#jollamobile log for Tuesday, 2015-03-03

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coderusLauncher combined patch for #SailfishOS v0.1.0 uploaded to Openrepos for testing. So cool, much features! https://openrepos.net/content/coderus/patch-launcher-combined-patch00:00
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tiwakeI love reading stuff I don't understand... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decay_chain05:58
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uuhimhereso whats the diff between capacitive and resistive screens06:25
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tiwakeuuhimhere: one uses pressure on the surface, the other measures electrons from your finger (or some other electron-giving thing touching the surface)06:27
uuhimherewhich is better06:28
Joonaathe not-pressure thing06:28
tiwakedepends on use-case06:28
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tiwakepersonally, I like to use my fingernail, and its nice to be able to interact with the device with gloves or w/e06:29
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Joonaawell you can get gloves that work with those screens too06:29
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Teemupositioning with "middle of the finger hit area" is annoying06:36
Teemui liked the fingernailability in n90006:36
Joonaathats very true06:36
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tiwakeTeemu: yeah, thats why I like it too :306:36
tiwakecan be quite precise06:37
Teemuat times i do some real physical work that affects the hand skin in nonuniform ways and the detected mush-area for capacitive displays is erratically annoyingly not always possible to estimate06:38
greenithi, as my jolla phone will arrive in the next few days, i'd like to know if any of the following apps are available as native apps? Firefox, Telegram, WhatsApp, OpenStreetMap Navigation app06:38
tiwakeTeemu: yeah, working in a machine shop around coolant, wearing gloves or having soggy fingers...06:39
tbrgreenit:  no, no, no, yes, yes06:39
tiwakesoggy or sweaty06:39
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Teemutiwake: not to mention the unevenly dried and cut skin that makes the center of that detected area not to be where you imagine06:40
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tbrgreenit: to expand though: the browser is based on gecko, the same rendering engine as firefox. whatsapp are dicks and the native client was discontinued06:40
Yanielthere is a work in progress telegram client06:41
Yanieland the web client works okayish06:41
greenittbr: thanks, although "OpenStreetMap Navigation app" was meant as one app, like OSMAnd on android ;)06:41
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tbrgreenit: I'm not sure if modrana or the other osm app has navigation06:42
tbrthere is a native navigation app, but it uses HERE maps06:42
greenitYaniel: thanks for the info! :)   what do you mean with the web-client? The only "web-client" i know is via the firefox market place... is there another one?06:43
greenittbr: ok, but I can still install OSMAnd if I want (in case the other OSM apps don't offer navigation) via the Dalvik(?) VM, right?06:43
tbrhttp://modrana.org/trac06:44
Yanielgreenit: web.telegram.org works in the stock browser just fine06:44
YanielI have a shortcut to it added to the app launcher06:45
greenitYaniel: good to know, thanks :)06:45
greenittbr: thanks, seems like i don't have to install OSMAnd :)06:46
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greenitby the way, is there a web-version of the jolla "app store"? I didn't find one where I can browse the available apps06:53
Yanielno06:53
greenitok, then I'll wait for my jolla to browse it :)06:54
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Teemui'd like to browse stuff on a real screen and then just do the lightning strike of installation to the very exact thing i already decided on06:54
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greenitcan you tell me which python-versions are supported by sailfish OS? I'd like to write some code in Python 3.x and run it on the device06:56
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Yanielgo ahead06:59
Yanielpython3 is in the repos but not installed by default06:59
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MikaelaI think I had to enable it from openrepos07:01
Yanielpkcon search name python3 shows python3-base07:02
Yanielyou may have to enable mer-tools07:02
Yaniel(ssu ar mer-tools)07:02
Yanielbut nothing with openrepos07:02
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merlin1991Nah stock repos are enough07:06
merlin1991Python3 is part of pyotherside which is allowed for store apps ...07:07
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tbrha, I just found a good analogy to desktop linux. open-repos is a lot like rpmfind07:08
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jarkko_I'm sure vast majority here gets their OS updates as an early release, but yliaavanlampi 1.1.2.16 is available now for others (well, me at least), too.07:26
Joonaagreenit: whatsapp android app works fine on jolla, except for notifications07:29
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greenitJoonaa: thanks for the answer :)07:35
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greenitAre there any other good sites where i can buy TOH except the official jolla-store and funkyotherhalf.com ?07:38
phlixi_greenit: like http://lastucase.com/07:39
Joonaagreat, i cant download the update..07:40
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Joonaagreenit: you can 3d print one07:40
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Temeblah... i'm sorry to say but the browser is still pretty bad after the update :(07:59
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Temehere's a rant: it doesn't respect multiple audio sources like other apps.. so when jolla.com loads, media player stops since there is some audio source there i guess. second it doesn't still do text wrap, so don't bother going to any non-mobile sites, for example www.slashdot.org is basically unusable. 3rd there is still no way to switch homepage??08:01
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jaacoppihomepage is in settings I think08:06
WntTeme: how should the text warping work? maybe you should file a ticket to https://github.com/sailfishos/sailfish-browser/issues describing this feature?08:06
mornfallmobile browsers suck by default08:06
Temejaacoppi: true08:06
jaacoppisettings -> apps -> browser -> home page08:06
uuhimheredoes midori run on sailfishOS08:06
mornfallWnt: 'zooming in' should work more like resizing a window than like zooming08:07
Temeforgot that place exists and was looking for it in the browser UI08:07
mornfallWnt: zooming is useless for reading text08:07
Tememornfall: mobile Opera seems to work decently08:07
Yanieluuhimhere: nobody has tried AFAIK08:07
uuhimherewhat? nobody's tried the best linux browser out there? :P08:07
mornfallif you can read 7px high letters on a phone screen sure the browser is OKish ;-)08:07
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mornfalluuhimhere: what linux browser?08:08
uuhimheremidori08:08
mornfallthere are linux browsers now?08:08
TemeWnt: i will try to describe it08:08
ln-lynx08:08
uuhimheremornfall, yeah it lets you browse kernel.org08:08
uuhimhere:p08:08
Temeit seems trivial to the user but behing the scenes it might be a bit difficult08:08
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mornfallTeme: it really isn't, all browser engines can reflow text since forever08:09
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jaacoppilynx is awesome, but sometimes links is needed08:09
mornfalltry zooming in on a desktop browser... it doesn't let text go past the right edge, it breaks lines differently instead (unless the CSS for the site is braindead, but that's not *too* widespread)08:10
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phlixi_wow, the browser still opens new links (e. g. from tweetian) into the last tab instead of into a new tab...08:18
phlixi_this is ridiculous08:18
phlixi_when will this get a fix? this is now an open tjc item for more than half a year08:19
phlixi_(ofc with lots of votes)08:19
tbrI wonder if anyone of those who voted looked into patching that themselves. Browser _is_ open source after all.08:19
phlixi_lol08:20
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tbrI know, outrageous to think you could go and fix a bug yourself, instead of standing on a soap box and crying out loud.08:20
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uuhimhereheh... i wonder if jolla will provide paid-for support08:20
merlin1991I'm this '' close todo that, but first i need the obs target for that ...08:21
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uuhimherewhat is jolla's software distribution mechanism again?08:23
uuhimherelocusf, so piolla still on hold?08:24
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locusfuuhimhere: nope, just waiting for my coworker to pick up the board and solder the components, please stand by :)08:25
uuhimhereha ha nice outsourcing!08:25
Teemupiolla?08:26
locusfits SailPi now :)08:26
uuhimhereoh ok lolz08:26
locusfsorry for the retarted name at the beginning08:26
Teemusailpi?08:26
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uuhimhereyeah its a revolutionary device that will change the way you look at sliced bread08:26
Teemuwhat if i never look at sliced bread?08:27
uuhimhereoh man08:27
uuhimherethis would blow your mind08:27
uuhimheredont think you could handle it08:27
uuhimheremaybe try midori on sailfish first08:27
uuhimhereXD08:28
Yanielwas midori gtk or qt08:28
Teemui have a book by midori...08:28
uuhimhereYaniel, think gtk ...08:28
Mikaelagtk08:29
uuhimherehttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midori_%28web_browser%2908:29
uuhimhereyeah GTK08:29
Mikaelahttp://sprunge.us/bPXh08:29
locusfuuhimhere: check https://sailpi.wordpress.com for updates, I'll post there today about the gsm board woes :)08:29
uuhimhereohnoes08:29
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YanielI always think of 緑 when someone mentions the browser08:30
Yanielas in the colour08:30
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uuhimhereinteresting; what does "Maemo integration for mobile devices[16]"08:30
uuhimheremean08:30
uuhimheresays so on wackypedia-midori's feature list08:31
uuhimheredoes that mean it will run on anything thats Maemo/mer/nemo?08:33
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uuhimherelocusf, think a few pics would add to the illustration08:34
locusfsure08:34
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uuhimhereTeemu, sailpi == making a homemade smartphone out of a gsm module+touchscreen and a raspberry pi208:37
zuttoyou should probably look at odroid if you want to make a homemade smartphone08:37
zutto..or tablet08:38
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mjrIIRC somebody already made a phone out of a Pi (1)08:38
uuhimherewell any sbc could do it in theory; would be nice to see a whole ecosystem of homamade smartphones running sailfishOS08:39
uuhimherelol08:39
mjrprobably not worth it trying to run sailfish on the 1 though, 2 at least has arm708:39
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uuhimheremjr yeah 2 has a quadcore +1g ram and yeah the ARM neon also adds value as far as compatibility with all the stuff out there08:40
zuttoodroid just sells complete kit for it08:40
zuttoor used to08:40
Nicd-yeah, SFOS won't run on the first Pi at all08:40
uuhimherebut ths odroid is much bigger in size than the pi though right?08:40
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mjroh yes, here it is: http://www.davidhunt.ie/piphone-a-raspberry-pi-based-smartphone/08:40
zuttothey have models that are bigger08:40
zuttothe C1 has better specs than pi, is the same price and size08:41
zuttopossibly bit taller? cant remember anymore08:41
uuhimhereC1 vs pi2?08:42
uuhimheremjr, yeah thats very neat08:42
zuttouuhimhere: yeah08:42
uuhimherelocusf, are you planning on adding a battery charger in the long run08:42
zuttoodroid used to sell complete phone dev kit, apparently its discontinued now :(08:42
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uuhimhereyeah i think its better that you get to do it outside of a kit; based on modules; that gsm module pops off some maybe you could have a sailpi TOH XD08:43
locusfuuhimhere: Don't know yet, I'm not that skilled with electronics in general08:43
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uuhimherelocusf, looks like someone else already went to the trouble: http://piups.net/08:50
uuhimherethough thats optional08:51
uuhimherewanna see it up and running making calls!08:51
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uuhimherealthough a custom made batterycharging solution would probably be alot more compact08:52
uuhimherethat ups thingymajig's a bit big08:53
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greenitAs I just read on a news-site, was it a bad decision to buy a Jolla-phone now? According to the article, smartphones from partnes should release in Q2 2015...08:59
uuhimherewell08:59
uuhimhereif that was the case then none of us would ever buy anything electronic08:59
uuhimherethats just the nature of consumer electronics09:00
ln-yes, there's always something better coming within 6 months09:00
uuhimhereUNLESS09:00
uuhimhereyou build your own sailpi09:00
greeniti like that word09:00
uuhimherethen its uniquely yours forever09:00
TaaeemI wait almost half a year now for a new sailfish phone :D still don't have one :-/09:01
uuhimherelost in mail09:01
uuhimhere?09:01
greenitnah, i really like the jolla-phone's form and style, so i think it was a good decision. :)09:01
uuhimhereyeah it is09:01
greenitwell, i just saw it on videos and images, so let's see how i like it when i have it^^09:01
Nicd-also there's no TOHKBD for the other phones :P09:02
TaaeemBut partners are always good for jolla09:02
greenittrue09:02
uuhimherebesides the whole lure of jolla isnt the backgroudn hardware... its supposed to be the interface09:02
greenitTOHKBD is a bit expensive though... 1/2 price of a jolla phone :S09:02
Nicd-manufacture is expensive for small sets09:03
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uuhimhereso it doesnt matter if you didnt get the latest fapdragon octamom dingleflops with fairy dust09:03
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greenitplus it's a nice innovation with the magnets :)09:03
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greenitby the way, when you have TOHKBD and don't attach the keyboard to it, can you "pin" the phone to a magnet-pinboard?09:04
greenitI'm just curious :)09:04
Nicd-I think I saw a photo where the phone was hanging from a fridge door09:05
uuhimhereis the jolla hardware details/design open source or is it closed09:05
Nicd-but I don't recommend trying it at home :P09:05
TaaeemI remember somebody saying jolla isn't a hardware company they are a software company which also makes hardware09:05
greenit^^09:05
Nicd-Taaeem: jolla doesn't make the hardware though09:05
uuhimheredo they design it?09:06
Nicd-to some degree. dunno the specifics but afaik it's an android device flashed with sailfish09:06
Nicd-of course the physical form at least is designed by them :P09:07
TaaeemNicd-: thats right ODMs are making the hardware09:07
uuhimhereyeah but the TOH is outside of android spec right09:07
greenitIs there any place / shop where i can buy a TOH with a NFC-chip integrated? I mean a NFC-chip to use it with other nfc-devices, not to connect it to Jolla-phone09:09
entilyo dawg I heard you like nfc so we put an nfc in your toh so you can nfc when you nfc ;P09:10
entilbut that would be a nice toh if it existed09:10
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uuhimherewhy do you want an nfc toh? what do you have in mind?09:12
fluxwell, at simplest you could use nfc-stickers to activate operations in a location-aware fashion09:13
lainwir3d__for one, connect to nfc enabled headphones / speakers would be good09:13
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uuhimhereuhh the range for NFC <20cm09:14
flux..it's only for pairing09:14
fluxyou touch, you're go09:15
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greenitthe rest of the connection usually works via bluetooth / wlan09:15
fluxnfc bandwidth isn't enough for music either09:15
uuhimherelainwir3d__, unless you wanna hold your head down next to your belly button all the time a normal pair of earphones would probablt be better09:15
uuhimhereis credit card transaction over NFC secure?09:16
greenitmy phone-company supports paying with nfc-able phones, so it would be nice to have it for shops where i can pay with it, but if there is no such TOH, it's no problem too :)09:16
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uuhimherethe wiki says no crypto..09:18
uuhimhereso i guess if yyou wanted you could use NFC to snoop credit card info... :S09:18
lainwir3d__uuhimhere: I don't get the link between pairing a bluetooth headphone and having my head next to my belly button09:18
uuhimherelainwir3d__, for one, connect to nfc enabled headphones / speakers would be good09:19
lainwir3d__yeah, and ?09:19
lainwir3d__when I say nfc enabled, I meant pairing to bluetooth via NFC09:19
lainwir3d__sorry if it wasn't clear enough :)09:19
lainwir3d__Indeed streaming music via nvc would be weird09:20
lainwir3d__nfc*09:20
uuhimhereyeah09:22
leinirnfc is a handshake initiation thing, try and push anything more over that an you're going to have a very bad day :P09:22
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Tm_Tleinir: shouldn't that be taken as a challenge? (;09:23
flux2.5 kilobytes/second, well maybe you can push some lowldy speech-codec over it09:24
fluxlowly even09:24
fluxor morse code.09:24
lainwir3d__or lowly morse code09:25
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entilhttps://whispersystems.org/blog/the-new-signal/ zomgs!09:26
uuhimhere?09:29
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fluxcool. new iOS app!09:29
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uuhimhereyeah wow... a new iOS app.. thats unheard of! *GASP09:30
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uuhimherelocusf, on your mainpage it doesnt say that youre doing any GSM stuff09:30
TaaeemNow sailfish needs also text secure :-P09:31
leinirTm_T: no, just that anywhere you got NFC you also have something more designed for data transfer - you /can/ do it with NFC, but it's terrible for the purpose ;)09:31
locusfuuhimhere: it doesn't yet yes09:31
locusfuuhimhere: its coming09:31
entilTaaeem: that's kind of what I was going for09:31
locusfuuhimhere: I'm at work now so I can't update the blog yet09:31
entilbut I was interrupted09:31
uuhimherelocusf, also are you oging to post the github to the sourcecode mods?09:31
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locusfuuhimhere: sure, in time09:32
Taaeementil: isn't coderus porting axolotl to qt? I think he is doing it for WhatsApp but somebody else could also write a text secure app or?09:33
uuhimhereso i take it instant messaging is all but dead?(yahoo,aol,msn,icq,jabber etc)09:34
fluxuuhimhere, it's cool if you do it with your cell phone09:34
tadzikxmpp works still09:34
tadzikmatrix is looking nice09:35
fluxmatrix is looking nice, but I'm afraid they will get too ambitious09:35
entilTaaeem: he implemented axolotl already09:36
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NwSHeya guys, I was wondering if anyone got a Jolla tablet yet09:37
fluxno.09:38
flux..apart from the prototypes jolla employees have09:38
NwSDamn it :P09:38
NwSAny ideas when they'll start shipping?09:38
fluxI thought that was well announced? I don't remember it, though.09:38
Wntjune 2015 says the indiegogo campaign https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/jolla-tablet-world-s-first-crowdsourced-tablet09:39
NwStyvm Wnt09:39
Morpog_PCjune is for 2nd round of campaign09:40
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lainwir3d__:-(09:46
lainwir3d__last update broke my app09:46
Morpog_PCwell, then fix it :D09:46
uuhimhereflux, i cant find an open source MSN client for android09:46
lainwir3d__That's what I'm trying to do09:46
lainwir3d__but it's proving difficult09:47
Morpog_PCuuhimhere, there is no MSN anymore09:47
uuhimhereoh yeah09:47
politieMSN making the comeback09:47
politiebout time09:47
uuhimhereBingSN?09:47
uuhimhereBSN?09:47
Nicd-they closed down MSN09:47
fluxNSN09:47
Nicd-ages ago09:47
Nicd-it was merged into skype09:48
AmadeusXNet_uuhimhere: Tried f-droid?09:48
politieshamefully09:48
Morpog_PCreplaced09:48
uuhimhereAmadeusXNet_, yup09:48
Morpog_PCskype is such a bad replacement for it09:48
politienow theres skype and whatsapp :')09:48
AmadeusXNet_uuhimhere: okey :)09:48
uuhimhereso why isnt jolla selling in japan09:50
Morpog_PCI guess people there buy only high end smartphones09:51
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uuhimherewell sell it with the TOHKBD09:51
uuhimhereXD09:51
Morpog_PClol, that doesn't make it high end :D09:52
Morpog_PConly for a geek09:52
Nicd-uuhimhere: there's like 200 TOHKBD left to order09:52
Nicd-that would be a really small batch to sell in japan :P09:52
uuhimherewell that makes it not only high end pricewise but also exotically rare!09:53
uuhimhereyeah though i dont understand the whole "high end" thing09:53
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uuhimherewhat does it have to have to be a high end device? a flux capacitor?09:53
NwSNicd-, I am using MSN right now..09:53
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uuhimherei thought only the chinese used msn09:53
NwSI am European :P09:54
uuhimhereas in they still had servers running09:54
uuhimherewell maybe youre in china :P09:54
NwSIn Europe lol09:54
uuhimherereminds me of years ago when they said they would stop making mars bars09:54
uuhimhereover a decade and their still here09:54
NwSSearch for messenger reviver 209:55
NwSBut I've started replacing it with Tox09:55
uuhimherewell does that mean it runs on a diff network09:55
uuhimhereand say pidgin wouldnt work anymore09:55
Yanielobligatory When will SailfishOS support Vulkan?09:56
NwSuuhimhere, I think they are using the Chinese servers :P09:56
NwSTo connect09:56
uuhimherenice09:56
uuhimhereso you could just plop in the chinese server details into say trillian and itd work09:57
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NwSNo ideas tbh09:58
NwSThe guy who is running the reviver project is an ex-MSN employee or something09:58
NwSSo you mainly run the patch/reviver and your MSN works again09:59
uuhimherei see10:00
uuhimhereso anyone here knows if theres any gaming emulators that run on the jolla10:00
dr_gogeta86there was10:01
dr_gogeta86tmo10:01
Morpog_PCthere was a project10:01
dr_gogeta86mupen y coderus10:01
dr_gogeta86http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=8921610:01
uuhimherei was told the frontend retroarch supports wayland10:02
uuhimhereso i guess at least thats a start XD10:02
dr_gogeta86thp, but sdl status ?10:02
uuhimherethp?10:02
YanielSDL2 has wayland support AFAIK10:03
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Taaeemhttps://twitter.com/JollaUsers/status/572703520891281408 looks like there comes more information about sailfish secure10:23
tadzikinteresting10:24
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fluxthe guy on the left is Elop, right? ;-)10:28
Morpog_PClol10:28
Taaeemflux: who is Elop?10:29
tadzikhahaha, plot twist :P10:29
fluxtaaeem, Stephen Elop, does not ring a bell.. ?10:29
tadzikclearly not. Taaeem, Elop was the CEO of Nokia when they gave up on meego10:30
Mikaelaand now CEO of Microsoft wasn't it?10:30
tadziksee also: The Devil Himself, page 21; The Great Traitor, page 3310:30
TaaeemAhh okay thanks that was before my time10:30
tadzikheh, me too, I only jumped on the platform when it was already dead:P10:31
Yanielat least it didn't resist then10:31
Joonaadoes he have something against us10:31
tadzikI don't think he remembers or cares that we exist10:32
TaaeemBut why is he there when it's a talk between jolla and ssh10:32
tadzikit's not really him10:32
Joonaais it a lizard10:32
ppdoes look like elop, but not quite10:33
ppthe real elop is a bit more puffy10:33
dunphttp://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/03/02/smartphone-battery-life-poll_n_6787236.html?ir=Technology&utm_campaign=030215&utm_medium=email&utm_source=Alert-technology&utm_content=Title&ncid=newsltushpmg0000000310:41
Accewould the real Elop please stand up, please stand up10:42
uuhimhereis the gpu for thejolla a mali?10:45
uuhimhereor was it intel HD i forget10:45
Morpog_PCtablet?10:45
Morpog_PCintel hd10:45
uuhimhereno10:46
uuhimherephone10:46
Yanielcertainly no intel10:47
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uuhimhereso other than tohkbd what other tohs are there10:49
politietoholed10:49
Yanielaka LeTOH10:49
Yanielsome solar TOHs and the jolla ones10:49
Morpog_PCtoholed, letoh, solar toh, inductive charge,10:49
Morpog_PCand alot more10:50
politieinductive charge is a diy right?10:50
Morpog_PCeverything is a diy10:50
Morpog_PCTMO has an own forum just for TOH: http://talk.maemo.org/forumdisplay.php?f=5910:50
politietheres a wallet toh10:50
Morpog_PCbreadboard toh, infrared imager toh, uart toh, nfc toh, eink toh10:51
Morpog_PCdip toh10:51
Morpog_PCaudio toh10:51
uuhimherewow thats quite a list10:51
uuhimhereare those all just plans10:51
politiefm tuner toh10:51
uuhimhereor do they exist?10:51
politiemultimeter toh10:52
Morpog_PCno, most of them exist10:52
uuhimherei wonder if you could use the rbpi2 as an external graphics card TOH for the jolla ... or is the interface not fast enough10:53
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Yanielnowhere near fast enough10:54
Taaeemuuhmimhere: look at lastucase10:54
TaaeemAnd that wallet toh makes me want a jolla phone now :crying: if it had only a bit better specs10:55
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Yanielwallet toh? you mean the flipcase?10:55
uuhimhereyeah id rather have a steampunk metal case... i dont want to have to varnish my case every year :P10:55
Yaniela steampunk TOH would be cool :D10:55
uuhimherelocusf, actually a steampunk case would go real good with the theme of the sailpi :D10:56
TaaeemYaniel: the one from lastu where you can put all your cards in and so on10:57
Yanielnot the one I have then10:57
uuhimhere"As a bonus, part of the profits from the sale of this case go towards projects that aim to restore lost forests throughout the world"10:57
Yanielwhich is breaking anyway10:58
Nicd-I really want a lastucase for my laptop10:58
Nicd-they look so cool10:58
Nicd-or lastuskin or whatever it's called10:58
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politielastucase is just a bit expensive10:59
Temepolitie: it's not so bad considering it's a "design" product and the materials are not the cheapest possible ones11:00
Joonaaoh, the new browser tabs are actually usable now11:01
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uuhimheresteampunk titanium case11:01
uuhimherewell itd have to be titanium alloy11:02
uuhimhereYaniel, it would be nice if it actually spat out steam and had mechanical cogs!!!11:04
Nicd-lastu desperately needs a good translator though11:04
Nicd-"The packaging we use recycled cardboard."11:04
uuhimheremaybe its haiku11:04
locusfuuhimhere: why not :)11:05
politieTeme, thats true but still. 50 seems to much for a wallet11:07
uuhimherewell you could always just drive down to your local DIY shop and let your imagination take over11:08
uuhimhereand make your own case11:08
Nicd-you need skills for that11:09
uuhimhereskill?11:09
uuhimherewhats that?11:09
politieyea ive been thinking about doing that11:09
uuhimhereXD11:09
uuhimherei remember trying to help build a computer case for a firend once ... bandsaw + acrylic != good idea11:10
Nicd-I built a computer case out of lego. but I can't do that for a phone :P11:10
uuhimhereNicd-, why not?11:11
Nicd-https://plus.google.com/u/1/photos/110693235602405640560/albums/5799063123974673473 -- good memories ^^11:11
politiehttps://pbs.twimg.com/media/Btib2UrCYAA-tQk.jpg11:11
politieah nice computer case11:12
uuhimherethat looks like a server...11:12
Nicd-it was my IRC computer11:13
uuhimherebut still why not make lego case for your smartphone11:14
uuhimhereo ryou could just buy one of these11:17
uuhimherehttp://www.amazon.com/s?ie=UTF8&page=1&rh=i%3Aaps%2Ck%3Alego%20phone%20case11:17
uuhimherecheating but close enough11:17
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uuhimhereyou could also make a phone case out of acrylic11:19
uuhimherethough cutting acrylics a pain11:19
uuhimhereor hemp?11:20
uuhimhereor make a crochet :d11:20
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japa-fi_Just noticed new email stating yliaavalampi -update.11:27
japa-fi_Jolla will not initiate automatic download in the background, will it?11:27
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japa-fi_(My dad is abroad, might have data enabled...)11:28
Joonaayou can check in the settings11:28
xfade_japa-fi_: no, it won't.11:28
Joonaadownload update via wifi only or something of that sort11:28
xfade_No, that is only check through wifi11:29
Joonaaoh, you are right11:29
Nicd-yeah, there's no automatic downloading11:29
xfade_Automatic downloaded has not been implemented yet11:29
Joonaawell, you have to manually fownload11:29
Joonaad*11:29
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mariodhello again everyone :)11:34
mariodam not sure if people are still here at this time of the day but i thought i should stop by and say hi ...11:35
politiehey11:35
mariodunfortunately i also have to tell you that my issue is still the same11:35
ponkyit's 13:35pm, ofc people are here11:35
mariodhello politie :)11:35
ponky;)11:35
Pawkywhat is the difference with running apps in Jolla compared to an android phone? I mean, when you install an app in an android phone (without having XPrivacy) the app can silently spy on you sending contacts, GPS location, IMEI numbers, NFC info, Network card info... does this also account for apps installed on the jolla?11:36
mariodwell yah ponky ... but people could be at work, lunch-breaks, ... etc :)11:36
rigoPawky: I urge them since a long time to sandbox the android apps11:37
Pawkyrigo: them, as i  Jolla?11:38
rigoperhaps the secure system they present in Barcelona right now may have such a feature11:38
rigoPawky: yes11:38
Pawkyi wish they will...11:38
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rigoi know :)11:38
rigoone of the very reasons to have a jolla is to get around the spy, isn't it? :)11:38
Pawkyand also, it amases me that Jolla, who are trying to market themselves as a secure phone, neither themselves nor any other parties have created an app to control iptables graphically, (like droidwall)11:39
mariodno offense meant ... i'm still a new user but i don't think there's ever a way to close out every spy :)11:39
Nicd-well, jolla still runs on binary blobs11:39
Pawkymariod: this is basic stuff..11:39
Pawkyvery basic11:39
mariodalrighty then ... then this is my class ... *sits down and listens to you all* :)11:40
rigoPawky: I always assumed that they want to do the right thing, so while they are young, have to be patient11:40
mariodlike with kids? :)11:41
mariodsorry ...11:41
mariodnot meant rude11:41
rigonah :)11:41
ikarusPawky: the best firewall is "Don't run untrusted apps"11:41
rigoikarus: unfortunately not sufficient on IP networks11:41
Pawkyikarus: funny, but a no can do for most people11:42
mariodbuuut one can trust "HERE" i was told11:42
Pawkyrigo: well, I believe thats the first thing to do before starting to shelf the phone as a secure one..11:42
mariodsaying that because someone here said they actually talked to some Nokia engineer11:42
ikarusrigo: if I don't have any servers running on my phone, what do I gain by firewalling ?11:42
Pawkytoday, there is no way for any normal user to limit stuff if not using shell and iptables...11:42
ikarusplease note that connection tracking uses the same logic as general access to clients in the Linux IP stack11:43
rigoikarus: you have openssh running11:43
Pawkymariod: how could you trust HERE?11:43
ikarusrigo: I don't11:43
rigoand various internal things that one can exploit ...11:43
mariodi'm not saying i do ... i was just told that they are good guys Pawky11:43
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ikarusrigo: I have no ports open on the wlan or wwan interfaces, try again11:43
rigomariod: they are, but they are lagging a bit :)11:43
ikarusssh is only opened if you enable developer mode11:43
Nicd-why would you not trust HERE? or why would you rather trust something else?11:43
mariodand since someone on here told me they were ... i am inclined to believe that some more :)11:44
ikarus(otherwise the actual daemon is not even started)11:44
PawkyNicd-: asking whom?11:44
rigoikarus: ok, so you configured manually. That's not what Pawky meant :)11:44
Nicd-you for example11:44
Pawkyso, it is fair to say, any app installed into Jolla, will have full access to do whatever they want to spy on, just as on any unrooted android phone?11:44
rigobbl11:44
Nicd-Pawky: it will have the access of your user, nemo11:45
ikarusrigo: actually this seems to be true by default11:45
mariodby the way ... this "here" app still doesn't work here yet ... but it's good to read of some other stuff right now :)11:45
ikarusrigo: but I'll retest once I get a second phone, can't really reset this one to default as it's my daily11:45
mariodyou must be rich ikarus :)11:45
PawkyNicd-: and its contacts, the mac address of the wifi, the NFC, etc etc?11:46
ikarusmariod: actually friend of mine is donating it11:46
ikarusmariod: I wish I was rich11:46
Pawkywith my Samsung tablet, I can limit what these programs do with droidwall and Xprivacy..11:46
ikarusbut working as a TA and consulting for small gamedevelopers doesn't make tons of money11:46
Nicd-Pawky: don't know about specifics. contacts yes I think. NFC is only for TOH anyway11:46
mariodbut at least you've got a job :) ...11:47
mariodand it's nice of your friend :)11:47
Pawkydoes anyone have the specifics? I would like to know :-)11:47
ikarusNicd-: it can be used for other things with some trickyness, if both TOH and the other device support multi-device detection11:47
ikaruswhich most modern NFC devices do11:47
PawkyNicd-: yes, but it identifies your phone..11:47
* ikarus sells Nicd- a foil lined phone cover11:48
mariodwell i don't want to sound rude but doesn't the phone or any other device connecting to the internet kinda identify itself?11:48
ikarusguaranteed no RF goes in or out11:48
Nicd-why did you sell it to me? :P11:48
ikarusmariod: most don't except on the local network11:48
mariodi mean ... without identification it won't get anywhere11:48
ikarusanyway, for privacy, rotate mac addresses or don't carry a phone11:48
Pawkymariod: not necessarily... you can always random your mac address  (another feature that should be included in the jolla OS )11:48
ikarusPawky: secure and privacy aren't automatically the same, even though I wish they where11:49
Pawkyikarus: you are right... but the more privacy the hopefully better security.. ;-)11:49
mariodokaaay ... makes a bit more sense now ... using a random mac address from what i understand would mean that you're showing a fake-id then11:49
mariodbut it's an id nontheless11:49
Pawkymariod: yes, otherwise when you are walking down the streets with your jolla wifi turned on, everybody can follow exactly where you are going.. google included11:50
mariodyou cannot not communicate / identify / get identified :)11:50
mariodhmmmm11:50
mariodbut why can google?11:50
ikarusPawky: mmmm, that depends on the value of you as a target11:51
Pawkymariod: they have buit a massive effort by pinpointing where all Wifis are geolocated..11:51
Pawkyamongst others..11:51
Pawkyhappily used by more darker forses..11:51
ikarusI would recommend anyone to actually take a course in intelligence to learn how the hell this stuff actually works11:51
mariodi see ... but weren't they stopped in Europe?11:51
Tegucombine enough data so it will begin to be valuable, I guess?11:51
Pawkypeople tend to happily use google apps etc, who report these kind of things11:51
Pawkymariod: the scanning using cars yes..11:52
ikarusGoogle is a company I want to see drawn and quartered11:52
Pawkybut people tend to happily use their apps etc, who also give away these things..11:52
mariodwell ... i don't use any app yet but ...11:52
mariodlet's see ...11:52
mariodthe alarm clock11:52
mariodthe terminal (got it yesterday) ...11:52
Pawkyyes.. what about it?11:52
mariodand the Kari file browser :)11:53
ikarusI actually disabled non-GPS geolocation on my Jolla because I don't trust those services11:53
Pawkythey can all potentially do this.. it depends on the programmer, company11:53
Pawkyikarus: they use wifi to pinpoint you..11:53
Sail0rhttps://i.imgur.com/HnJmvHm.gif11:53
ikarusPawky: Google does, Jolla uses celltower based11:53
ikarusPawky: and I still don't trust it11:54
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PawkySail0r: lol11:54
mariodand how did you go about disabling that ikarus ?11:54
mariodand do you use any map-app?11:54
Pawkywe need to be able to randomize our mac's11:54
mariodSail0r, ... i'm afraid i don't completely get the joke11:54
Pawkybrb meeting.. :-(11:55
Sail0rmariod: systemd is eating them all11:55
ikarusmariod: on the new version of SailfishOS (just out), it's in configuration, previously it was a single command11:55
mariodbut i can see that something or someone is eating away stuff that two people don't like11:55
Sail0rand combining them11:55
mariodi see ... so one command to rule them all?11:55
ikarusPawky: If you want I can package up a little app for that and perhaps even put it on Warehouse (can't be on the official store due to it's functionality)11:55
ikarusatleast for the WLAN interface11:55
mariodone command that does a lot of other stuff?11:56
entilhttps://bitbucket.org/Tarnyko/uselessd hasn't updated in a while11:57
mariodsooo ok ... from now on a simple command will do what was done with more before?11:57
mariodsorry ... am a little slow at times11:57
mariodalso ikarus ... i'm not sure what app / feature you want to make into an app there but what's the problem with it that you can't do it into the official store?11:58
mariodin part i'm saying this because i don't have access to this warehouse yet as well :)11:58
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mariodmacmaN, hello and welcome11:58
ikarusmariod: it would a) run as a background process from systemd (so it can regularly change it) and b) interact low level with the system in ways clearly not permitted11:59
mariodokaaay ... why is it not permitted?12:00
mariodside-note: i hope you can forgive me all for asking some more questions ... i'm not a proper techie yet ... i'm still learning stuff or interested in learning stuff12:01
ikarusmariod: because it requires priviliges that are also a huge security risk12:01
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mariodi see ... well maybe this is because i'm still green but if you continue to be loving and caring ... you will be a person that can be trusted ... and then people would know that you're not messing around with security in a bad way :)12:03
mariodwow ... this silence is deafening ... have i said anything all too stupid?12:06
mariodif so ... i am sorry12:06
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ikarusnah, just no point for me to really respond12:06
mariodokaaay :)12:07
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mariodsooo ... something else then if i may ...12:07
mariodi'm still trying to install the here-map ...12:08
mariodMorpog_PC told me that there are two different here-apps out there ... and told me that the android one is the better one regarding functions and other stuff ...12:09
mariodunfortunately though i couldn't download and install it yet12:09
mariodand according to ahjolinna if i remember correctly ... they said even though i've installed the Android Support ... it's not running12:10
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mariodi was told to install the terminal and activate dev mode ...12:11
mariodand here is something i was asked to enter ...12:12
mariodsystemctl status aliendalvik.service12:12
mariodwhich resulted in -> Active: inactive (dead)12:12
mariod...12:12
mariodthen ... ... ... systemctl enable aliendalvik.service12:12
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mariodi got a "access denied" ... i was told to get root priviledges ... which i did ... now this came here later ...12:13
mariodafter ...  systemctl enable aliendalvik.service12:13
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mariodThe unit files have no [install] section. they are not meant to be enabled using systemctl - - - - - - - Possible reasons for having this kind of units are: - - - - - - 1) a unit may be statically enabled by being symlinked from another unit's ---------  .wants/ or .requires/ directory. ------------ 2) a unit's purpose may be to act as a helper for some other unit which has a requirement dependency on it. ------- 3) a unit may be started12:15
mariodwhen needed via activation (socket, path, timer, D-Bus, udev, scripted systemctl call, ...)12:15
mariodsince ahjolinna had to go to bed i guess after this i didn't continue any further ... so i left and now i'm back ... i've rebooted my phone though ... sooo in case i have to enter something again ... please tell me12:16
TaaeemWhy is it not running?12:17
mariodi don't know Taaeem :)12:17
TaaeemSo it simply doesn't install or what?12:18
mariodthe here-map thing ... every time i selected it in the file browser and tapped "install" via the pull menu ... it didn't do anything12:19
mariodthe android support should be installed though ... the store says so12:19
politiehave you tried installing from a android store?12:21
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TaaeemDid you try to install any other app?12:21
fark_rabbitso has anyone used the milkymistone for anything other than video12:21
mariodany other android app you mean Taaeem ? ... no ... but i do have three other sailfish apps ... the alarm clock ... Kari file browser ... and the terminal12:21
mariodpolitie, that's something i haven't done yet because ... *trying to remember*12:22
politiei just checked and couldnt find it in the store, maybe thats why12:22
fark_rabbithttp://www.cnet.com/products/yotaphone-2/#!12:23
fark_rabbitwtf lol12:23
Taaeemmariod yes I meant android apps12:23
TaaeemMaybe try reinstalling android support12:23
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Jopethe easiest way to activate android support is to install any android app from the store12:24
Jopein case it refuses to start after you only install android support and then try to install an apk manually12:24
mariodpolitie, ... i am sorry ... i can't remember and can't find it in the logs ... but i remember there was something about the whole process ...12:24
mariodso that is why the others and i have went with manually downloading the here-map-apk-file12:25
mariodand i got the apk-file with "racoon"12:25
mariodthe only downloader that worked so far for me12:25
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mariodTaaeem, ? ... i'll uninstall Android support and install it again ...12:26
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mariodi will also reboot once the process has finished :)12:27
mariodby the way ... i think it's amazing how fast the apps get uninstalled :)12:27
mariodfirst reboot12:28
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mariodinstallation process started12:30
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mariodinstallation finished ... rebooting again ...12:30
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mariodphone has rebooted ... what now Taaeem ?12:32
mariodwelcome to Behold , emaj , cvp_ , HtheB12:32
Joonaamariod: now its updated12:33
HtheBhi mariod12:33
HtheBwhere is luigid? lol12:33
Joonaaoh sorry, you are talking about something else12:33
Joonaaignore that :)12:33
mariodLuigi is in the Mushroom Kingdom right now :)12:33
entilluigid, the video-game component in systemd12:34
HtheBhehehe12:34
mariod:) unfortunately a joke i cannot laugh yet about since i don't know that much yet ... but thanks for bring some humour here :)12:35
mariodJoonaa, ?12:35
mariodif you know what to do next ... you can bring yourself in too i am sure ...12:35
Joonaano, i dont even know what you are talking about lol12:35
Taaeemmariod try to install here maps again simply over your file manager12:35
mariodi was told that in IRC channels multiple conversations happen and many people jump and try stuff :)12:35
mariodok Joonaa12:36
mariodok ... one moment ... need to move the file again ... out of frustration i guess i deleted it :)12:36
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cvp_mariod, welcome ;)12:37
mariodalso ... for a reason i don't understand yet ...12:38
mariodmy phone's memory card doesn't show up on the computer any more12:38
mariodwait ... now here it is again12:39
mariodweird :D12:39
mariodit wasn't before12:39
mariodalright ... i tapped "install" again Taaeem12:41
mariodnothing is happening12:41
HtheBwhat are you guys trying to install?12:42
mariod"here" ... a map app :)12:43
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mariodi'll be right back ... need to get something to drink12:46
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TaaeemMmh I don't have that much ideas now, don't have a jolla so only assumptions12:48
Pawkyikarus: it would be nice to have an app that could be set to be triggered, either manually or periodically, (or in any other fancy way) randomize the MAC  :-)12:53
MorgawrYay, updated to newest SailfishOS and didn't brick my phone, achievement unlocked :D12:53
ikarusPawky: I might actually be able to bind it to ESSID scan or something like that12:55
tbrbroken upgrades seem to be mostly caused by people having random sh*t from OR installed12:55
* ikarus probably has time this weekend, unless her parents suddenly demand her visiting them12:55
Pawkyikarus: would be a cool feature :-)12:56
Stskeepsmwc, yet another day..12:56
PawkyI put qute some hope into the new browser, that i finally could be able to install adblock edge on the browser without the addon page being hugely bigger than the screen and not scalable... but, nope thats a no can do... :'(12:58
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PawkyWoud it be possible to cram in the Android XPrivacy app into the alien dalvik installation? It uses the exposed framwork and stuff...12:59
PaulePanterHi. Visiting <http://wingwheels.com/> causes the Web browser in my Jolla phone to crash.13:00
HtheBmariod: HERE works just fine over here13:01
PawkyHtheB: is there an official release of the android HERE app, or is it still the beta that counts?=13:01
ikarusPaulePanter: throw it up on together13:01
HtheBi dont know if its already out of beta13:02
HtheBbut you can download it from the Play store13:02
fluxwoohoo, android sound quality improvements13:02
HtheBif you do not want to use play store, you can also use Evozi13:03
Pawkylast you had to get it through aptoid i believe..13:03
HtheBPawky: no.13:04
Pawkyyes13:04
HtheBit was just from the website of Nokia Here itself13:04
HtheBand from Play store13:04
Pawkyoh... you mean the offline able version?13:04
mariodback ... sorry ... was also on a short stretch break ...13:04
HtheByes :p13:04
mariodHtheB, ... lucky you :)13:04
HtheBmariod: why cant you install it?13:04
mariodwell ... i am sorry but i have no idea why ...13:05
HtheBI know i had some trouble with android installation13:05
HtheBhave you got any other android apps?13:05
mariodi reported everything i could ... ask away some more questions and maybe we can find out what to do :)13:05
PawkyHtheB: i ama bit confused, its still only the android version that has offline function right, or have they fixed a Jolla native one now? :-)13:05
mariodno i have not tried to install any other android app yet13:05
HtheBmariod: Ah! there is your solution!13:05
HtheBgo to the Jolla store, and download any android app, like for instance the Amazon app13:06
marioderrr ... pardon? ... i don't understand HtheB13:06
HtheBafter that, open that app.13:06
HtheBand after THAT, you can install apk files ;)13:06
HtheBPawky: what do you mean ?13:06
mariodPawky, ?13:06
mariodPawky, ... i've tried the Sailfish version ...13:06
HtheBmariod: he's talking to me13:07
PawkyHtheB: the sailfish version does not use offline maps..13:07
mariodit doesn't work as well as the android version i've been told13:07
HtheBPawky: i know, thats why mariod wants to use the android version... :)13:07
mariodHtheB, sorry13:07
mariodwell it's one of the reasons HtheB :)13:07
HtheBand it has turn by turn navigation :p13:07
Jopemariod, as said by HtheB and myself, install ANY android app from the jolla store13:07
mariodMorpog_PC told me that it's working better too13:07
Jopeaptoide for example13:08
Pawkywhy doesn't jolla fix the issue with the original version?... beats me..13:08
mariodcan't "we" help Jolla out?13:08
mariodi thought this was an open source project !?13:08
Pawkyi installed the beta version from aptoide.13:08
HtheBoh so you did open up an android app?13:08
mariodi don't know much about programming yet sooo ... all i can offer to help you or Jolla with at the moment would be e.g. translating stuff from English to German :)13:08
PawkyHtheB: LOL13:08
mariodas i know both languages13:09
Pawkyyes, thats why I am wondering what I am piping out to the dark side of the internet as of speaking..13:09
Pawkyand why there are no ways to control it on the very phone that speaks security13:09
mariodHtheB, ... i will install another android app ... one moment please ... need to find one that i could maybe need13:09
HtheBmariod: just pick any app please13:10
HtheBlike Jope  and I said, just download the Aptoide, or Amazon app store13:10
HtheBfrom the official Jolla store13:10
mariodi see ... any app will do ... got you :) ... my bad!13:10
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Jopeyep, I never bothered figuring out what was stopping android support from starting and I usually install aptoide anyway :-)13:12
Jopebut it is a fact that it doesn't start if you have no APKs on the deviecs13:12
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mariodbut i do have an APK on my device13:13
Jopebut is it an installed apk13:13
Jopeit can't be just anywhere13:13
Jopeit needs to be in the android dir for apks (data/app)13:13
HtheBJope: no13:13
Jopeyep13:13
HtheBno13:13
Jopeso it is not relevant to this discussion.. (?)13:13
mariodplease don't argue13:13
HtheBindeed :D13:13
mariodalso ... i just read three commentaries ...13:13
HtheBJope: if you have an "installable" apk, it can be anywhere you want13:14
mariodthey say "aptoide" is slow or apps run slow ... something like that13:14
HtheBbut you cant install them, unless you opened up an android app before13:14
mariodwell i moved the apk-file i got to my downloads-folder13:14
JopeHtheB, yes, but if android support isn't running, how will you install it13:14
HtheBmariod: have you installed any android app from the Jolla store now?13:14
HtheBJope: thats why you need to run any app at least once on your device ever:p13:14
mariodaptoide is free software i also read13:14
mariodHtheB, ... almost ... the installation of "aptoide" is running13:15
mariodand it's done13:15
mariodwhat now?13:15
HtheByou really love dots dont you?13:15
HtheBopen up Aptoid13:15
HtheBAptoide*13:15
mariodi do :D *chuckle*13:15
Jope.. or just try to install the here apk from a file browser13:15
Jopeor transfers or where-ever ou can see it..13:15
mariodJope, that is what i tried :)13:15
HtheBdid the app opened?13:15
Jopemariod, but you didn't have android support running13:16
mariodi tried installing the apk-file via kari file browser13:16
Jopemariod, now you do that you installed aptoide from the jolla sore13:16
Jopemariod, now you can install apks manually13:16
Jopemariod, but not before.13:16
mariodslow down please ... i've installed this "aptoide"-thing ...13:16
HtheBafter you've opened up aptoide, close the app, and then install the apk from your filebrowser13:16
Jopeyay13:16
mariodand it launched13:16
HtheBread my last message :)13:16
Jopeyep, you don't need it for anything else than getting android support running13:16
Jopeof course feel free to use it later if you want to browse their collection of apps13:17
mariodweird ... this feature should be implemented into "android support" i think13:17
HtheBbeats me..13:17
JopeI agree, there is a chicken/egg problem here13:17
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PaulePanterikarus: Sorry, I won’t use non-standard Webplatforms.13:17
mariodbut that isn't a problem really13:17
Jopeyep13:17
mariodthe chicken was always here first :)13:17
Jopenot a big problem 'cause you can solve it just by installing any android app from the jolla store13:17
PaulePanterBugzilla or GitHub is enough if you really have to use something different from a mailing list in my opinion.13:18
mariodinteresting ... a new window i've never seen before ...13:18
HtheBjust press install and you're done13:18
HtheBhave fun13:18
Jope.. because you didn't have android support running yet13:18
Jope;-)13:18
HtheBAmadeusXNet_: you there?13:18
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mariodthe here-app wants to know a lot of stuff13:19
Jopemm mm13:19
AmadeusXNet_HtheB: yes13:19
Jopeit wants permissions mmmmm13:19
mariodbut i've been told that Nokia are good folks too13:19
mariodlike the permissions there ...13:19
Jopethis is the same with any android app that is better than hello world unfortunately13:19
mariodthey want to know how often i call my parents :D13:19
Jopeyes, They Know13:19
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Jopeotoh it's no different to any other smartphone platform13:20
mariod*shrug*13:20
Jopeapps can access stuff..13:20
mariodi've never had a smartphone :)13:20
Pawkyhas anyone succeeded to install adblock into the browser, if so how did you get passed th huge window for the settings?13:20
Jopeandroid likes to scare you by showing what the app gets access to before you install it13:20
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mariodwell i am glad it does do this scare :)13:20
Jopethen after the first 10 apps you stop caring and just hit install13:20
the_mgtit's like windows13:20
Jopeand it was a useless scary notice that no-one gives a damn about13:20
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Pawkyuntil NSA nocks on your door that is... or the SWAT team...13:21
Pawkythen you start caring again..13:21
the_mgtwhere you have to press ok for everything13:21
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mariodi know what you mean Pawky :)13:21
Pawkythe_mgt: if its to my comment, that might be, but there is no button as its outside the screen13:21
Pawkyand you cannot resize it..13:21
Pawkymariod: NSA knows as well :-)13:22
mariodoh i'm sure they know all of us already :)13:22
Pawkydoes anyone know what the first blog on the swedish version of NSA, the FRA was? :-)13:22
Pawky"follow us, because we follow you" :-D13:22
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mariod*chuckle*13:23
Pawkyno.. wait that was the swedish secret police.. but its the same :-D13:23
Pawkyyes, that is hilarious13:23
the_mgtmariod: nope, i was referring to the app access info stuff on android13:23
Pawkyso.. no one has ever installed any adblocker into the Jolla browser?13:24
Pawky:-/13:24
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mariodPawky, i'm new to everything ... i haven't done much yet :)13:24
fluxso it appears the new release comes with openvpn. I suppose it's a smart move to remove warehouse-installed openvpn first?-)13:24
marioddo you use "here" Pawky ?13:24
flux..or did it always come with openvpn..13:24
Pawkymariod: yes :-)13:24
HtheBPawky: just use WebPirate, it has build in adblocker13:24
PawkyHtheB: which is?13:24
mariodok ... that is some relief :)13:25
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mariodhere is installing ...13:25
Pawkythe beta HERE they spoke about on the jollatides site, downloaded from aptoid13:25
mariodany idea how long it will need?13:25
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Pawkymariod: like a meter or two...13:25
Pawkyan inch give and take..13:25
mariod*chuckle*13:25
PawkyB-)13:25
HtheBwhich is what Pawky ?13:25
JopeI got the final android here from aptoide13:25
Pawkywebpirate, never heard of13:26
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mariodwould you please excuse me for a brief time again? ... the kitchen's calling13:26
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Pawkymariod: its an IRC channel, you dont really need to announce such things..13:27
Jopeyes, just go13:27
Jope:-)13:27
Pawkylol13:27
Jopeno need to notify13:27
HtheBPawky: you fail13:27
mariodwell ... maybe on here ... but there are some other channels where people are asked to announce it :)13:27
Jopereally..13:27
Jopemakes me want to spend less time on freenode if this is a thing over here :-D13:27
Pawkywell, of course one could say brb , but one doesnt need to excuse oneself for it..13:28
HtheBPawky: get it from Warehouse and install webpirate....13:28
Pawkyits not a sin to have a life outside the IRC channel ;-)13:28
mariodand i guess since i try treating you all better than i would want to be treated ...13:28
JopePawky, you sure? I get the feeling that it is insulting towards the holy irc ;-)13:28
PawkyHtheB: sounds scary, to little info about it..13:28
HtheBPawky: seriously, get a life13:29
mariodi tend to announce such stuff :)13:29
mariodsooo ... see you in a few bits :)13:29
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PawkyHtheB: ok, got a life, now what am I supposed to do with it?...13:29
* HtheB ignores13:29
Pawkyso much for a life then, only being ignored...13:29
Pawkyor ignorant..13:30
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chem|stPawky: what is outside?13:30
Pawkychem|st: not much, milions of companies, and governments wanting to know what I am doing... online..13:30
chem|stthen I better stay here13:30
Pawkychem|st: lol13:31
politieparanoid13:31
Pawkypolitie: <--- yeah13:31
Pawkyespecially the dutch ones..13:31
politieim not watching13:31
politieim logging13:31
Pawkylol13:31
politie;)13:32
Pawky:-D13:32
PawkyI though GCHQ did that for you..13:32
Pawkyall for one, one for all..13:32
HtheBPawky: whatsup with the dutch police?13:32
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politiehaha13:33
PawkyHtheB: ask politie... lol13:33
politieAIVD baby13:33
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HtheBi see....13:36
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HtheBso AIVD has also arrived at #jollamobile.. bad news13:36
trigpoint_jollaUpdated to 1.1.2.16 yesterday,  have been having problems with ssh and streaming connections dropping every few minutes,  anyone else seen this issue?13:37
trigpoint_jollaStated happening today,  both fail together13:38
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Pawkynope, on the contrary, swithing between two languages on the keyboard is working again, yihaa :-)13:46
marid_breakalright ... i'm back13:47
trigpoint_jollait could be ee playing up, native irc is disconnecting too, but reconnecting automatically13:48
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mariodhere says i should register13:48
mariodis that normal too?13:48
Pawkymariod: you can use mailinator :-)13:48
Pawkywww.mailinator.com13:48
Pawkyexcellent service13:48
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Pawkymariod: as most program ar cloacked spyprograms wanting to be able to identify you, i say yes, its normal13:49
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mariodso i take it you used this mailinator-thing to register HERE?13:50
Pawkybut of course :-)13:50
Pawkyi use it all the time13:50
mariodbut if they're the good guys too ... why not use a proper email address?13:51
Pawkywhenever some "¤!! program wants to have some e-mail i happily give them some random one on maillinator.13:51
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Pawkymariod: if they where good guys, they shouldnt ask in the first place.13:51
mariodwell ... so far i've only registered a few computer programs i use ... and i created an extra email address given to me by my ISP13:51
Pawkyand, a mailinator is a proper email address.. just a bit anonymous13:52
mariodi see ... i read there that it says ...13:52
mariodevery email address is owned by everyone ...13:52
Pawkymariod:  :-)13:53
Pawkyyes, and everybody = nobody :-)13:53
Pawkygreat isnt it?13:53
ggabrielthere's a similar one for mobile phone numbers13:54
mariodoh really?13:54
ggabrielalthough the number itself is fixed13:54
Pawkyggabriel: tell me :-)13:54
ggabrieli cna't remembre... search for it13:54
mariodplease tell us :) ... sounds interesting too13:54
ggabrieli found one for the uk13:54
Pawkyggabriel: the ones I know of are mostly blacklisted13:54
ggabrieli didn't try it myself13:54
Pawkynever got those to work unfortunately13:54
Pawkyi have tried most of them, to no avail13:54
ggabrieloh, shame13:54
ggabrielmaybe not as good as it sounds then13:54
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Pawkynot the mobile phone ones.. unluckily... but I hope someone solves it someday13:55
mariodi didn't know such a thing exists ... and wouldn't even know properly how to search for things like that13:55
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ikarusdamn, Pebble Time Steel announced13:55
Pawkymariod: just ask, and I tell13:55
trigpoint_jollamariod: Registering on irc is only setting a password,  no email13:55
mariodwell ... what if you don't know the question itself as well?13:55
mariodbrb again ... someone on the door13:56
ikarusnow I need to talk myself out of needing one13:56
Pawkymariod: then you will be in the claws of all those predators.. who suck your internet blood dry..13:56
Pawkyikarus: check battery life..13:57
ggabrielsomething like these http://voip.about.com/od/security/tp/AnonymousNumberServices.htm13:57
ggabrielbut like Pawky says, they may be blacklisted already13:57
ggabrielprobably easier to have a few throw away simcards13:57
mariodikarus, ... i have no idea why or what you're cursing  :)13:57
ikarusPawky: 7 and 10 days, irrelevant13:58
Pawkyggabriel: hmm.. it was a while ago i last checked, will have a look at it :-)13:58
Pawkyikarus: well, then youre good to go.. for 7-10 days :-)13:58
Pawkyafterwards, you are gone.. at least time wise... :-D13:59
mariodtrigpoint_jolla, ... we weren't talking about registering an IRC-account this time ...13:59
Pawkymariod: security, and integrety is like time, once its gone, you will never get it back..13:59
mariodi have finally succeeded in installing "here"13:59
ggabrieli'll try theoretically if i hypotethically want to enable one of my alleged multiple fb accounts13:59
mariodand it asks me to register an account13:59
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Pawkymariod: so.. register a mailinator account, if they have blocked mailinator, just search for one of its aliases14:00
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mariodi think i will Pawky :)14:01
mariodbuuut ...14:01
mariodanother question here first ...14:01
mariodi just went with "testing it for free" ...14:02
mariodand when i selected "download maps" ...14:02
Pawkywell, then you cannot download any maps14:02
mariodit only lists my phone's internal memory as memory14:02
mariodwhy not the memory card?14:02
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Pawkyis it mounted?14:02
Pawkyoh.. yeah... you have to do stuff to get the maps onto the sd card14:03
sakustarPawky: did you figure out adblocking?14:03
mariodisn't it automatically? ... i mean ... when i open up Kari's file browser i can see it14:03
Pawkyif i dont remember wrongly the alien dalvik cqannot reach the sd card14:03
Pawkysakustar: nope..14:03
Pawkyi would like to use the well known adblock edge if possible14:04
mariodthe funny thing is you see ... here asked for access to the memory card before i hit install14:04
Pawkymariod: istn the kari browser a native app?14:04
Pawkyit speaks about your internal memory14:04
mariodnative as in pre-installed?14:04
sakustaroh webpirate is a browser app14:04
Pawkynative as built for the jolla OS14:04
mariodoh ... ok ... well yes :)14:05
Pawkysakustar: what I thought it was..14:05
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sakustarPawky: you can always write into the hosts file? :p14:05
mariodit's the only file browser i found when i looked for one after i got the phone14:05
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Pawkymariod: you can make android point upon the sd card, but it can seriously (read SERIOUSLY) f... up your android installation14:05
Pawkymariod: yes, and thats the one you should use, as its the native one.14:05
sakustari got a 11k line hosts file on my android phone :(14:06
Pawkythats huge14:06
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mariodi see Pawky14:06
mariodis that bad sakustar ?14:06
Pawkywell.. its huge for being a hosts file14:06
sakustarnot really. needs more lines to block finnish ads still but14:07
Pawkybut then again, shouldnt slow things down to much, but who wants to add stuff manually?14:07
sakustarjust takes a while longer to boot14:07
mariodwell i don't know what that is sooo i'm sorry that i have to ask :)14:07
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Pawkylonger to boot?14:07
Pawkydoubt that14:07
sakustaron android it does :014:07
mariodhow big are here-maps?14:07
sakustardunno why14:07
Pawkythey can be biiiig14:07
Pawkysakustar: some app trying nasty things?... but cannot reach due to you pointing to localhost?14:08
mariodwas also asking because the Jolla after all only has a 16 gb internal memory14:08
mariodand according to what i just read ... i only have about 11 gb left14:08
the_mgtthere is a method on tjc which alledgedly tells you how to share parts of your sdcard with aliendalvik14:09
sakustarhere maps can take over 1 gb per country14:09
mariodeven though i haven't really installed that much stuff ... but i guess the OS takes away some space too :D14:09
sakustaratleast on wp814:09
sakustari have 14.3 gb left after installing sailfish patches and a few android programs :o14:09
sakustarbut its the 2nd day the phone is on14:10
mariododd ... how come i have so little left?14:10
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mariodall i have at the moment is Kari file browser14:10
mariodthe terminal14:10
mariodandroid support14:10
mariodaptoide14:10
sakustarandroid apps probably fill space with cache etc14:10
mariodand the alarm clock14:10
sakustarmy chrome on android 4.4.2 was almost 2 gb14:10
mariodoh yes ... and now "here" :)14:10
sakustarafter a year or so ;)14:11
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mariodwhich brings me to something else ...14:11
mariodis there some tool that i need to run that deletes garbage and things that aren't important (any more) ?14:11
mariodi'm just asking because i don't know if it's normal that i now only have 11 gb left14:12
sakustarif you have photos and stuff they take up space :)14:14
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mariodwell i don't :) ... only the ones pre-installed14:16
mariodno wait ...14:16
mariodi already moved them to my backup :)14:16
mariodsooo no ... not there any more :)14:16
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mariodalright then ... i will register "here" later ... thanks again for your help ... i'll be back in a few more bits ...14:23
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trigpointLooks like my problem was EE gremlns, not jolla14:48
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HtheBhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E39WWj_RpBc14:50
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chem|stmariod_|_break: if you want to use android"maps" on your phone you should consider to move the android "media" folder onto a sdcard16:18
dr_gogeta86kudos to sledges https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QChGgmdvqhw16:19
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tadzikoh, it shows SFOS2 running on the jolla phone too16:26
tadzikawesome16:26
tadzikI really like the changes16:26
Morpog_PCthe tmo guys already start to panic again about the changes :D16:27
tadzikheheh16:27
tadzikdifferences, nooooooo ;P16:27
dr_gogeta86i imagine patch manager16:27
dr_gogeta86situation app integrated16:27
tadzikoh?16:27
tadzikoh, imagine16:27
dr_gogeta86timed ambiance profiles16:28
tadzikin recommended there's another video on sfos2 itself16:28
tadzikhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X2-w5jIxySM the one16:28
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tadzikinterestingly, it has no app shortcuts on the main screen16:30
chem|sttadzik: differences? I am more about being "like" android16:30
tadzikI wonder if that is supposed to encourage people to never close them16:30
chem|sttadzik: you like having to swipe twice to go to the events-view?16:31
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tadziktwice from where?16:32
chem|stwe are asking to have more on the events-view for over a year now, now that we get what we asked for the global gesture gets sacrificed16:32
chem|sttadzik: in app you need to minimize first16:32
tadzikah, indeed16:32
chem|stI have most apps always open as this is multitasking so what do I need a launcher on the hotseat for?16:33
Morpog_PCI'm shocked that homescreen seems to be fixed at portrait on phone16:33
Morpog_PCwould be a letdown for TOHKBD owners16:33
tadzikI keep those on the hotseat that I don't need often, but I don't like looking for them, like Phone or Messages16:33
chem|sttadzik: I am talking about the global gesture for launcher, not the favourits16:34
tadzikespecially since my experience with 4 open apps is a lot better than with >4, and if you go >9 some of them are outright unreachable16:34
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tadzikah16:34
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tadzikyeah, good point16:34
tadzikusually when I need to switch from one app to another I do it from homescreen, since this kind of switching is bound to happen a few times16:35
tadzikbrowser-messages-browser-music-browser or so16:35
chem|stthere are simple ways to get around those questions or call it shortcomings, one is a zoom out gesture on home-screen to show all running apps scrollable for example16:35
tadzikor rather s/browser/quickditt/g16:35
tadzikyep16:35
tadzikI wonder if the fact that you now have to upswipe for app list is there so you can actually scroll the homescreen16:36
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chem|stbut there are better ways than that...16:37
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tadziksuch as?16:38
chem|stit is a multitouch device...16:38
chem|stthe UI was designed gesture based16:38
tadzikI don't see how that suddenly makes swiping obsolete16:39
chem|stso what is the logic answer to something like that? buttons on covers isn't one16:39
tadzikzooming out will make the app covers even more unreadable and unclickable16:39
tadzikI'd rather have a few "screens" of them, with preassigned positions16:39
chem|sttadzik: it is a 330dpi screen, do you know how much you could zoom out until something looks ugly?16:40
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tadzikoh, you're going about the tablet16:40
tadzikI'm thinking in terms of 2.0 on the phone, I don't care for the tablet too much16:40
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tadzikalso, personally, I find small things hard to read no matter how good the DPI is, but maybe that's just me16:41
chem|stsame for the phone, reduce the spacing a bit so you can hav slightly larger covers16:42
chem|stit is covers... do you want to read a webpage on a cover?16:42
tadzikno, why would i16:43
tadzikbut I like seeing a song name, or a calendar entry16:43
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chem|stalso how about to let the user decide how many covers to see (like on N9) and have two finger scroll for moving around16:43
tadzikI'd be okay with that16:43
chem|stin general I would set launcher on a two-finger pull up globally but have a developer flag to turn it off in apps16:44
Liekei like being able to use the phone with one hand16:45
ShawnMcCoolone hand please16:45
ShawnMcCoolpeople with small hands can't sometimes, though ;)16:45
chem|sthow about pull the favourit-bar then?16:46
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tadzikfor me 4.5 is too big for one hand anyway, and I don't have the smallest hands :)16:46
tadzikI can't reach all 4 corners with my thumb while holding the phone firmly16:46
chem|stor as we loose the ambience switcher... there are side-swipes!16:46
chem|stShawnMcCool: Lieke there is a solution to that problem without destroying the "clean" and "buttonless" design16:47
chem|stor sacrifice one hand use16:48
ShawnMcCooli need more experience with the device to have an opinion16:48
ShawnMcCoolbut, i definitely need to be using my thumb "mostly"16:48
Liekeyeah, side-swipes could work16:49
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Teguwell, the apps start to get killed with a few apps open already..16:49
chem|stand then open it like an app that can be scrolled left right... instead of changing direction to up down16:49
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chem|stTegu: that is a oom-killer issue and I consider the whole idea of oom-killer a bad example of curing symptoms instead of disease16:51
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chem|stwhat happened to proper swapping?16:52
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chem|stsacrifice apps for pretending to have a slick and fast UI...16:53
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PaulePanterLooks like the Sailfish OS downloaded the update over UMTS despite I’m being in a WLAN. :(17:04
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tadzikuhhh17:06
mariod_|_breaka d17:07
mariod_|_breakand back17:07
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mariodchem|st, ... i got your message ...17:07
mariodi would do that but someone said before that android and something with memory card ... leads to breaking the system17:07
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mariodPaulePanter, ?17:09
mariodthere's some settings in system i think17:09
mariodthat says ... download updates via wlan only17:09
chem|stmariod: who said that? the only thing I know is broken is uSD MTP export17:10
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mariodtrying to remember ... chem|st17:11
mariodall i remember for sure is ... someone on here gave a warning17:12
mariodso you say it's working for you chem|st ?17:12
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chem|stI wrote the howto for btrfs on sdcard...17:13
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mariodi think it'd be a nice thing for sure if all the android stuff like map data would be stored in a folder on the memory card17:13
mariodand maybe other stuff as well :)17:14
chem|stas long as you are "safe" with a terminal you should be ok17:14
mariodthere's a saying ...17:14
mariodthe / a terminal is not your enemy :)17:14
mariodi may not know that much yet ... but i'm willing to learn :)17:14
chem|stbest idea is think before you do17:15
mariodin other words ... i'm not a professional techie like a bunch of other people i've seen here :)17:15
marioddon't worry ... i usually do that :)17:15
chem|stif you do not understand a command, google it before you do something with it17:15
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mariodthat's what i usually do too ... and if i don't use a search engine i ask someone :)17:15
chem|stmariod: do you have an editor of choice on your terminal?17:16
mariodon the Jolla?17:16
chem|stwell in general17:16
chem|stdon't know what is available for jolla as I use vim and that is available ;)17:17
mariod:) well ... no ... i don't have any favorite / prefered editor ... yet17:17
chem|sthttps://together.jolla.com/question/4080217:17
mariodi'm still learning various stuff ... and so far i didn't need one yet often :)17:18
chem|stthere is the how to, best is you ssh onto your device17:18
chem|stand you will need an cli texteditor17:19
mariodthat could be a problem i think ... i'm currently forced to use a windows machine here ...17:19
mariodand have to wait till i get an external hard disk ... then i can finally dual boot with linux :)17:19
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chem|stssh for windows is called putty -> http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~sgtatham/putty/download.html first item17:20
mariodbut thanks for the link and guide ... and hopefully you'll be here for some longer time ... that way we (people on here and me) can ask you some stuff about it if we have some more questions :)17:20
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chem|stI will go home now but I will be on later tonight, if you got questions just ask here (highlight me) or query and wait for my response17:21
mariodwell with  "longer time" i meant that i hope you will still be here in the days and <bigger unit for time> to come :)17:22
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mariodone question already though please ... does this cancle my warranty?17:22
mariodam asking because i got the phone about two months or so ago ... can't remember right now17:23
chem|stin general everything that can be recovered by a factory reset does not void your warranty17:23
chem|stif you delete btrfs partitions especially the bootfs that voids your warranty and is your own fault, is like 25eur plus shipping to get it reflashed at optima17:24
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mariodi see ... well like i said i'm new to all this ... i didn't know what the warranty says about this :)17:26
chem|stfor the if I be around question, my client is idling 24/7 but there are times I am actually here^^17:26
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mariodalright :) ... and you said i can leave you messages in a query too ... i will do that too when needed ... thanks for the offer :)17:27
chem|stdeveloper mode does not void your warranty per se17:27
chem|stbb17:27
mariodlaters! :)17:27
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HtheBI think I've triggered the guys at Pebble by showing the OH concept of Jolla...17:37
HtheBtriggered to give them ideas17:37
mariodwhat kind of ideas?17:37
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r0kk3rzgood work HtheB17:38
HtheB:P17:38
HtheBthey have the same concept of the "OH" now17:39
HtheBI mailed the guys a year ago, and they told me that they were interested in it17:39
mariodi have no idea what you're talking about :) ... but if it is a good thing ... i'm happy for you then :)17:39
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HtheBstop using dots mariod17:40
mariodsorry :) what do you prefer i should do seperate some sentences? :)17:40
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r0kk3rza comma?17:41
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r0kk3rz"Smart Straps" interesting17:43
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HtheByeah17:47
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HtheBso the mail that I got from them was not a lie :)17:48
HtheB(that was a year ago)17:48
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messertingHi, in opt-in upgrade 1.1.0.38 we had "Attempting to view events (via swipe-up gesture on the lock screen) while the device is locked now brings up the device lock keypad to allow unlocking the device"17:51
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messertingIn the current opt-in upgrade this feature is gone17:52
messertingCan anyone confirm?17:52
Teguwhat happens instead? (haven't opted in)17:53
messertingI have 1.1.2.16, and if the device lock is active, and I peak on notifications and try to press on a notification, the notification screen goes away17:53
messertingSo I do this: Notice I got an notification, double-tap to wake screen, peak on notifications, try to press the notification, but must instead enter lock code, then swipe to get the lock screen, and then press the notification.17:55
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messertingIn 1.1.0.38, we could peak on notification, press the notification, then enter code, and get directly to the notification target.17:55
messertingSad regression.17:56
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messertingtypo in my previous comment: " then swipe to get the lock screen" should be " then swipe to get the notification screen"17:57
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coderusmesserting: can't confirm18:58
messertingcoderus: thanks. So: you have lock code active, you triple tap on power to make the code active. Then double tap to wake screen, slide from below and up, and release finger. Notifications does not go away?19:00
coderusmesserting: i'm not triple tap, i have devicelock with no timeout19:01
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coderusmesserting: after peeking notifications devicelock is appear19:02
coderusand after entering code i can click on notifications19:02
Morpog_PChttps://twitter.com/AgileArtem/status/572829611450626048/photo/119:02
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Hartzihaha :D19:07
Hartzinice one19:07
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phlixi_Hi there ;-) What is your approach in the following scenario: You are reading something in the Jolla browser, then you arrive at home and want to read the rest of the page on a different device (laptop/tablet etc). So essentially, you need to transfer the URL, what do you do?19:24
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phlixi_often it seems to be the fastest, to google the title, maybe with some parts of the URL. Google usually works pretty well for that (even corrects typo etc). Any better solutions? (And occasionally that does not work, because google has no index on it etc)19:27
TemeVcopy paste the url and query it to myself in irc19:30
phlixi_the other way i often use qr codes, works pretty well for me19:31
phlixi_but emailing (irc/twitter/etc) the link to my self does not feel as satisfyingly to me as the qrcode thing19:32
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phlixi_its always kinda bumpy19:33
phlixi_essentially to many taps on the phone :-)19:33
Liekethere's sendtojolla in openrepos19:33
phlixi_if it does what the name suggests, then its the wrong way19:34
Liekei think it works both ways19:34
phlixi_but i am looking for all ideas available, therefore currently checking https://openrepos.net/content/mkiol/send-jolla anyqay, thanks ;-)19:34
TemeVI once used app to merge clip boards of two PCs, maybe there is a way to use that with Jolla also19:35
phlixi_Getting text from phone's clipboard <<= sounds promising! :-)19:35
phlixi_(from the app description)19:36
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mariodguys ... some other question here if i may ... what do you think about the apps listed in this blog? ... are they really something someone with the Jolal should also check out?19:52
mariodlink -> https://thomas-leister.de/android/empfehlenswerte-freie-android-apps-aus-dem-f-droid-store-foss/ <-19:52
phlixi_mariod: I tried antennapod once on an android device, but was missing gpodder pretty fast there, go for https://openrepos.net/content/thp/gpodder19:54
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phlixi_also barcoder, there is a nice qrcode reader in the jolla store ( i like the one with the orange icon)19:54
phlixi_can not say much about the others19:55
mariodokaaay ... thanks for your feedback phlixi_ :)19:55
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mariodsomething else here too ...19:56
phlixi_not sure if some of the other make sense on jolla, like you can simply edit the hosts file i guess19:56
mariodi remember that with the phone i had before i should wait till the battery was almost dead and then charge it again19:56
mariodor otherwise something like "memory effect" or whatever it's called will damage the battery19:56
marioddoes Jolla have the same problem?19:57
Nicd-there is no memory effect with li-ion batteries19:57
phlixi_i guess that information is outdated for the last 15 years or so... i heard lipo batteries like it most at 70% => charge early if you like19:57
Nicd-that is practically all batteries nowadays19:57
mariodok ... well you can see now that i had a pretty old phone :D19:57
mariod*laughing*19:58
Nicd-li-ions like to be charged, in fact you should avoid using them all the way19:58
Nicd-the phone and battery's circuits will keep it from being discharged too much but if you completely use it and then leave it without charge for days, it might harm the battery life19:58
mariodokaaay ... well i had to ask ... was a bit worried because i had to plug in the Jolla a few times today to my computer to install some stuff ... like right now i downloaded and installed "f-droid" ... i read it's a nice source for open source apps :)19:58
mariodthanks for the info Nicd-19:59
Nicd-you don't have to care how much you charge li-ions19:59
Nicd-as long as you don't keep the phone charging 24/719:59
phlixi_mariod: you might want to have a look at openrepos19:59
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phlixi_mariod: https://openrepos.net19:59
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mariodbut isn't that the store that cancles your warranty?20:00
TemeVno, but it might cancel your privacy20:00
mariodor am i mistaking it for something else? ... i am sorry i'm all new to this and i haven't really worked much with installation and configuration so far20:00
phlixi_not sure if installing fdroid store is possible without enabling developer mode? might be possible, i dont know. but if not, its "worse" ;-)20:01
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mariod*shrug* well i had to activate developer mode yesterday ...20:01
TemeVthere is no qa for openrepos, so there might be nasty stuff, but I haven't heard yet that there would be any20:01
mariodi tried to install the "here"-maps20:01
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Nicd-phlixi_: f-droid is just an apk. you can install it without dev mode20:02
phlixi_ah, ok20:02
phlixi_didnt remember20:02
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mariodphlixi_, ? ... what's this QR-thing called? ... i tried looking for it by searching for QR ...20:02
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phlixi_but i guess you also have to check something like "allow potentionally evil apks from everywhere"20:03
mariodall i got was an app for bookmarks20:03
TemeVmariod: codereader is nice code reader app in jolla store20:03
mariodwell ... i personally don't want apps from just everywhere ... i do want some trusted ressources :)20:03
phlixi_mariod: it is called "CodeReader" and I am pretty sure I installed it from the jolla store20:04
mariodfound it :)20:04
mariodplease don't think of me as totally stupid but i don't even know for sure what all this is for :)20:05
phlixi_thats no problem :-)20:05
ortylpafter the update android apps lost access to sd card, is it a known issue?20:05
mariodi'm still in the process of learning stuff :)20:05
mariodortylp, ?20:06
mariodchem|st, gave me this link ...20:06
mariodhttps://together.jolla.com/question/40802/how-to-format-your-usd-card-to-btrfs-and-share-space-with-android/20:06
mariodmaybe this can help you too?20:06
mariodi have not followed the instructions yet20:06
mariodas i have to read some more on what all this actually does20:06
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mariodbut this i was told helped others with android and memory card issues20:07
mariodalso ... chem|st said they'd be back later (if they aren't already)20:07
ortylpmariod: I updated to 1.1.2.16 yesterday.  with the previous version I have mounted the sdcard in such a way, that I could access it from Android apps, now it is gone20:08
messertingortylp: I also have 1.1.2.16, I can test20:09
messertingwhich app?20:09
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ortylpmesserting: no matter which. the whole dalvik gets barred from sdcard, in my case OSMAnd, in short: yesterday worked, today no any more20:10
mariodnice ... i also did this update :)20:10
ortylpOK, then I dive into shell to figure out what went wrong....20:11
mariodTemeV, and phlixi_ ?20:11
mariodi found out what it does :)20:11
phlixi_hm?20:11
mariodat least with one of the things :)20:11
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mariodi scanned in the QR-thingy i found on a box that contained a cd here ...20:12
mariodand i could then go to the manufacturer's website and order another cd if i wanted to :)20:12
mariodsooo i guess this is what it is for then eh?20:13
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phlixi_mariod: i mostly use it with this: https://addons.mozilla.org/de/firefox/addon/mobile-barcoder/ I hover my mouse in the browser over the button and get an qrcode20:13
mariodscanning a picture that redirects you to the internet to get some more information on a product you can buy for instance :)20:13
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phlixi_mariod and sometimes i use that: http://www.heise.de/download/qr-code-generator-1185046.html (if its data that is not a currently surfed URL)20:14
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mariodhmmm ...20:15
mariod"erzeugt QR-Codes aus WLAN-Einstellungen" ...20:16
mariod*trying to understand that properly* ...20:16
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mariodhow can wlan-configurations be saved as such a picture thingy?20:17
mariodi mean ... what is this? ... do you let's say type the password ...20:17
mariodcreate a picture out of the text ...20:17
phlixi_more or less, yes20:17
mariodand then scan in on to the phone so that the password is on the phone then?20:17
phlixi_WLAN settings is just an example20:18
mariodinstead of giving away the password in plain text you give away the password in a picture ?20:18
mariodjust trying to understand it ... it sure does sound interesting as well :)20:18
mariodthanks for that info20:18
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r0kk3rzits a method of having a really long WPA key without having to remember the whole thing20:19
phlixi_then you might want to lookup http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/QR_code20:19
r0kk3rzmy method is just having a really long random WPA key, because I can remember it and everyone else forgets it as soon as they hear it20:20
phlixi_well, you can basically code every text into a barcode20:20
mariodokaaay ... interesting :) ... or like Spock said ... Fascinating ;)20:21
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mariodany (other) recommendations you or others can give about what to install?20:23
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mariodso far i've got "aptoide" ... was told i could get some android stuff there if needed ... plus it was the program that activates android on the phone ...20:23
mariodthe alarm clock ... the terminal ...20:23
mariodcalender ... documents ...20:24
mariodfile browser ...20:24
mariodthe weather thing that came with the update ...20:24
mariodand here maps :)20:24
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mariodi thought about getting a dictionary maybe ...20:24
mariod"dict.cc" has an app i saw20:24
ortylpmariod: aardict from fdroid20:25
ortylpmariod: http://aarddict.org20:25
mariodhmmm ... thank you ortylp ... but isn't that a wikipedia-reader?20:26
ortylpmariod: I have 20GB of Wikpedia (en/de/pl) and some dictionaries, all offline20:26
mariodor am i misunderstanding this?20:26
mariod20 GB? ... wow!20:26
mariodi have not yet transfered all the stuff i'd like to be downloaded on to the memory card ...20:27
ortylpmariod: wikipedia or dictionary does not matter, just copy the files to your device and ready20:27
mariodlooks like i should really look into chem|st's guide right now :D20:28
mariodortylp, ... in some way it does matter ... wikipedia is an encyclopedia ... not a dictionary :)20:28
ortylpmariod: on all my devices 64GB sdcard is minimum, 20GB for wikipedia+dictionaries and additional 10GB+ for offline maps, that is for the start20:28
mariod64 gb?20:28
mariodi thought jolla only allowed for 32 gb?20:28
mariodand internal memory is like 16 gb only20:28
phlixi_well, one could argue if it is usefull to carry offline wikipedia around. in contrast i prefer to simply lookup online whati want20:29
ortylpmariod: I use wikipedia allso as dictionary, because all these three languages that I use are linked within aardict, you search for one word, get answers in three languages20:29
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phlixi_i could imagine that those 20gb get outdated pretty fast20:30
phlixi_...what comes to my mind: https://what-if.xkcd.com/59/ :-)20:30
ortylpphlixi_: I never depend on online access, when you need it it is unavailable.  for me per definition an app that requires network acces to work properly is broken by design20:30
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phlixi_for exactly this reason, i carry a lot of audio on my sd card... i guess its preference... :-)20:31
ortylpphlixi_: it gets updated usually one a year, if you wish to compile these files yourself, daily updates were possible :D20:32
ortylpphlixi_: I do carrry audio... that is the queue of podcasts, that are waiting for my time to be listened to20:33
mariod:)20:33
phlixi_mariod: as far as i know 32gb is officially supported. however i also use a 64gb card (and i would not recommend the btrfs guide if you are not familiar to the linux command line)20:34
mariodhere's another thing ... do you know of any trustworthy cross-platform app [supporting iOS, android and preferably sailfish as well] that lets you communicate for free another person using this app?20:34
mariodwith your voice, via text, by exchanging files ... stuff like that :)20:34
mariodphlixi_, ... i know a little bit about it and learnt something new again today phlixi_ :)20:35
phlixi_mariod: i prefer threema, mostly because it is established in my peer group (and you can by the app on their site, without the need for google playstore or the like)20:35
mariodi may not be as experienced as people here but i'm willing to learn :)20:35
ortylpmariod: get jabber account, or run your own jabber (XMPP) server. that's it20:35
phlixi_of course, if your "peers" have jabber, than thats prefered ;-)20:35
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phlixi_but i guess you would not ask then20:35
phlixi_of course there are clients for twitter and facebook20:36
mariodwell i'm asking because the people i want to talk to know even less about technology than i do :) ... but we're trying to learn stuff :)20:36
phlixi_depending on where you frieds are i guess20:36
phlixi_and i do a lot of email :-)20:37
mariodjabber sounds interesting ... facebook and twitter - please ... that's not really trustworthy :)20:37
mariodbut i cannot run a server20:37
ortylpOK, I am not getting any further with the android access to the SD card... mounted as btrfs, all unix access rights granted, and it still does not work20:37
phlixi_i dont use facebook either, but ive heard from people they are kinda forced to do so ;)20:37
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mariodwell ... i gave it a try phlixi_ ...20:38
marioddidn't use it much buuut ...20:38
r0kk3rzyou dont have to run your own jabber server20:38
r0kk3rzbut you can20:38
mariodnow that i know how it works ... i use it even less and will probably delete my account20:38
mariodwell ... i can't ... i don't have the know-how ... and if i had ... i still could not because i don't have an own server / i don't have the money or equipment20:40
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TaaeemHow about telegram?20:42
TaaeemClients for every OS out there I think20:42
TaaeemAnd open source20:43
TaaeemI think20:43
r0kk3rzopen-ish20:43
r0kk3rzthey havent opened their servers yet20:43
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phlixi_https://www.eff.org/de/secure-messaging-scorecard20:43
r0kk3rzshame textsecure doesnt work on the jolla20:44
ortylpmariod: I can imagine, that finding the right provider for jabber (XMPP) is not easy, but I think that is the only standardised, well understood and supported messaging protocol.20:44
r0kk3rzthey need a way to manually put in the sms verification code...20:44
mariodhow come "jabber" is not listed on the link phlixi_ just shared with us? *wondering* ...20:45
Pawky|2the Jolla USB storage connection will not copy files beyond ~2GB :-(20:45
Taaeemr0kk3rz: for text secure it may be possible in near future the protocol is already implemented in qt20:45
mariodsounds like it ortylp ... i'll have to find out how it works ... how to register ... etc ... then :)20:45
Pawky|2mariod: finally succeeded with your HERE maps?20:45
phlixi_mariod: well, email is not listed there as well, and a lot of other stuff :-)20:46
mariodPawky|2, yes :) ... and welcome back :)20:46
Pawky|2:-)20:46
r0kk3rzits open source, of course its possible20:46
mariodJitsi is there however :)20:46
r0kk3rzbut i wasnt sure whether anyone was actually doing it yet20:46
mariodJitsi comes from Jabber :)20:46
phlixi_i guess because jabber is not such a new hipster mesenger network that only works with its own client20:46
mariodthere's no mobile OS port though yet20:46
ortylpmariod: I have already tested video calls with jitsi on linux, works without hiccups, only echo canceling is not yet as good as in skype20:48
mariodi'll give jitsi a try soon ... i've tried ekiga but it has never been able to establish a connection so far20:48
r0kk3rzphlixi_: vendor lock-in is the game everyones playing these days20:48
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r0kk3rzcompatibillity is so 199020:49
phlixi_Lieke: thanks a lot fot the hint with https://openrepos.net/content/mkiol/send-jolla does exactly what i was looking for (allthoug hin my case the name of the app is kinda irritating/wrong) ;-)20:50
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mariodortylp, i hope it'll get better and better then :)20:51
mariodi do use skype once in a while ... but i'm looking forward to getting rid of it too :)20:51
Pawky|2has anyone else had problems copying huge files from the phones SD card using the PC connect?20:51
mariodi didn't have to move huge files yet ...20:51
ortylpPawky|2: I use rsync or sftp (from within mc)20:52
Pawky|2mc?20:52
phlixi_Pawky|2 I sometimes copy some files via SFTP (thus wlan, not usb) and can not remember problems. largest file sprobably are some 4-5gb dvd rips ;-)20:53
ortylpPawky|2: https://www.midnight-commander.org/20:53
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Pawky|2ahh.. ok...20:53
phlixi_however, thats to slow if you do that often :)20:54
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Pawky|2well, i just ripped the sd card out and copied it externally, just wanted to flag there are issues with copying huge files using the PC connect...20:54
ortylpphlixi_: yep20:54
mariodplease excuse me for a few more bits ... phone call20:54
Pawky|2just had to move two 27 gb images on the card20:54
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phlixi_i probably would try to do sftp over usb then :-)20:55
mariodok ... back ... sorry ...20:55
Pawky|2well, there are many ways to copy things, what I am after is that the driver seems broken20:55
Pawky|2and checking wether others have encountered the same issues20:56
mariodi don't think i have such a huge file that i could try Pawky|220:58
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mariodi could "zip" a game-folder maybe20:59
Pawky|2well.. one could alwasy create one with /dev/urandom and dd ...20:59
mariodonly in linux :)21:00
Pawky|2well, your phone is a linux box..21:00
mariodi don't have my external hard disk yet so that i could reinstall my system here21:00
Pawky|2but no need to put an effort in creating a huge file. My main point is to just flag for the issue in here, and whenever other encounter the same they at least know they are not alone.21:01
Pawky|2mariod: maybe you don't know it, but there are some jolla workers hiding in here as well ;-)21:02
Pawky|2sometimes one succeeds to fetch their attentionn :-)21:02
mariod*chuckle*21:02
mariodwell you go about it all wrong Pawky|2 ...21:03
mariodyou see ... you can do it in a childish way ... by pretending to play hide and seek ...21:03
mariodCome out, come out whereever you are! :)21:03
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mariod*laughing*21:03
Pawky|2mariod: lol, well I am not the one though. others are, mentioning things in here sometimes grab their interesest, or at least they might know about them.21:04
mariodwell i am happy to hear some actual Jolla workers are here too ...21:05
Pawky|2It is actually thanks to the people in here  that made me buy the Jolla as well.21:05
mariod:)21:06
mariodi got mine because i read a few articles about it :)21:06
Pawky|2back in the N9 days I got help, and since then I am a devoted Nokia -> Jolla customer21:06
mariodthe promise of an open source operating system ... safe and secure ...21:06
mariodand on top of all that ... with some European standards ...21:07
Pawky|2but even though they lurk here in the shadows this  channel is purely a user/developer forum...21:07
Pawky|2Well, its not all opensource though..21:07
mariodthe only thing that isn't yet i was told is the swipe-thingy21:08
Pawky|2there are still some proprietarey drivers lurking around21:08
mariodbuuut i hope they'll go fully open source some time :)21:08
Pawky|2The swipe stuff is certainly opensource21:08
Pawky|2its the chip drivers that usually aren't21:08
TaaeemFor the drivers it's not jollas fault and the rest is the UI and some apps21:08
Pawky|2like network drivers21:08
Pawky|2Taaeem: never said it was :-)21:09
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Pawky|2but still it creates problems... such for those (like me) wanting to enable multicast...21:09
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mariodwhat is that?21:10
Pawky|2or, wanting it to already be enabled in the wifi driver... the driver listens to it, but nothing more :-(21:10
Pawky|2multicast is used when you want to send one stream to be listened by many network cards at once..21:11
Pawky|2like a radio signal21:11
Pawky|2one signal, lots of listners..21:11
mariodinteresting ... and THAT doesn't work yet?21:11
ortylpcan anyone constructively contribute to https://together.jolla.com/question/84794/dalvik-access-to-sdcard-lost-after-update-to-11216/ ?21:12
Pawky|2you can configure the driver for it in the config file, because the driver could be compiled to do so, but due to it draining batteries  they force it of21:12
mariodhmmm ...21:13
ortylpPawky|2: I do not know what your exact setup is, but in case there is any switch/router there, then listeners must register themselfs21:13
mariodwhat if you changed it so that it works when it's charging?21:13
ortylpPawky|2: and this switch/router must also actively support multicast21:14
mariodbrb21:14
Pawky|2ortylp: the other stuff surely does support multicast. its the jolla wifi that doesnt21:14
Pawky|2Sony uses "direct wifi" ,meaning wifi and multicast for their periferal products... android supports it, but not jolla. Thus the jolla phone stands outside the possibiility to be Sony compatible wifi wise21:16
Pawky|2I do not see any problem having the multicast part standar "off" on the driver, but it would be fair if the driver would be compiled for it, and thus be able to listen to the config when you manually enable it..21:17
Pawky|2this way one could at least turn it on when you want to play with your expensively bought Sony equipment. Now the camera has just been sitting on my desk for more than half a year... :-(21:17
b944hi together, does someone has seen a MWC Discount Code for the jolla phone? Thanks in advance...21:18
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Pawky|2b944: ?21:20
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b944Pawky|2: I'd like to buy a phone and missed the valentine and Fosdem codes to get the phone discounted for 200 € ...21:22
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mariodb944, ?21:23
mariodit's a bit late for that but maybe you can ask them via email?21:23
Pawky|2b944: i believe you can still just buy it with this discount, or what are they priced now?21:23
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mariodphlixi_, ortylp, Pawky|2  and everyone else who shared some info with me there before ...21:25
ortylpPawky|2: Sony has been banned from my list of manufacturers I consider for buying from, I am not willing to support the politics of putting their customers to jail and raiding with SWAT teams21:25
Pawky|2b944: if you buy the tablet you can gat them for even a better discount :-D21:25
mariodregister.jabber.org ... ... ... says21:25
mariodWe have temporarily disabled account registration at the jabber.org IM service ...21:25
b944thanks for the answer, the codes doesn't work right now...21:26
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mariodortylp, what are you talking about there? ... why would they want their customers get raided with SWAT?21:26
b944Pawky|2the tablet comes out When? -- I'd like to have the phone now :-)21:26
mariodif you order the tablet right now you would get it in June i think ...21:27
Pawky|2b944: maybe you can make a deal, buy both, get phone now, tablet later?21:27
mariodat least that's what i read recently :)21:27
Pawky|2mariod: no clue about jabber...21:27
Pawky|2ortylp: what bad experiences have you had with a Sony camera and the SWAT team ???21:28
b944Pawky|2 got a Nexus 2012 and 2013 here  -- there is usually no need for a third one...21:28
ortylpmariod: SONY has put to jail developers who wanted to get back Linux on their PS421:28
HtheBhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQa4-s_3m_Q21:28
Pawky|2ortylp: dude, maybe there are better things to film..... ;-)21:28
mariodwhat? ... that's crazy ortylp21:28
ortylpmariod: unfortunately it is not :(21:29
mariodwhere did you read / see that they are doing such an awful thing?21:29
ortylpmariod: it happened in real life and what is worse... in europe (so it was not SWAT, but SEK... but you know what it means)21:30
Pawky|2ortylp: any more info to back it up?21:30
mariodi think i've heard that term before ...21:30
mariodSondereinsatzkommando if i'm not mistaken21:30
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Pawky|2yeah, they exist in all countries21:31
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mariodbut where did you read or see or hear that about Sony ...21:32
ortylphere is something: http://www.dailytech.com/Facing+Prison+PS3+Hacker+Tells+Sony+Youll+Have+to+Kill+Me+to+Silence+Me/article21939.htm21:33
ortylpit was the case about  George "GeoHot" Hotz21:33
Pawky|2that has nothing to do with Sony...21:33
ortylpand it was about PS3 not PS4...21:34
Pawky|2or maybe it has..21:34
Pawky|2well, part of sony..21:34
Pawky|2then again, this has rather more to do about people not reading the fine print i supose..21:35
ortylpI think it is more about your right to do whatever you want with hardware you bought, whatever the totally screwed licence agreement says21:36
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Pawky|2ortylp: well, this is still politics, and I believe Jolla wants to keep out of it.. thus they should make the driver compatible with this type of connections..21:37
ortylpPawky|2: as long as the protocol is open :)21:37
Pawky|2ortylp: it is an open protocol...21:38
Pawky|2its jollas network driver that isnt..21:39
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ortylpPawky|2: there is still long way to go before we get FOSS drivers for android devices....21:40
ortylpI need some sleep... by21:40
ortylpbye21:40
Pawky|2well, i dont mind the driver not being FOSS, as long as they atleast support everything the driver originally is written to support..21:40
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b944Could you please send me the  the e-mail  I should send a mail to?21:41
Pawky|2b944: who are you asking?21:42
ortylpmost probably "multicast" is a premium feature for which there are additional fees... it would be a joke it were true... but I can still imagine that21:42
b944Pawky|2 because of the coupon  / discount code21:43
Pawky|2b944: whom are you asking an email from?21:43
Pawky|2ortylp: it has to do with it draining power making snapdragon look bad..21:44
Pawky|2it is still usefull though, if you can occationally enable it, by example for certain wifi connections.21:44
b944Pawky|2I thougt to ask someone at jolla about the code21:44
M4rtinKwe were told that "multicast is the thing you turn of to make your network work again" in a networking class once :)21:45
M4rtinK*turn off21:45
ortylpPawky|2: maybe you are right21:45
Pawky|2b944: even though there might be jolla people in here, they usually never answer as one...21:45
b944also at night?21:45
ortylpM4rtinK: only if your switches are dumber than dumb21:45
Teemu:)21:45
Pawky|2M4rtinK: never had any issues with multicast... its nothing special, i mean your network card happily listens to broadcasts..21:46
M4rtinKwell, it has been  a few years since :)21:46
Pawky|2ortylp: second that21:46
Pawky|2M4rtinK: eons I presume..21:46
Pawky|2i did video multicasting in 200621:47
M4rtinKI remember there were some issues mentioned with keeping track of the multicast "connections"21:47
Pawky|2M4rtinK: no such issues..21:47
M4rtinKvs just unicasting everything and not caring21:47
Pawky|2there is really nothing special with multicast..21:47
Pawky|2its just like your .255 broadcast address..21:48
Pawky|2a bit more traffic though..21:48
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Pawky|2b944: again said, this is not an official channel run by jolla, rather its their users and developers....21:56
b944Pawky|2 understood and thanks a lot21:56
Pawky|2they do contribute with some well worth information now and then though :-)21:56
Pawky|2just send an email to their support :-)21:57
Pawky|2b944: ^^21:57
b944thanks21:57
b944again21:57
Pawky|2your welcome21:58
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tigeliPawky|2: fyi, I'm currently testing disabling the multicast filter..22:06
tigeliPawky|2: but you can disable it too if you really want22:06
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Pawky|2tigeli:  how so?22:19
Pawky|2tigeli: you can disable it, but it still doesnt listen to it22:20
tigeliPawky|2: why wouldn't it?22:21
tigelimine is listening just fine22:21
Pawky|2tigeli: because parts of it is disabled in the code..22:21
tigeliPawky|2: see grep McastBcastFilter /persist/WCNSS_qcom_cfg.ini22:21
tigeliPawky|2: multicasts are only filtered when the display is off22:21
Pawky|2tigeli: hm... can you remind me how to reenable it (it was like 5 months ago and I dont have my notes here..)22:22
Pawky|2tigeli: or maybe thats to be found on together.jolla.com, if remembering correctly22:23
tigeliPawky|2: 1) mount -o remount,rw /persist; 2) vi /persist/WCNSS_qcom_cfg.ini 3) change the McastBcastFilter value to 2 and save and run "sync" 4) reboot22:24
Pawky|2tigeli: ahh yeah that was the trick22:24
Pawky|2long time ago ;-)22:24
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Pawky|2will try in a few minutes and give feedback22:24
tigeliPawky|2: well, it works for me.. :)22:25
tigeliPawky|2: I'm just wondering about how much it will affect on power consumption22:25
tigeli(initial analysis, not much on the networks which I use)22:25
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Pawky|2tigeli: because I remember you can see the driver recognising the multicast by using... tcpdump i think... but you cannot actally listen to the stream22:26
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mariodPawky|2, ... current score is ... 2 votes for "telegram" ... 2 for "jabber" :)22:27
tigeliPawky|2: well, ipv6 nd is using multicast.. so it definitely works :)22:27
tigeliPawky|2: and connman is also listening those22:27
Pawky|2tigeli:  it will really make my day if it does22:27
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Pawky|2mariod: :-)22:28
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tigeliPawky|2: and my sonos uses multicast22:28
tigeliPawky|2: and I can control it now also display off ;)22:28
Pawky|2tigeli: this sounds great!... stilll into testing though...22:29
mariodwikipedia says about telegram ... Only two devices may use the secret chat simultaneously.22:31
mariodthat doesn't sound good22:31
tigeliand actually the issue why the filter needs to be disabled is that ipv6 router advertisements will get lost when device's display is off and it will cause default route to be lost22:31
tigelior to be waked to do rs/ra-sequence22:32
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tigelibut filtering multicast is so, lame.22:32
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tigelilot's of android devices suffer the same problem, thanks to qualcomm22:32
Pawky|2tigeli: well if it saves battery its ok.. but you should be able to enable it22:32
Pawky|2it works on my samsung note22:33
tigeliPawky|2: they might have disabled the filter, or they are using some other driver/chipset22:33
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Pawky|2tigeli: lots of stuff to connect do do the test... ill enter listen mode in here... ;-)22:35
Pawky|2(need both hands)22:35
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Pawky|2tigeli: rebooting..22:38
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Pawky|2tigeli: nope... its a no can do..22:40
Pawky|2ahh.. yeah.. sorry, the "problem" is, its not transfered to the alien dalvik22:41
stoftProblems installing the latest update. Managed to ssh in and run version --dup a few times, but couldn't get it to complete. Now GUI works again but networking is broken. Trying to run 'pkcon update sbj-wlan' results in Fatal error: Installation aborted by user. Any suggestions?22:41
stoft(followed this guide: https://together.jolla.com/question/84365/after-update-11216-failed-simcard-not-recognized-and-cant-activate-wlan/)22:42
Pawky|2stoft: vagely reminds me of wifi problems in earlier upgrades22:42
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Pawky|2tigeli: yes, the card now happily getigeli: ts the UDP stuff from the Sony peripheral.... but their android app doesn't see it.. :-(22:50
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mariodPawky|2, ?22:52
Pawky|2well.. were talking multicast here..22:52
mariodis it possible to talk to multiple users at the same time / something like in the same room with "jabber" ?22:52
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Pawky|2mariod: well.. this is about multiple devices talking to each other, not user22:53
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mariodok ... multiple devices then :)22:53
mariodyou see ... i read that telegram doesn't offer a safe and secure way for more than two people22:53
Pawky|2mariod: well.. its a bit hard to do that using encryption dont you think?22:54
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Pawky|2doable though..22:54
mariod*shrug* well how would i know? :) ... i'm not tech-savy enough yet :)22:55
Pawky|2well.. you are probably using encryption for this IRC channel, so everything between this server and your computer is encrypted..22:56
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mariodmay sound stupid but i dunno actually if i do ...22:57
mariodbut i think it's somewhat encrypted :)22:57
mariodalso ... if i were to use telegram or jabber ... (especially the latter) ...22:58
mariodi'd need to find out how to get some accounts ...22:58
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mariodso that i can tell my friends and family members who have a smartphone or computer too :)22:58
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Pawky|2mariod: hmm.. when thinking about it, there should be no problem for you chatting to several people using encryption23:01
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Pawky|2mariod: what does google tell you about jabber and encryption?23:05
mariodwell me chatting to several people yes ... but what all of us together?23:05
mariodlike we kinda can do here :)23:05
mariodknow what i mean?23:05
Pawky|2mariod: I believe google will help you better with the jabber stuff than I can.23:07
Pawky|2i dont use chats, they just steal once time..23:08
Pawky|2when all friends suddenly have some time to kill and want to chat with you... if you know what I mean..23:08
Pawky|2I only use IRC nowadays23:08
Pawky|2i believe people communicate far to much for their own good, exposing themeselves to the whole world with what have not, pictures, friends, contacts, searches, data, documents the lot..23:09
chem|stmariod: xmpp conference plugin is missing and would be really nice to have23:10
Pawky|2There you have it :-D23:10
chem|stso would be CC, OTR, ATTACH, and many other23:10
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mariodPawky|2, i know what you mean ... yes ... but it's a "risk" i have to take :D23:11
mariodchem|st, ... do you have any other suggestion then?23:11
chem|stwe only have ICQ and XMPP as of now and both rude implementations23:12
mariodicq? but that's not very safe from what i've read23:12
chem|stmariod: we have a unified messaging system but cannot use it as noone is able to make use of it as the frontend is missing all the features23:13
mariodbesides ... apart from being safe ... i need a tool that's cross-platform comptabible23:13
chem|sticq is cross platform23:13
mariodiOS, android, sailfish, windows, linux, mac os x ?23:13
mariodand others maybe too?23:13
mariodbut icq isn't free or is it now?23:13
chem|stI use a text-only client in a screen for all protocolls - android iOS have icq clients23:13
chem|stICQ was never payed was it?23:14
chem|stpaid23:14
chem|sticq is so old there is probably a client written in pascal...23:15
chem|stor fortran23:15
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phlixi_but those probably do not work anymore, since icq changed the protokol so often23:15
chem|steverything sent is owned by a russian company though^^23:15
chem|stphlixi_: so slightly that you just needed to flip some bits23:16
chem|steach time they did, and as I did not update my client for 4 years now, the russian company did probably stop doing that after purchasing it23:16
Pawky|2anyone knowing why ssdp never reaches an android app on the jolla?23:19
phlixi_back in the time i used centericq, what do you use today for icq?23:19
mariodhmmm23:19
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Pawky|2even though the interface fetches it?23:19
mariodguess i have to wait then till such a tool exists ... for conferences ...23:20
chem|stjolla could pull off a stunt by implementing full blown xmpp support - including a server with multiprotocol support23:20
mariodbut how should i make jabber or telegram work? ... when you cannot register for a jabber account?23:20
chem|stmariod: go to jabber.de and register?23:20
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mariodjabber or telegram people say here ... are safe, secure, open source and provide a way to text, call, and exchange files23:20
mariodhere is where i was before :) chem|st23:21
mariodhttp://register.jabber.org/23:21
chem|sthttp://www.jabber.de/register/23:22
phlixi_thats one of the pros of jabber, it is not centralized23:22
mariodokaaay ... but what app shall i take then? ... after all this site you showed me chem|st ... it's just a way to register an account23:23
phlixi_mariod: pic one: http://www.jabberes.org/servers/23:23
phlixi_mariod: https://together.jolla.com/question/30470/how-to-use-the-xmpp-implementation/23:24
mariodoh wow phlixi_ :)23:24
mariodadditional question there23:24
mariodwhat does "100% (112/112)" mean?23:25
mariodi can understand 100 % uptime ... meaning the server hasn't gone offline yet ...23:25
mariodbut 112/112?23:25
mariodand phlixi_ ? ... the question regarding apps ... was meant general ...23:25
mariodsince i need a program for linux, windows, mac os x, ios, android and sailfish os ... and maybe something else in the future :)23:26
phlixi_and there is more to your topic of choosing an instant messenger: https://together.jolla.com/question/29379/instant-messaging-whatsapp-alternatives-to-use-on-jolla/23:26
ilbuonmeHello people, can I jump in with a question?23:27
phlixi_and a list of clients for jabber/xmpp http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_von_XMPP-Clients23:27
phlixi_ilbuonme first rule on irc, dont ask to ask, just ask :-)23:27
ilbuonme<phlixi_> :-)23:27
mariodsooo ... i take it from all we said so far that "jabber" is the thing my family and friend should go for23:27
mariodgo for it ilbuonme ... i'm sure it's ok :)23:27
ilbuonmeI was just wondering whether there is a native sailfish app for podcast23:27
phlixi_mariod: if you are in the luxary position to choose the platform for all of them, i guess xmpp is the best choice. most people have to use what their peers use :-)23:28
mariodi think someone mentioned "gPodder" here ilbuonme23:28
mariodbut wait for the others to respond ...23:28
phlixi_ilbuonme: gpodder is great23:28
mariodi'm still new myself :)23:28
phlixi_ilbuonme: http://gpodder.org/23:29
ilbuonmemariod I do use gPodder on Linux and it's great. But I didn't find it on the official Jolla store23:29
mariodilbuonme, phlixi_ can help you out there i think :)23:29
ilbuonmemariod phlixi_ Ooops... my bad: it is in the Jolla store23:30
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ilbuonmeeureka! thanks23:30
mariodyw :)23:30
phlixi_i do not know if it is already available from there, probably not if you did not find it there... you can get it via warehouse (openrepos client) if you dont mind using a differend "store"23:30
mariodnow please don't do the full Archimedes here though *chuckle*23:30
mariodaaand well phlixi_ ... the luxury as you say that i have is that a bunch of my family members and friends are less tech savy than i am ...23:30
ilbuonme;-)23:30
ilbuonmelast question: any news about voice recognition in jolla?23:31
mariodhmmm ... this question sounds like it has been asked by ilbuonme right now ... what do you think? :D23:31
mariod*chuckle*23:31
phlixi_ilbuonme: i have no idea :-) (and the idea of talking to my computer seems pretty awkward to mee ^^)23:31
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mariodand there's phlixi_ responding ...23:32
mariod;)23:32
mariodnaaah ... don't take it rude please :)23:32
ilbuonmeno offense taken lads :-)23:32
ilbuonmeI do talk to my car23:32
mariodoh really?23:32
ilbuonmeand she's sometimes more responsive to me than a lot of people23:32
phlixi_*hrhr*23:33
mariodshe?23:33
mariodhmmm ...23:33
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ilbuonme:-D23:33
mariodso it's not a Knight Industries Two Thousand eh? :)23:33
ilbuonmeright -- very Freudian, hun?23:33
ilbuonmewell, it's a Fiesta, so grammatically it's feminine23:33
mariodi see :)23:33
mariod<--- doesn't have an own car yet23:34
ilbuonmewell, mariod, on the other side I consider my motorbike masculine23:34
mariod;)23:34
ilbuonmetoo bad, however, that I can't have voice recognition... that's the only thing that I might miss of my old android device23:35
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mariodwell wait a little bit ... maybe it's coming ... i dunno23:35
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ilbuonmeapart from that, I'm just above the moon with my brand new Jolla23:35
chem|stmariod: there are lots of shortcomings as of yet with xmpp - not only on jolla, everything depends on the server you are at and the client you use... for android and ios no big deal as everything not google or apple is a pain in the ass...23:36
chem|stmariod: xmpp/jabber client for texting only is available on jolla23:37
mariodi see ...23:37
chem|stand clients are available for all systems23:37
mariodwell i can't wait till Jitsi then works properly on android :)23:37
mariodJitsi i read is a nice skype-alternative ...23:37
chem|stmac linux win (probably even win3.11)23:37
mariodthat will run on android some time sooner or later23:37
mariodthat still leaves out iOS though23:38
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mariodchem|st, ... if you have any other suggestion as to what i should do ... i'm open for any ...23:39
chem|stwhat I want is an email like chat-service and jabber is close enough, would be nice to have ricochet sublayer for client-communications though23:39
mariodthe problem you see is ... some of my family members and friends live abroad ...23:39
mariodand it'd be nice to talk to them on the phone or some skype-like tool :)23:39
chem|stmariod: you should use what is working best for you, if you do not care about anything...23:39
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mariodwell ... skype did the trick so far ... but skype isn't really safe :)23:40
chem|stthreema is the word in my circles for now...23:40
phlixi_mariod, read this: https://together.jolla.com/question/29379/instant-messaging-whatsapp-alternatives-to-use-on-jolla/ and in case you decide for jabber, there is a list of clients: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_von_XMPP-Clients23:40
* phlixi_ uses threema too23:40
stoftAnyone know where SailfishOS update download location is?23:40
phlixi_gn8 :-)23:41
chem|stmariod: if you know the list of OSs you have at hand you can lookup clients that have text+files+voice and probably even video call support by now, for jabber/xmpp23:41
chem|stthe N900 and N9 where key when it came to that, everything working, even jabber voice calls...23:42
chem|stand I get tired... s/where/were/23:43
chem|stgood night23:43
mariodwhat made you two choose this "threema" you mentioned?23:43
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stoftfound it: /var/cache/zypp23:46
phlixi_its (threema) what my peers use, and its pretty easy to use23:47
phlixi_and without playstore you can buy it directly from their website23:48
phlixi_(but "normal" people can buy it from playstore/aplle appstore /windows whateveritiscalledstore)23:48
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chem|stbuy?23:53
chem|stI stick with jabber...23:53
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