestion bar should be "don't drag me, it won't do what you think it does"20:28
EztranHeh.20:28
tango_but mostly I would say nobody notices it20:28
tango_clau: lol20:28
EztranIt's a bit of a hidden gesture, certainly. Is it in the Guide?20:28
kehnooall this talk about bars makes me thirsty20:28
Tegu"but drag me sideways"20:28
tango_sideways?20:28
FireFlyFor more suggestions20:28
tango_Eztran: it's not20:28
clauhahahah20:28
clautango_, just like on N9, you may get more suggestions than can fit in the bar, so you can scroll it sideways20:29
EztranIt's a Treasure in the IM section... 'To send the keyboard away, just pull down on the keys.'20:29
clauI will have to re-read the guide, just in case I missed something important.20:29
EztranSMS/IM, that is. Good ol' combined messages.20:29
tango_a treasutre?20:30
clauEztran, I wish I could filter them somehow.20:30
clautango_, have a look at the guide :)20:30
FireFlyYeah, I was fairly sure I'd seen it in the guide..20:30
clauthings will become more clear20:30
tango_pretty sure I did at the time20:30
tango_if by guide you mean the tutorial20:30
EztranMmm. In Harmattan (I've gotta stop referencing that), tapping the top bar lets you sort by message type. Hopefully, that functionality'll land in the Jolla too.20:30
clauEztran, like on harmattan.20:30
FireFlyNo, http://jolla.com/guide/20:30
clauEztran, exactly.20:31
EztranShouldn't be too hard to add, I guess.20:31
clauthere are tons of little things that would greately improve the overall exeprience.20:31
EztranActually, is that on TJC? Probably is, but if not it should be.20:31
tango_I thought sailfish was more squarely based on harmattan/meego20:32
clauI am starting to lose my faith in tjc. It's impossible to browser it anymore.20:32
FireFlySpeaking of which, I wonder if allow-keyboard-close-from-suggestion-bar is on TJC20:32
tango_apparently it was less than I thought20:32
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Tegusounds like harmattan is actually better20:32
Tegu(haven't used it)20:32
clauand whatever I search for, I'll find N closed duplicates on it.20:32
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FireFlyWell it was more mature, wasn't it?20:32
EztranIt's pretty closely based on MeeGo, but that doesn't really mean Harmattan20:32
attahStskeeps: I have a hard time deciding.. wiki post or not? :S20:32
tango_from the videos I've seen of the N9 it definitely has some points over SOS20:32
EztranFireFly: Yeah, exactly. It'd had time to get those features in, Sailfish hasn't.20:33
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tango_Eztran: well if it was based off it it would20:33
Stskeepsattah: up to you20:33
tango_(why isn't it?)20:33
EztranHarmattan had some closed-source bits in it that they didn't get IIRC, for one.20:33
clauyes, Harmattan was more mature.20:34
clauThere are features on Harmattan that are still missing on Sailfish.20:34
EztranIt was never given a chance... but hey, that's why Sailfish should be given one.20:34
attahstskeeps: that's the problem.. i have a hard time assessing the benefits and/or drawbacks... I guess i'll go no-wiki to begin with.. and people can whine in the comments20:34
clauBut I'm sure it's just a matter of time until Sailfish gets to the same level.20:34
EztranNo doubt they have the expertise to get it there.20:35
clauthough, I hope the speed will increase :)20:35
clauI don't mean to offend, it's clear the devels are working at full capacity.20:36
kelvanblack screen and fast red blinking is a kernel panic?20:36
kelvanjust got one this evening while connecting to a wifi20:37
Teguhm, are there any patents giving trouble btw?20:37
Stskeepsno, kernel panic would be a total death / reboot20:37
Stskeeps:P20:37
kelvanStskeeps: so not like any normal pc?20:37
Stskeepskelvan: correct20:38
kelvanso it's just a complete f*ckup error? :)20:38
clauhey Stskeeps, do you ever sleep? :D20:38
Stskeepsit's obviously morsing you "help, i'm stuck in a jolla phone"20:38
Stskeeps:P20:38
HarhaanJohtajasleep at work20:39
EztranWork in sleep.20:39
Stskeepskelvan: if there's no item already at together.jolla.com, file one please20:39
Stskeepstag 'bug'20:39
kelvanmaby it's something android specific, a friends android phone also did some strange red blinking20:39
claukelvan, I take it you cannot bring the screen on anymore?20:40
kelvanclau: had to remove battery20:40
clauI see20:40
kelvannever happened before20:41
kelvanbut just installed the upgrade yesterday20:41
Stskeepskelvan: a hard shutdown with holding down power button next time20:41
kelvantwice ...20:41
kelvanStskeeps: tried it for about 10 seconds then my finger hurt20:41
attahhttps://together.jolla.com/question/23197/umts-and-other-connetion-optimizations/20:42
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attahtoo geeky?20:42
Stskeepsattah: looks good20:42
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EztranLike the warning at the top :)20:42
attah:)20:42
kelvanafter reboot connection worked, but i'm not sure if I typed guiness or guinness as password (7 chars should be to short as pw if i'm correct)20:42
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clauI suggest you change the password now :D20:43
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FireFlyI added the keyboard-swipedown-from-suggestions-bar thing to Together FWIW20:43
clauany news on Swype kb?20:44
clauon N9 I used it almost all the time.20:45
kelvanclau: it's the password of the o'reilys pub in brussels ;)20:45
clauit's much easier to use with just one hand20:45
kelvanif anybody still in brussels and wants to reproduce, they have good burgers ;)20:46
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EztranSwype being a commercial product...20:47
Stskeepsswype is Nuance's isn't it?20:48
clauhttp://www.swype.com/20:48
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EztranInternet says yes.20:49
FireFlyDo they have a patent for the technique (slide between letters to type)?20:49
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clauI would bet they have.20:49
FireFly:(20:49
Stskeepswell, we already use nuance XT920:50
claubut that's not the point, you don't want to implement it from scratch. you want to convince them to port it.20:50
clau(was answering to FireFly)20:50
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Stskeepsor pay, tbh20:50
FireFlyFair enough20:50
clauStskeeps, this http://www.nuance.com/for-business/by-product/xt9/index.htm ?20:50
Stskeepsyeah20:50
EztranSome Android companies use their own implementations of similar keyboards... quite possible they're paying license fees, though, I guess.20:51
clauwhat about this? --> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1KhZKNZO8mQ20:53
clauGmail Tap :D20:53
clauStskeeps, btw... is there a way to clean the prediction cache without breaking anything?20:54
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clauI somehow managed to get into predictions some words with typos, and they keep on popping up.20:55
Stskeepsclau: mm, i don't know20:55
clauI'll have a look on tjc20:56
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clauI'm calling it a day. Good night everyone.20:59
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pdanekhttp://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?s=981619f171a0f346503dfe270ff72555&t=91142&page=174 --> post: "i wonder whether the neo900 will beat the north-american-jolla." --> I didn't get it with north-american, am I missing something?21:13
Stskeepserr.. what north american jolla21:14
EztranI'd guess they're just referring to the Jolla's sales in NA in an odd way.21:14
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Quuprobably the version with proper bands21:14
Quusomething not n-sync21:15
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pdanekah I got it21:16
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slateneo900 board was estimated to 700-900 EUR? or USD?21:22
attah^madness21:23
Stskeepswell, sometimes good to support open hardware21:23
slatecant afford with those amounts, not even if I wanted to. :)21:24
attahtrue.. and maybe i'm mistaken.. i think it's just the mobo.. but maybe it was more stuff?21:24
slateI think only the mobo.21:24
slateLets read again21:25
FireFlySeems like a reasonable-ish price to me, considering the low amount of sales21:25
slate"According to current estimations, the cost of motherboard should be somewhere between 500 and 700 EUR. Complete device will cost 100-150 EUR more, depending on prices and availability of N900 spare parts"21:25
slateI got some n900's so no prob.21:25
kehnooit still has regular n900 screen?21:26
slateN900 spares will cost a shitload.21:26
slatekehnoo: yes.21:26
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attahCool and admirable.. but not for me...21:27
slateOverclocked N900 will be enough for me21:28
slateFor my use, faster cpu, faster gpu, more ram and LTE wont be worth the money. But I do know some hardcore N900 users who defo will buy it.21:30
attahbut what makes it so much better than a jolla with HW-keyboard? (except being more open)21:31
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slateNothing, if the hw-keyboards will be factory-quality21:32
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slateFor example, flex-cables without decent testing makes me a bit sketchy.21:33
slateSeen too many broken flexes even with testing21:33
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Abby29 I give you some pictures. I hope you like! http://bit.do/my_videos6922:03
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EztranThe sad bit is, the link suggests they're treating this as a legitimate marketing campaign.22:05
attahAnd they will think it is woking if people click on it...22:06
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EztranHaven't yet. Plenty have, though.22:07
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QuuAard: that porn-spam-bot came here again. 2 times in last 6 hours.22:07
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pdanekQuu: Maybe it was trolling Stskeeps.22:08
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Quuanything is possible, but i doubt it22:09
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slateHmm, offering 1.0.3.8 after boot. Same thing continues?22:34
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tmynttinyep, same here22:39
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cvphi22:45
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* artemma got his Jolla-related blogging started eventually. First post - a proposal for improving the closing gesture detection for not so large hands.. as mine - http://www.codingsubmarine.com/jolla-closing-gesture-how-to-make-it-better/23:35
artemmaOr just vote for a shorter version right at together - https://together.jolla.com/question/23287/let-the-app-closing-gesture-start-from-the-top-of-the-side-edges-and-let-it-be-not-precisely-vertical-too/23:36
ln-codingsubmarine... nice23:42
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Dima^_artemma: good point23:56
artemmaDima^_: go vote and let the others know :)23:56
artemmawith Together portal, I guess a wave of votes, comments and tweets is the best way for getting this or that feature implemented23:57
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Dima^_voted23:58
artemmaCool! Thanks, Dima^_23:59
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