#jollamobile log for Monday, 2017-06-19

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Venemohey guys11:07
Venemowho the f*** is "Dave999"?11:08
Nicd-why would we know?11:08
coderusVenemo: some person from my ignoring list it seems11:09
Venemowhy does the guy spam every single bjc post and every single tmo thread about the tablet refund shit?11:09
Venemoseriously11:10
coderusVenemo: if i could i will ban him year ago :D11:10
Venemowhy not just give him his refund, maybe he will shut up and move on11:10
coderusyou just can't give refund to selected persons11:11
coderusthen it will make thousands of Daves askign for refund11:12
coderusnow it's just one single person you can easily ignore11:12
Venemothis kind of person is I think the most destructive type in any community11:13
LarstiQyou can be more toxic11:13
LarstiQbut yeah, his positive impact is... hard to discern11:13
VenemoI'm more toxic?11:14
Venemowhat?11:14
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LarstiQno, the general you11:14
LarstiQVenemo: "one could be more toxic"11:14
Venemoah, ok11:14
Venemowell, sure11:14
Venemohe seems very fixated to the tablet refund, he doesn't really troll about anything else11:15
* LarstiQ nods11:15
VenemoI don't even remember how much the tablet cost11:17
Venemobut how could somebody possibly obsess so much about it?11:17
LarstiQVenemo: maybe it is performance art?11:19
LarstiQVenemo: my guess is that he feels betrayed11:19
LarstiQnevermind the terms and conditions being very clear about what you're getting into, he felt strongly about getting the tablet and Jolla has let him down11:20
LarstiQso far my arm-chair psychology11:20
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r0kk3rztbh jolla need to finish that off11:26
LarstiQr0kk3rz: legally or morally?11:27
LarstiQI'd definitely like to11:27
r0kk3rzboth :)11:27
LarstiQbut we're not in a position to11:27
entilso he actually received his tablet and doesn't want it?11:28
LarstiQr0kk3rz: the first, pretty sure we don't11:28
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entilmaybe he should have sold it off while people wanted them, sold it to someone who got their money back11:28
r0kk3rzyeah true but it would be a shit thing to do11:28
LarstiQr0kk3rz: that's why I asked two things ;P11:29
r0kk3rzlegal or not, the court of public opinion wont be kind11:29
entila friend of mine, who would not spam any forums, is also disappointed at getting the tablet, for no real reason I can understand11:29
LarstiQentil: getting or not getting?11:29
entilLarstiQ: getting11:29
LarstiQentil: the refund was for people who didn't get it11:30
entilLarstiQ: he started thinking about how he can't copypaste in sailfish and how obscure a lot of the docs are etc so he was hoping he'd end up with a refund instead :P11:30
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entilLarstiQ: I think I misunderstood you11:30
LarstiQentil: when did he get his tablet?11:30
entilLarstiQ: when you said "felt strongly about getting the tablet", I understood this Dave999 actually got his and is in the same spot as my friend11:31
r0kk3rzentil: im sure he could flog it on ebay11:31
entiland I can't even remember11:31
LarstiQentil: aha, I see11:31
entilI think he installed windows on it, and it didn't really work, so he threw it out or something, I don't really care11:31
coderusVenemo: $259/289 + $ for Lastu Case11:31
LarstiQr0kk3rz: anyway, we've always said "as the financial situations permits", and it doesn't, so the point is moot11:31
LarstiQcoderus: there were different perks11:32
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VenemoI'm not even sure what his problem is11:32
r0kk3rzLarstiQ: i know, and its easy for you to say, but we see deals with russia and china and think "what does permitting financials look like"11:33
Venemodid he want a tablet and didn't get it? or the other way around11:33
LarstiQr0kk3rz: having spare cash to the tune of roughly half the original pledged amount11:33
VenemoJaymzz: have you tried to talk to him yet?11:34
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LarstiQVenemo: judging from his posts, he wants the second half of the refund11:34
VenemoLarstiQ: yeah but that's the thing about crowdfunding - if you are not in the financial position to risk that amount of money, don't participate, that's it - he didn't understand this11:35
LarstiQVenemo: see my arm-chairing above, I don't think it's about the money11:35
VenemoLarstiQ: yeah, it's possible too11:35
Venemobut his posts have been extremely annoying11:36
LarstiQwonder if wordpress has an option to let readers choose commenters to ignore11:36
LarstiQr0kk3rz: (oh, and plus fees)11:36
Venemomaybe he just doesn't understand that his comments are not construcive at all and actually detract everyone else11:37
Venemobut he also does it on TMO11:37
Venemoone gets the feeling that he has been hired for full-time trolling11:39
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TMavicahttps://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/MGjyFMGV/20170619_195833.jpg12:08
TMavicaI flash sailfish to it12:08
TMavicaWant12:08
TMavicaLol12:09
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Hartzimoar pixels plz12:27
^7heoSo for those who're interested12:28
^7heoif the battery doesn't make the right contacts with the phone; the phone is gonna vibrate every second when plugged for charging12:29
^7heothe solution is to fix the contacts so they actually get electrical contact with the battery contacts.12:29
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TMavicaNo more Xperia sell in my city..outdated they said12:32
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TMavicaI also think it is quite outdated too...12:33
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^7heoTMavica: Xperia X?12:34
^7heoTMavica: it's pretty recent, I think.12:34
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TMavicaYes. Xperia x12:34
TMavicaMobile sales, it is outdated12:34
TMavicaXperia X performance also12:35
TMavicaAll is XZ to XZ premium12:35
TMavicaThat is normal here12:35
TMavicaNo shop selling X12:36
r0kk3rzreminds me of .jp back in the day12:41
r0kk3rzanything older than 6 months was unsellable12:41
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Venemolol12:50
VenemoI never understood this attitude12:51
Jopeahh, stories of dumpster diving at akiba12:52
Jopewish I could have been there. :-)12:53
* LarstiQ waves at Jope12:54
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Jopehello larstiq :-)12:55
Jopehope you are doing well12:56
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coderusLike this? http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=1529326&postcount=35313:21
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Venemocoderus: indeed13:59
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^7heoTMavica: where is here?14:09
TMavica^7heo: Hong Kong14:35
^7heoTMavica: ah yeah makes sense14:37
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TMavica^7heo truely...HongKonger changed their phone frequently15:13
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TMavicabut I not..15:13
TMavicabecause I cant change, I need use sailfishos..15:14
^7heoYeah I can't use Sailfish, it doesn't meet my quality standards.15:15
^7heoMaybe in a few years15:15
^7heoor if they change the base linux distribution they use.15:16
TMavicaso why are you here?15:17
TMavicaLOL15:17
^7heoBecause first, I own a Jolla; and second, I wouldn't be against participating in making it better, one day.15:17
^7heoUntil recently, and for two years, my Jolla has been my primary phone.15:18
^7heoUnfortunately, its various software quality issues (hardware was fine until it got damaged, which I can't blame on Jolla tbh) drove me to replace it.15:18
cehtehthe hardware is a bit underpowered nowadays15:19
^7heothat was one of the issues.15:19
cehtehat least it should have way more ram15:19
^7heonah, it should have a system that doesn't require 1GB to run without load.15:19
cehtehthat was the problem with the n900 as well15:19
^7heoSailfish is heavier than Android15:20
^7heoand it runs on weaker devices.15:20
cehtehwell .. since there are not much native apps one has to rely in android stuff which eats ram like nomore15:20
^7heoSo if you wanna get market share, search no more, stop adding features and start optimizing.15:20
Ingvixand I thought it was lighter15:20
cehtehyes sfos is lighter15:20
^7heoIngvix: depends what version and what components.15:20
^7heothe core system definitely is heavier.15:20
cehtehbut also much less features, still ok imo the bugs and annoyances should be fixed first15:21
^7heobut at the same time, I see users on the forums complaining about the lack of features...15:21
^7heoso I can understand the drive to add features.15:21
cehtehof course15:21
TMavicaso will you plan to buy a xperia X and test it?15:21
^7heoI did buy an Xperia X.15:21
TMavicagood15:21
^7heoI gave it back, tho.15:21
cehtehwhen you look whats possible with android phones you get a bit envious15:21
^7heocehteh: depends if you consider android + google or ASOP15:22
^7heocehteh: the possibilities/features are WAY different there.15:22
TMavicaI wonder want to know Jolla sell Xperia X in their homepage or not..15:22
TMavicawith sailfish15:22
^7heoTMavica: It wouldn't charge when it was turned on; so I decided not to keep it. Good phone otherwise, solid feel.15:22
cehtehhow much ram has the xperia?15:22
^7heo2G if I remember right15:23
^7heoor 3?15:23
^7heo3GB ram.15:23
TMavicaGB15:23
TMavica315:23
^7heothe Pixel has 4GB, as a comparison.15:23
cehtehi frequently use OSMand, that really likes to have more ram15:24
^7heoon my android, default, with 2GB of ram, 1.1GB of ram are taken by the system15:24
^7heobut I'm running firefox + a small game15:24
cehtehswapping and crashing sometimes15:24
^7heo(some puzzle game)15:24
cehtehnext phone i buy should have at least 4GB15:25
^7heoSo I can understand why sailfish is barely usable on a Jolla with 1GB ram15:25
^7heoI got a pixel because of CopperheadOS15:25
cehtehyou can tweak some things on the jolla to make it better15:25
^7heoI yet have to test it; but with the stock android, it was really fast.15:25
cehtehzram15:25
^7heocehteh: I would appreciate if jolla had a more polished system, with more low-level tools15:25
cehtehbut still it lacks ram for any serious work and is easily overloaded15:25
^7heocehteh: instead of focusing on building more recent firefox versions and adding a very bugged "text selection" with handles on the side.15:26
^7heomy main problem with the Jolla was the poor software quality; again, it's not the fault of Jolla; but using sane default software would have greatly helped there.15:26
^7heoIt's the only phone on the market to run the glibc, and it shows.15:27
cehtehthey should focus a) on stabilizing  the existing system, and b) if there are any resources left spend them on real new features .. but c) anytihng thats already there should be left opensource to the community15:27
^7heothey don't have enough resources to do both15:27
^7heodefinitely not.15:27
^7heothe Jolla team has been largely down-sized since the beginning15:27
cehtehi mean with real back integration and communication between community developers15:27
^7heoThe first issue is to base it on a recent debian.15:28
^7heoiOS is based on FBSD and Android has been made in-house.15:28
^7heothere are reasons why those work better.15:28
cehtehthings are painfully slow at jolla15:29
cehtehfixes and such15:29
^7heoDebian offers an okay support (it used to be great but tbh they fell behind in terms of quality) on recent computers, they also support older computers, but running a recent debian on a notoriously old computer (i.e. with 1GB ram for instance) is a very bad idea.15:29
^7heocehteh: well, again, it's lacking manpower.15:31
^7heocehteh: but tbh, they aren't really... easy to hack on.15:31
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^7heo(when compared to the usual FOSS, not when compared to closed-source ASOP variations)15:32
^7heoSo yeah...15:32
^7heoI'll use my fairphone and my jolla to hack next fall/winter15:32
cehtehhow far is sfos on the fairphone?15:33
^7heoit runs on it.15:33
cehtehno android right?15:33
cehtehany other issues, or all hardware flawless supported?15:33
^7heocehteh: the FP2 runs both android and Jolla afaik15:33
cehtehi know15:34
cehtehbut i wonder how complete it is15:34
^7heofor now, looking forward to replacing my Jolla with a Pixel, as I'm sure the Pixel won't have a browser that segfaults or flickers or fails to display, or even display the same buffer no matter what tab you select, etc.15:34
^7heocehteh: I'll tell you when I get mine.15:34
^7heocehteh: I ordered it in march, so I'll get it in sept or oct.15:34
cehtehhaha15:34
cehtehok15:34
TMavicayours is dual sim or single..?15:34
^7heothe FP?15:34
^7heoI think it's only sold as dual sim.15:34
^7heoOh you mean the jolla. First edition, single.15:34
^7heoI have 2 dual sim phone, 2 single sim phones. actually 3 if I count my nexus.15:35
cehtehsee some days ago, jolla cant even handle one sim without bugs :D15:36
TMavicaseem i cant buy a single sim Xperia X here..15:36
TMavicaall is dual15:36
cehtehi changed my mobile contract, put a new sim in and network was broken, needed manual fixing15:36
cehtehthats really an annoying bug15:37
cehtehshould not happen15:37
^7heoTMavica: what's the problem with the dual sim?15:37
^7heocehteh: have you tried forcing an unexpected reboot?15:37
TMavicai dont know, seem only can flash sfos in single sim xperia x15:38
TMavicai read from Jolla together15:38
^7heoah15:38
cehtehno, just normal powerdown, swap sim, reboot15:38
^7heocehteh: yeah that's what I mean15:38
cehtehofono defaults to the old sim15:38
cehtehneed to edit the config files manually15:38
^7heoah15:39
^7heoyeah that sucks15:39
cehtehtook me some time to figure out15:39
^7heoDid you write some doc' about it?15:39
cehtehany 'normal' enduser who brought it just as phone would be lost15:40
^7heoJolla phones aren't for "normal" users15:40
cehtehits on tjc15:40
cehtehthats the problem15:40
^7heoTCJ?15:41
^7heosorry, TJC?15:41
^7heoThe Jewelery Channel?15:41
^7heos/wel/&l/15:41
cehtehhttps://together.jolla.com/question/150137/mobile-data-not-working-after-switching-sim-card/15:41
^7heooh, right.15:41
^7heoStoopid me.15:42
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r0kk3rzcehteh: its easy to pontificate, harder to make it a reality16:27
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Phrk_hello17:49
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