#jollamobile log for Sunday, 2014-12-21

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TofeStskeeps: what about checking the uefi password (if that ever exists) against the SIM pin code ?09:30
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Yanielnice idea09:31
Tofe(if there's no SIM, then there's no unlock, let's say)09:31
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Tofenice, but maybe not realistic: it may be that it would require some drivers to work09:32
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Yanielyeah09:32
Yanielwhat about sims without a PIN set?09:32
Tofewell, then, why having uefi secured ? :)09:33
Yanieltrue09:33
YanielI wonder how many people these days don't bother setting a pin09:33
Yanielearlier sim cards at least had one by default09:34
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temmi_mooif the phone is stolen, it is on and can be used to call09:34
Tofethe pin is not very invasive: you put it once, and then never reboot09:34
Tofetemmi_moo: if it is on, then it doesn't check against uefi anyway09:35
Tofethe discussion being on how to unlock uefi without throwing uefi security away09:35
temmi_mooah09:36
Tofe(I agree the topic of the discussion was kindof never said :) )09:36
TofeYaniel: the latest sim I received, one year ago, had one by default too09:37
Yanielmine didn't09:38
temmi_mooi like to be able to boot without a sim09:40
Yanielbooting is one thing09:40
Yanielbut entering uefi settings another09:40
temmi_mooso you'd need the same sim than was used to make the settings09:41
temmi_moohow would you replace that sim?09:41
Yanielobviusly you should be able to boot & use the device without a sim09:41
temmi_mooso how would you go on to replace that sacred and special sim with another one?09:42
Tofetemmi_moo: you have a point here09:43
Yanielunlock, replace, lock?09:44
Yanielnot exactly ideal09:44
TofeYaniel: that would make selling quite unfriendly09:45
Yanielyeah09:45
temmi_moowhat if the sacred sim breaks?09:45
temmi_moono unlocking any more09:45
Tofeok, associating with the sim isn't such a great idea after all09:45
Yaniel!next09:45
Merbot`Yaniel: Error: "next" is not a valid command.09:45
Tofeso, back to another master passcode09:45
Yaniel:P09:45
Tofethe problem being what to chose "by default", when received from Jolla09:46
Tofexritten on the box, next to the IMEI code?09:46
Tofethen what if the user throws away the box09:47
temmi_moopossibly also stored in the jolla hq?09:47
Tofestoring passwords plain is rarely a good idea09:47
temmi_moowell09:47
Yanielnothing and prompt user at first boot?09:47
temmi_mooit could be the public key of a keypair where the secret never leaved the jolla device09:47
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temmi_mooso the public one is just not world-public but known to jolla and whoever buys the phone09:48
temmi_mooalso printed next to imei09:48
Tofetemmi_moo: ah, a pgp approach looks promising09:48
temmi_mooi'm fighting with a similar topic now09:48
Yanielbetter, yes09:48
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temmi_moohow to make a small embedded device fresh with mf firmware find out who is the master controller in a local network where it has no knowledge of the network09:49
temmi_mooto establish who is a good guy and who are polish script kiddies09:49
temmi_mooalso how to tell the local controller that i'm not a script kiddie but a legit new device09:49
Yanielhehe, fun times09:50
Yanielbut yeah public key stuff hmm...09:50
temmi_mooin modern times the script kiddies are already everywhere, even in local wired networks09:50
Yanieleveryone is a script koddie until proven otherwise09:50
Yanielkiddie even09:51
TofeI wonder why would the public key be more safe than a simple password09:51
temmi_mooi'm trying to prevent my devices from being another stuxxnet amplifier or part of a future cuckoo's egg story09:51
Tofeif it is as hard to get as a plain password stored at jolla09:52
Yanielwhy store it at jolla in the first place?09:53
Tofeif the user throws away the box with the key09:53
temmi_moothe input method could be camera so you could have relevant length in the passphrase09:53
temmi_mootext input is annoying especially if said text is to be a good passphrase09:54
Yanielqr unlock codes? :D09:54
temmi_mooyes09:54
Tofewhy not09:54
Tofebut then it's at bootloader level, having the camera working there could be quite difficult09:54
temmi_mooah09:54
Yanielthat could be used to unlock the bootloader from inside the OS though09:54
temmi_moodunno, depends, possibly09:54
temmi_moothese devices are a bit more complex than a c-6409:55
TofeYaniel: you're right, no need to be in uefi09:55
Yanieland if you want to unlock it from fastboot/recovery mode whatever you know enough to copy&paste from your jolla account09:55
Tofewell, I guess, at least09:55
TofeYaniel: but we're still in the "device stolen" scenario09:56
Yanielyes?09:57
Yanielyou get the qr code either from the box or via your web browser - after logging in with your jolla account09:58
temmi_mooindeed09:58
Yanielif the phone is stolen tey'd have to log in to your jolla account on some pc/other09:58
Yanielor find the box09:58
Yanielfor bonus points the code could be changed every time it is used via the web09:58
Yanielie the device uploads a new code after accepting it09:59
Tofelooks good, let me think a bit :)09:59
Yanielessentially this would mean that the device uploads its code along with imei and whatever upon registration10:00
TofeYaniel: maybe that's a bit too complex for the need10:01
Yanielmaking the code single-use?10:02
Tofeyes10:02
Yanielyeah10:02
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Tofeafter all, if the tablet is stolen, having a locked uefi doesn't prevent from booting it10:03
Tofejust keeps the firmware safe, so no backdoor there10:03
Yanielwhat about when the phone is sold10:03
Yanielmaybe add an option to generate a new key after authenticating?10:04
Tofewell, you need to show that you bought the device in some way10:05
Yanielor even do it automatically when registering the device to a new jolla account10:05
Tofethe only difference between sold and stolen is that the seller can give information about the product10:06
Yanielyes10:06
temmi_moohaving the device register a new key presumes having a network connection10:06
Yanielthe seller can give information to anyone10:06
TofeYaniel: the seller might give an "account closure" code to the buyer10:07
Yanielhmm?10:07
Tofemmmh no, that's too strong10:08
Tofejust an account transmission code10:08
YanielI mean if we assume a malicious seller10:08
Yanielthey could write down the code10:08
Yanielsell the device and then sell the code to some 3rd party10:08
Tofemalicious, i.e. stole the device?10:08
temmi_moomalicious as in wanting evil things for the next owner10:09
Yanielunlikely but not ruled out10:09
Tofeah, no, you get the code from your jolla account10:09
temmi_moothe previous owner should be gotten rid of during a legit transaction10:09
Tofetemmi_moo: if he wants evil things, if will succeed, whatever the security.10:09
Yanielyes10:09
Yanielincluding lock codes10:09
Tofehe*10:09
Tofeso, to make it short, a proposal would be an uefi unlock code stored in your jolla account and associated to a given device, right?10:11
Yanielyes10:11
Yanielmy point is that after a legit sale the previous owner should not know the lock code10:11
temmi_mooyes and yes10:11
TofeStskeeps: ^10:11
temmi_moothere needs to be a way to register the device ownership transaction10:12
Toferight10:12
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temmi_mooalso a backup system for this in case the previous owner just doesn't act at all ignoring all requests10:12
Yanielbut trackign people and devices should be avoided as far as possible10:13
temmi_mooexactly10:13
r0kk3rzTofe: problem there is that you need a jolla account and associated infrastructure to get the code10:14
temmi_moothis needs some amount of thought that what exactly is the information and what is the essential flow of information10:14
temmi_moopaper and pencil stuff10:14
temmi_moobefore jumping to code10:14
Tofer0kk3rz: without a jolla account, no update, no apps... nothing10:14
temmi_moostoring the least possible amount of information in least possible places10:15
Tofer0kk3rz: or am I mistaken10:15
r0kk3rzTofe: yeah but we're talking about the device itself, rather than the OS10:15
temmi_mooit could be thought of normalizing a distributed rdbms schema10:15
Tofer0kk3rz: but it's Jolla that sells the device, we have to make some assumptions10:15
r0kk3rzso say you bought a jolla tablet, and a few years down the track jolla doesnt actually exist anymore (sad). and you want to unlock the UEFI and put android on it?10:16
r0kk3rzwhat do you do?10:16
temmi_moor0kk3rz: another valid concern10:16
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r0kk3rzif its tied to jolla servers you're basically boned.10:17
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Tofer0kk3rz: ok, but if it's tied to only the device it means that a hack will break it soon10:17
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Tofer0kk3rz: so we can think of a code written on the box for example, but then the box becomes very important and shouldn't be lost10:18
r0kk3rzTofe: you're right, but thats not exactly an 'open device' then is it?10:18
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temmi_moothere is a balancing act: is openness more important than secureness?10:20
r0kk3rzhad the idea yesterday that an alternative method is to get the tablet to wipe itself when secureboot is disabled10:20
Tofer0kk3rz: I don't want to wipe my device just to try things!10:20
r0kk3rztofe: if its your device, then you can make backups10:21
temmi_mooboth could be made possible10:21
r0kk3rzif its not your device, then it stops people from getting at the owners data10:21
temmi_mooit's not like you can implement only the wipe-option and not the cloud-backed key option or vice versa10:21
temmi_moor0kk3rz: yes10:21
Tofer0kk3rz: it doesn't stop people: lock uefi doesn't prevent booting10:21
temmi_moothat's also a way to solve the passive previous owner10:21
r0kk3rzTofe: this is assuming that the OS and lockscreen are secure (big assumpton i know)10:22
Tofer0kk3rz: well, then, uefi lock is only useful for preventing malicious software10:22
Tofer0kk3rz: which means we just need a big button "unlock uefi" app10:23
r0kk3rzand booting the device to another OS and using that to probe the original partition for data10:23
Tofer0kk3rz: you can do that from Sailfish10:24
TofeI don't see any scenario where the lockscreen is unsafe and uefi lock prevents stealing data10:25
r0kk3rzwell no, if the OS is insecure then it doesnt matter what the boot chain is like10:25
r0kk3rzbut the OS can get better over time10:26
r0kk3rzthe UEFI stuff needs to be right out the gate10:26
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Tofeyes, but that means uefi only is useful to ensure there's no data corruption, not to ensure it's the correct user that is using the device10:26
Tofefor that, there's the lockscreen10:27
Tofeso once you are past the lockscreen, you can safely disable the uefi -- if you can prove you are not a malicious software ;)10:28
r0kk3rzyeah, main issue with that is the device has to boot that far10:28
Tofewhy is that an issue?10:29
Tofeit is how it is working currently with the recovery on the jolla10:29
r0kk3rzjolla doesnt have UEFI10:29
Tofeno, but has a lockscreen on recovery10:29
r0kk3rzyeah its probably not a big concern10:30
Tofemaybe the software that unlocks uefi just needs to be signed with the uefi encryption10:31
Tofes/encryption/private key/10:31
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Tofemmmh no, not sufficient to ensure it's a human that starts the unlocking process10:32
TofeWhat offline technology is there today to ensure that? It must have been solved already...10:33
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r0kk3rzi dont think it has10:36
r0kk3rzwithout doing facial recognition or biometrics or something like that10:36
r0kk3rzwhich of course can be broken10:36
TofeAh, I think there may be a way: you have an app that loads an unlock boot in uefi program, already signed with private key. Then, you will have to reboot to that mode (so usb+power+vol up for instance, conciously), and if you don't reboot with that mode it deletes this boot until next request10:37
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Tofeyes, that might be reasonable10:38
TofeStskeeps: ^ another proposal :)10:39
Tofemaybe the unlock program would only be available as part of the recovery10:40
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* Stskeeps reads backlog10:42
TofeStskeeps: maybe some essential points have been missed/lost durng the conversation, though I hope not10:44
Stskeepsgood conversation10:45
TofeStskeeps: do you agree uefi lock only prevents boot chain corruption, and not unwanted usage on a stolen device?10:46
Stskeepsright now you can go and disable secureboot/change keys though a bootup button in practice10:47
Stskeepswhich kinda blows out secure checks of boot chain for purposes of defeating unwanted usage10:47
TofeStskeeps: yes, thus the mandatory step of going through lockscreen10:48
Tofeto unlock uefi10:48
Stskeepsyes10:48
Stskeepssome people might frown on that, as that means having to accept EULA .. ;)10:48
Tofeah well, if they buy a Jolla device but refuse Sailfish, I don't see the point...10:49
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Stskeepsat the moment i'm thinking a combo of disabling the 'uefi settings' key combo and a shim with MOK keys you can configure if you want10:50
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Tofeso not going through lockscreen?10:53
Tofewould there be a way to go through recovery+lockscreen to unlock uefi without EULA ? If no EULA has been accepted yet, it means no sailfish, so no data yet10:55
Tofeseems not like a good idea though10:57
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Stskeepswell, disabling it after first boot maybe11:10
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tbrmakes sense11:13
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Stskeepsadmittedly you can't tell if device was then pre-compromised, but ..11:20
Stskeepssecurity is hard, i'll become a farmer11:21
Stskeeps:P11:21
kimmoliStskeeps: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p5JlWDbdCQc11:22
r0kk3rzsecurity is always a compromise11:22
Stskeepshttp://www.zotac.com/en/z-zone/zbox-pico.html kinda looks neat11:23
Stskeepssame processor as tablet11:24
r0kk3rzah cool11:25
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TofeStskeeps: as it is intel but not arm, does it mean it would be able to boot sailfish almost as-is? note the "almost", because the video output may be a bit different :)11:35
* Stskeeps reads http://uefidk.intel.com/content/tutorial-practical-uefi-secure-boot-part-1-311:35
Stskeepsor, well, watches11:36
tbrmeh, a minnowmax is still cheaper and probably close-enough™11:36
Stskeepsnod11:37
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tbrStskeeps: btw, I'm not sure if the baytrail-cr has any special provisions, but if someone opens up the case and attaches a dediprog/SPI-flasher, then all bets are off and UEFI is toast.11:41
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TofeAh, a question: will you have the same restrictions for the tablet concerning the firmware and driver binaries? i.e., no redistribution possible?11:41
Tofemaybe you don't even know yet which binaries you'll use ;)11:42
Stskeepstbr: probably yeah11:42
StskeepsTofe: i'm working on a way where you can get a flashable image dragged over mtp or whatever11:43
Stskeepsso you can back it up and reflash it yourself11:43
TofeStskeeps: ok, that would be great :)11:43
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Yanielalmost read the beginning of the last url as ufckdm8.intel.com11:59
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stephgright that's it12:05
* stephg throws icinga2 out of the window, toys out of pram, goes to fix bathroom instead12:06
tbrstephg: I've been watching it develop, kinda waiting for the new web ui to become available before I make another try12:09
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Stskeepsi count over 20 mobile devices in my cupboard. i have a problem.12:22
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Milo-Stskeeps juggle with them12:24
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r0kk3rzStskeeps: anything good?12:38
Stskeepsprobably12:38
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r0kk3rzbecause im sure myself and others could use a dev device :P12:39
stephgtbr: there are some very welcome new features under the hood (native graphite, logstash integration for example), it's the config changes coming from 1.x that are the problem12:41
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attahI keep getting the feeling that the browser kills the current tab when i open tab view and kill all others..12:52
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attahAnyone else had that, or am I just clumsy?12:53
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coderusHelp me testing LockscreenPlayerControl patch: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1453218#post145321813:18
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faidenalright brb15:40
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mornfallanyone knows how to tell jolla to upload contacts to a carddav account?15:53
Nicd-hmm, the new update seems to kill apps really eagerly15:55
Nicd-I think OOM related but my memory wasn't even near full15:55
Nicd-and had plenty of swap15:55
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r0kk3rzNicd-: yeah i think the oom needs a bit more tweaking15:58
r0kk3rzcertainly better than uitukka15:59
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Nicd-I didn't have any problems with uitukka15:59
r0kk3rzi did15:59
tadzikI did too15:59
r0kk3rzand i dont consider myself a heavy user15:59
r0kk3rzmaybe 2-3 apps open most of the time16:00
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parasemichey16:05
parasemici cant get the update16:05
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tadzikis it not in the SailfishOS updates?16:06
parasemichmm?16:07
Bawalis it still withdrawn due to the alphanumeric lock code bug?16:07
tadzikI don't think so16:07
parasemicnot as far as i know16:07
parasemicalso, i cant seem to update anything via warehouse16:07
tadzikI managed to install it before the bug was discovered, and then I got a 1.5MB hotfix16:07
HarhaanJohtajafirst ones and update 9 opt ins get it16:07
parasemicso there seems to be something wrong with my repo updates16:07
Teguit will be released tomorrow to everyone16:07
tadzikaha16:08
tadzikI'm optin16:08
tadzikpoor man's First One16:08
Tegu(or so they said on friday. haven't checked the TJC page since)16:08
Tegunow I did, and no updates after that, it seems16:08
parasemichow did the optin work? didnt do it earlier, can i do it now?16:09
Nicd-you have to send email to an address16:09
Nicd-it'll probably opt-in you to U916:09
Nicd-but I would just wait until tomorrow to get U10 :)16:09
tadzikit's sunday, no?16:09
tadzikso probably not worth bothering :)16:09
parasemicaye16:09
HarhaanJohtajait worked for me yesterday16:09
tadzikotoh, I don't think humans approve those optins anyway16:10
tadzikthat'd be weird16:10
parasemicanyway, i cant even update anything via warehouse16:10
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parasemicit finds the updates, tells me to proceed to update and then "list is empty"16:10
Bawalwarehouse broke after update 9 i think16:10
tadzikhave you tried redownloading warehouse .rpm and installing it?16:10
Bawalfor me16:10
tadzikBawal: works for me16:10
mornfallah, jolla doesn't like empty calendars (and you have to nuke the account and re-create it to find new ones)16:10
parasemicill try to reinstall it16:11
tadzikwarehouse is a bit buggy16:11
tadzikmore often an inconvience rather than breakage, in my case16:12
parasemicbtw, was the proximity sensor tweak included in U10?16:12
parasemicthat it locks the phone completely16:12
tadzikoh, this double-click-power-to-lock, did anyone get it to work?16:12
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tadzikah, the Automatic Locking must not be "not in use"16:35
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tadzikhttps://together.jolla.com/question/72646/double-click-to-lock-doesnt-work-when-automatic-locking-is-not-in-use/ bug reported16:37
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r0kk3rztadzik: pretty sure I did16:41
r0kk3rzgot my lock timer set to 5min, and double tap makes it lock immediately16:42
r0kk3rzjust double checked, works fine for me16:43
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r0kk3rzis that a bug though16:44
r0kk3rzi cant make the phone lock at all with the lock timer set to 'not in use'16:44
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tadzikyeah, my point16:50
tadzikalso good comment16:50
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mornfallhm, carddav on jolla is such a mess16:58
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silver_hookmornfall: Losing data or just working/not working?17:03
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mornfallsilver_hook: not working, and being rather impossible to debug17:11
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mornfallthe server responds with a correct list of collections, in reply to <d:propfind xmlns:d="DAV:" xmlns:cs="http://calendarserver.org/ns/" xmlns:c="urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:caldav" xmlns:ca="http://apple.com/ns/ical/"><d:prop><d:resourcetype /><d:current-user-principal /><d:displayname /><cs:getctag /><ca:calendar-color /></d:prop></d:propfind>17:12
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mornfallcalendar colors are undefined, but other than that, it does list a contacts collection just fine17:12
mornfalljolla goes on to completely ignore it and only sync caldav collections17:13
mornfallno matter what I do17:13
silver_hookmornfall: Meh, that’s crappy. But at least it doesn’t eat your data, right?17:13
mornfallwell, that's a relief considering I can't get the data in the first place :(17:14
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mornfallnah, it's just broken *gives up*17:18
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silver_hookIt’s something…17:20
silver_hookI guess it’ll get solved in u11.17:20
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* silver_hook crosses his fingers17:20
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mornfallbut at least I got some great insight on why people suck it up, buy android and give everything to google17:23
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mornfallalso, never ever touch apple calendarserver... ever17:31
javispedrothank the gods there's any sync at all17:32
javispedroi migrated to exchangeactivesync because I figured out there would be better support for it than the *dav protocols17:32
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mornfalljavispedro: well, for contacts, there basically is no sync, as far as I can tell17:33
mornfallalthough it magically works for a handful of people on ownCloud, it seems17:33
mornfallsadly, ownCloud is the software equivalent of swiss cheese17:34
javispedrohey, it's php17:34
javispedronot surprising17:34
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mornfallbut my server's surface is too big even without OC (I should start jailing things, soon)17:37
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salyavin1for the moment owncloud is the best we have "cloud services" on a server we own but I agree it's a mess.  More solid contact synching would be great.18:02
javispedrothe problem is what you mean by "cloud services"18:03
javispedrocause if you mean contact and calendar synchronization there are plenty of better and more mature programs (even in python!)18:04
javispedrothey're basically riding on the "cloud" wave..18:04
javispedro(owncloud is the one riding on the "cloud" hype, I mean)18:05
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tbrcloud is hype in itself. :-/18:22
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mornfalljavispedro: i'm running radicale for calendar & contacts18:25
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mornfalland vdirsyncer to get the stuff on a desktop18:26
javispedroradicale would be my choice if I were to go back to *dav, a colleague at work is using it succesfully with his android handset18:26
mornfalljavispedro: what do you use if not *DAV?18:29
javispedroexchange/activesync18:29
mornfallI'll be first to say that the DAV family sucks horribly, but like with XMPP, it's more or less all we got18:29
r0kk3rzi just dont use any of it, but maybe thats just me18:30
mornfallactivesync isn't much better than DAV, I suspect (as a protocol)18:30
javispedrooh, it probably is a devil's spawn as a protocol18:30
mornfallit might have better client-side support on non-Apple devices18:30
javispedro... like the Jolla.18:30
mornfallyes18:31
Tomo2ran into a weird glitch today: all application UIs became unresponsive. the ones i had open i could go into, but didn't respond to any input, still music kept playing and i was able do to open all apps but couldn't close any of the already open ones18:31
javispedroawful, but it's what it is.18:31
javispedroTomo2: could you lock the screen?18:32
Tomo2yes18:32
javispedrosometimes it helps to get it unstuck18:32
Tomo2and minimize apps18:32
Tomo2nothing helped, i would've restarted the UI with patchmanager but it didn't respond :D18:32
Tomo2ended up booting the thing18:33
Tomo2never happened before :/18:33
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Stskeepssharpneli: what should i check about opencl this time around?18:59
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sharpneliStskeeps: Does the libOpenCL.so exist under /vendor/ ?20:04
Stskeepsaye20:04
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Bysmyyra21:04
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coderusPowermenu for SailfishOS Update10 Vaarainjärvi released: https://openrepos.net/content/coderus/powermenu Have known limitations. Read description.21:21
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Hartzicoderus: does it work in landscape mode yet?21:28
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FrozenZiaHey all. Managed to fill my /home/ memory, and now trying to do btrfs balance. Have got to a point where *only* 97% is used (537M free), but now btrfs just results in seg fault. Safe to reboot the device at this point?21:38
fennekkiuhh21:38
FrozenZia=o)21:38
fennekkiwhat exactly21:38
fennekkiare you doing21:38
FrozenZiaI know right?21:38
fennekkino, I mean21:38
fennekkiwhat exactly are you doing21:39
fennekkihow'd you fill the filesystem anyway21:39
FrozenZiaWell, I was TRYING to dd an MMC partition to a single file in the home directory (should have only been about 2G, and there was plenty of space at that point), but21:39
FrozenZiaI've screwed up the command and started dd'ing the entire MMC (8G)...21:40
Nicd-mmmmm21:40
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Nicd-dd, the data destroyer21:40
FrozenZiaHad about a 6G file, which I "promptly" rm'd, but alas, it was too late.21:40
fennekkihow'd you jump to doing btrfs balance, though21:41
mornfallsadly, the kernel is ancient and the btrfs there too buggy21:41
FrozenZiaGoogled what to do when filling up Jolla memory, and came across instructions to do that.21:42
mornfallfennekki: he ran out of space, even though there's a 6G hole in the filesystem which btrfs doesn't see yet21:42
fennekkiI get that, but, goddammit21:42
mornfallwhat?21:42
FrozenZia"When 'btrfs fi show' command shows 13.75GB used of 13.75GB for 'devid 1' (see example below), new chunks cannot be allocated anymore and the random problems begin."21:42
fennekkihow'd you get it to segfault21:43
fennekkiyou should just run btrfs balance once21:43
fennekkiand then start removing files21:43
fennekkiI mean, specifically, the problem with btrfs is that if you run out of space it might be impossible to delete stuff21:43
mornfallfennekki: yes, and it's easy to run out of space and wreck the device that way21:43
FrozenZiaI was doing btrfs balance start -dusage=5 / and incrementing the dusage up and up...21:44
mornfallbtrfs is probably more usable by now, but we are running a version 2.5 years old21:44
fennekkiso you ran btrfs balance *repeatedly*?21:45
FrozenZiayes.21:45
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Tegusounds like a kinda risky choice for a filesystem21:45
FrozenZiahttps://together.jolla.com/question/30822/root-and-home-disks-full-and-causing-various-problems/21:45
mornfallTegu: it has supposedly nice features21:45
mornfallTegu: just like systemd :-)21:45
Tegu:P21:45
phaeronI think the solution would be to use quotas21:46
mornfallwe are lucky that the phone doesn't really stress the filesystem, on desktop machines the version we run regularly loses entire filesystems without batting an eye21:46
FrozenZiafennekki: ...which seemed to be doing basically nothing until I got to 95% -- it relocated 1 out of 22 chunks.21:47
fennekkiFrozenZia: I'm like 85% sure you're not supposed to run btrfs balance all the time21:47
fennekkilike, repeatedly21:47
fennekkibut21:47
fennekkiif the device is still on21:47
fennekkitry checking the partition?21:47
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mornfallfennekki: what do you mean checking the partition?21:48
FrozenZiaThen I did 100%, it sat there a while and then gave me: "ERROR: error during balancing '/' - No space left on device"21:48
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fennekkimornfall: the command seems to be "scrub"21:48
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FrozenZiafennekki: don't seem to have "scrub" as a command.21:49
mornfallbtrfs scrub21:49
FrozenZiaah.21:49
mornfalland pray hard21:49
FrozenZiaalas, even btrfs --help just gives me seg fault.21:49
fennekkieh, well21:49
FrozenZiano go w/scrub, either.21:49
phaeronone way to delete files if rm fails is to truncate them21:49
fennekkichances are disk reads just don't work then21:49
fennekkiproperly, anyway21:50
fennekkidon't close your shell under any circumstance21:50
salyavin1Will factory reset work I wonder21:50
phaeronecho > file21:50
FrozenZiaI also tried echo > bigfilename21:50
phaerondidn't work ?21:51
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FrozenZiaun momento....21:51
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fennekkianyway, what I'm wondering is21:52
fennekkiWHY were you running several btrfs balances21:52
FrozenZiaHmm. Odd. Didn't think I'd rm'd everything in the /home/nemo directory, but it seems empty enough now...21:53
phaeronfennekki: he was changing the -D parameter21:53
mornfallno, that's just a filesystem malfunctioning21:53
phaeron-dusage21:53
fennekkiphaeron: ...regardless, it seems like an exceedingly silly thing to do21:54
FrozenZiafennekki: simply b/c I was following those instructions (somewhat blindly, obviously) -- but it seemed like each "instance" was completing b4 I gave the next one.21:54
phaeronfennekki: it's supposed to free space gradually to allow for bigger relocations21:55
FrozenZiaAnd if one cannot do exceedingly silly things, what's the point of living?21:55
mornfalltoo bad we don't have full fastboot recovery21:55
FrozenZiaIt *may* tend to cause one excessive headaches from time to time, obviously.21:55
fennekkiwell, indeed! I do suppose exceedingly silly things are fine, a lot of the time21:55
salyavin1You checked the balance progress or you got the prompt back and thought it was done?21:56
FrozenZiasalyavin1: got the prompt back, thought it was done.21:56
fennekkiI still have no clue why the btrfs binary would suddenly start segfaulting, unless there's been sudden memory (or filesystem) corruption21:56
salyavin1that's what I thought ^-^;;21:56
FrozenZiaAh, actually, yes and no.21:56
fennekkiI mean, if even btrfs --help segfaults21:57
FrozenZiaI actually got a "Done, had to relocate....." msg AND the prompty21:57
FrozenZiaprompt*21:57
fennekkibut if you got anything relocated it's entirely possible you would've had enough space to remove the file already21:57
mornfallfennekki: well, if $HOME is empty and btrfs binary segfaults, the filesystem is probably done for21:57
fennekkimornfall: that's what I *thought*, but it's also possible there's something wacky going on21:58
phaeronif all hope lost you can try the btrfs recovery option in recovery console21:58
fennekkilike kernel memory corruption. But I doubt that21:58
phaerondmesg would tell if an oops has fired21:58
phaeronor even a kernel BUG21:58
fennekkihow would jolla even react to a kernel oops21:58
mornfallfennekki: very unlikely if the phone was acting normal before21:58
mornfallfennekki: on OOPS, you'd probably get a hard hang21:58
phaeronbtrfs balance status /21:58
phaeronfirst21:59
phaeronmornfall: not always21:59
FrozenZiavery interesting output from dmesg.21:59
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FrozenZiaSeveral screens full of "binary garbage" and then "command not found"22:00
fennekkiuhh22:00
phaeronsounds like memory corruption22:00
mornfallyeah, btrfs went full bonkers :-)22:00
fennekkithat... doesn't sound like a dmesg22:00
fennekkilike, hey, if it's RAM corruption, it's possible the device will still work22:00
mornfallit's kernel-mode and had pointer issues at the time22:00
FrozenZia...and root seems to also be empty according to ls.22:00
fennekkiFrozenZia: it just can't read the filesystem at all, I'm pretty sure22:01
mornfallFrozenZia: reboot time, I guess22:01
FrozenZiasounds about right.22:01
FrozenZiaInteresting that df still shows reasonable output...22:01
mornfallI hope your $DEITY has some actual powers. :D22:01
FrozenZia=o)22:01
coderusHartzi: does homescreen have landscape mode? ;)22:02
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FrozenZiamornfall: fennekki: can you point me to a good set of instructions for how to move forward at this point? Something along the lines of: "Help me Obi-Wan Kenobi, I've totally borked my Jolla...."22:03
Hartzicoderus: no but why power meny appears also on landscape mode apps? :P22:03
mornfallFrozenZia: reboot, it might recover by itself22:03
fennekki^ that22:04
mornfallFrozenZia: if no, then try what fastboot has to offer22:04
fennekkiit tastes a lot like memory corruption22:04
fennekkiwhich could be solved by a reboot22:04
fennekkibut if the filesystem is borked, then, well.22:04
fennekkithere's always the strange fastboot factory reset, isn't there22:04
fennekkiI used it once, anyway22:04
mornfallfastboot on jolla is kinda messed up, but it *could* work22:04
fennekkier, I meant telnet, not fastboot22:05
coderusHartzi: you hold phone wrong :D22:05
fennekkiI haven't actaually tried fgoing to fastboot on my jolla22:05
Hartzicoderus: :--P22:05
mornfallfennekki: your backspace is broken :D22:05
fennekkimornfall: ? I don't follow22:06
mornfallfennekki: actaually ... fgoing22:06
fennekkioh22:06
fennekkihaha22:06
fennekkiI honestly didn't see those22:06
FrozenZiafennekki: mornfall: Tx, I'll give it a try. Hyvää Jollua =o)22:07
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coderusHartzi: why didn't you reported it before? :D22:09
Hartziwell :D22:09
Hartzithat's a good question22:09
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Hartzibut better late than never22:10
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HartziI thought that you knew or some one else has reported that the aligment is weird on landscape mode :D22:11
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fluxnighsilencer doesn't work  in u10 :(, didn't try reinstalling it yet, though22:12
fluxI suppose there is no yet profilematic-clone around?22:13
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HarhaanJohtajaphonebot but dont know if it works yet: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=9342422:22
FrozenZiafennekki: mornfall: =o) Alas, given that I'm on 1.0.8.21, my recovery option requires a memory card. Which I *have*, but w/o the adapter to let me copy stuff to it from my laptop. Which was the dilemna that got me here in the first place -- trying to use my Jolla as an MMC reader -- I just got overzealous.  Anyway, tx for your help.22:26
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coderusHartzi: updated to 0.4.1 with new style. Restart lipstick after update to see changes.22:42
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Hartzicoderus: cool, nice job :)22:45
Hartzilooks fine now22:45
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coderus:)22:51
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