Monday, 2014-04-14

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thehorsestapleHow can I get email updates for Nexus 4 updates?04:13
tbrthehorsestaple: did you register with sledges back then?04:23
thehorsestapleNot sure what you mean by sledges, sorry04:23
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Stskeepsthehorsestaple: you sign up with irc nick sledges to be an early adopter04:25
Stskeepssend him a private message04:25
Stskeepsname, email, what devices andw hy04:25
thehorsestapleOh okay, thank you04:26
Stskeepsnew release hopefully comes during this week04:26
Stskeepsbut now, coffee..04:26
thehorsestapleHope so04:28
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Venemolbt: ping06:04
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Venemomorning :)06:18
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artemmaQtDocGallery is not allowed for jolla harbour apps (anymore?). How do you show user photos in apps then? Just QDir to main photos directory ( coderus suggested)?06:32
Venemoartemma: it's not officially allowed (but some apps that use it get accepted)06:36
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Venemoartemma: otherwise just vote for
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artemmaVenemo: that was my understanding, BUT to my understanding until few days ago harbour checker script was not rejecting apps using doc gallery, not it does06:38
artemmathat is unless I messed up something06:38
Venemoartemma: do you embed your QMLs into your binary, or do you just install them on the file system?06:39
artemmaI actually did check if doc gallery (and nemothumbnailer) are passed by checker script when I was starting new app (a week ago) and it was fine06:39
artemmaVenemo: yeah, it is possible, but I wouldn't like to trick the checker script :(06:39
Venemoartemma: so which one is it?06:40
* artemma is mostly pissed off not about the gallery itself, but due to not-communicating Jolla straightening restrictions without warning06:40
artemmaboth were allowed about a week ago (allowed by script and anecdotal evidence, not by docs)06:40
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Venemoartemma: officially it was never allowed06:41
artemmaoh well, I can try submitting my app as is today and see if it's rejected. I guess testers will click cancel on just seeing the red checker screen06:41
artemmafile picker wouldn't work for me, I want to show image grid a'la gallery06:42
Venemoartemma: yes, that's what it's about06:42
artemmaas I am doing sort of a gallery with user selecting or disselecting photos06:42
Venemoartemma: I'm doing the same in puzzle master06:42
Venemoartemma: if you want to proceed in the official way, you can embed the gallery model in your own app's code and use that.06:42
Venemoartemma: or you can always figure out ways to bypass the checker script06:43
artemmathat's the master plan, I am just wenting06:43
Venemoartemma: the file picker together is not just about a file picker (literally) but various file pickers, such as image picker and other things06:43
* artemma hopes one day Jolla will actually talk to developers in advance06:43
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artemmaVenemo: that we are talking abt file picker API (at least on low level) that is very likely to be same doc gallery any way. Just "when API stabilizes" :)06:44
Venemoartemma: sure, but it'd be much easier to "just use" a picker API than to implement your own picker in every app06:45
Venemoartemma: actually, quite wonderfully, blackberry managed to do this right06:46
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artemmawell, I want an in-app grid inside app06:50
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artemmaand to be frank, I don't have super high expectations from jolla design for file picker06:50
artemmathey will make it yet another long-press to unwrap that is ve-e-erty slow imho06:50
artemmathough seems to be the standard sailfish way06:50
* artemma really wonders what coming UX study with jolla owners and non-owners will reveal. Hope results will be semi-public at least. It is possible that I am the only one who finds long-press pattern weird06:52
Nicd-what's "long press to unwrap"? where is it used currently?06:53
artemmaall the context menus06:53
artemmawell, it is basically the context menu06:53
artemmacombo boxes and menus and pickers06:53
Nicd-ah, but why would the file picked use that?06:53
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artemmahmm, why does combobox picker use it currently?06:54
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Nicd-I mean, the attachment picker for email doesn't use it06:55
artemmawell, if you can run picker in already opened mode, that's good06:55
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artemma_phoneinstagram works quite okay in update 5 if you care to shut down browser and other memory hungry apps first. I hope sailfish will improve swap use by update 6. Would like to try multitasking one day07:12
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lpotterartemma_phone: what's wrong with long press context menu?07:16
artemma_phonelpotter: i just don't like it. Slow and [to me] feels contrary to the gestures paradigm07:17
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artemma_phoneyou know, everything else in the device is fluid and all or almost action can be half-done and canceled07:18
artemma_phonee.g. pulling menu, but releasing07:18
lpotterand how would you suggest doing a context menu?07:18
artemma_phoneor pushing app out to task manager, but stopping obce you see clock07:19
artemma_phonei would open a design agency if i knew :)07:19
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artemma_phoneandroid btw had interesting evolution. they kept conext menus themselves, but killed long presses. Now it's always single press away under same icon07:20
Nicd-but now they waste screen space07:21
artemma_phonetrue. ir's ttadeoff between speed and space07:21
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artemma_phoneand i agee, sailfish preference in this tradeoff is space usually: e.g. pulkey menu is way slower than clickibg a toolbar, but saves space07:22
artemma_phoneyou know, i just want to have everything as every other user: speed and space and fluidness :)07:23
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jake9xxNicd-: that's good news, all in all the <hype-name-here>.js stuff are not that extensively tested with qml07:56
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Nicd-I think it didn't work at first because in qml javascript isn't allowed to change the global object (e.g. create global variables)07:59
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Nicd-I'll try to make my fix a bit nicer and into a wrapper form so it doesn't touch the actual js library file at all (currently I just modified the moment.js file itself)07:59
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Nicd-and then publish my results07:59
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Guest62672I heard it's possible to sign up for the Jolla e-mail updates for Nexus 4 here?08:16
Stskeepssend sledges a private message along with name/e-mail/devices/why08:18
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Guest62672thanks stskeeps08:20
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viviahi... is there anything swype-like being developed (even just an idea somewhere)?08:26
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fzkyeah, swype keyboard was the best thing in meego08:31
viviai'm still stuck with my n9 and praying that it won't throw any serious bugs08:32
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leinirpeople who talk about how good swype is seriously need to try either swiftkey or bb10's keyboard...08:32
vivialeinir: whatever, swype, swiftkey, is there something better than hunt-and-peck for sailfishOS? :)08:33
leinirvivia: it's more the whole language model based thing those two have... it's spectacular08:34
leinirbut no, i'm not aware of anything apart from the stock keyboard - maliit has all kinds of powerful stuff, though, so it'd be entirely possible to build something like that :)08:35
viviayeah, i'm just far from having enough resources (time) to do such a thing on my own08:35
viviathe algorithm from curve to a probability map isn't too difficult, and i guess edict could be used as a words db08:35
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viviai'd just like a partner first :)08:36
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cos-does anyone know if charging notifications have been adjusted in the latest release?08:38
Nicd-their color has changed08:39
cos-but are they any smarter in avoiding notification floods?08:39
Nicd-I don't know. there are notification floods?08:39
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cos-yes, with qi charger toh's08:44
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radekpcos-: you can try pause upowerd as ugly workaround...08:50
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cos-i'm using oldschool wired charger as a ugly workaround08:51
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viviacos-: i have a question about qi chargers08:52
viviajust ooc :) is it like a mat that makes your phone charge when it's placed on it?08:52
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viviaso... if you use a cable charger, you have the range that's defined by the cable's length08:53
viviawhat's your range when using qi? does your phone have to stay there until it's finished charging?08:53
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cos-the phone has to be on the charger08:58
viviaso essentially you can't move it while it's charging?08:58
Waiteeimo that kinda sucks :D08:59
Waiteewhats the whole point of wireless charging if you are more tied down than with wires?08:59
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ambroyou can just place it on the table next to your bed and don't have to fiddle with connectors i guess09:00
Nicd-cos-: were you in sailfish hack day at tampere?09:00
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cos-the phone has an integrated battery, so it doesn't need to have external power input while in use09:01
cos-Nicd-: yes09:01
Nicd-were you the one with the solar half and power half?09:01
Waiteethat's skvark09:02
Nicd-oh, ok09:02
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Stskeepsmoo Venemo10:20
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Venemois the SDK virtual machine supposed to work after a sleep/resume?10:20
Venemowhy is it that when I launch my app from the SDK or from a terminal it runs fine but when I try to start it with its desktop icon it doesn't work?10:23
Venemothe same .desktop file used to work with the version of the app that's in the store10:23
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Venemoworks fine after doing a 'killall invoker'10:27
w00tcan you reproduce the same state?10:27
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Venemow00t: nope, no idea what might've caused it10:28
Venemow00t: ohh, but I do10:28
Venemow00t: previously, the app produced a QML error, thus it was probably already running, but its window was invisible10:29
w00tah.. :P10:29
w00tthat would do it10:30
Venemow00t: is there a way to make it quit in case the QML couldn't be loaded?10:30
w00tyou can connect the right signal from QQmlEngine to QGuiApplication::instance()'s quit slot I guess10:30
TurskiVenemo: usually that produces just white screen i think10:31
Turskinot invisible10:31
w00tTurski: if you show it, yeah10:31
VenemoTurski: in my case it was invisible10:31
Venemoit should've been shown10:31
Venemothat's true10:31
Venemow00t: what's the right signal?10:32
Venemoas an aside, why is the deploy process still so excessively slow?10:32
Venemothe console output says: Wrote: /home/mersdk/Projects/apps/build-puzzle-master-MerSDK_SailfishOS_armv7hl-Release/RPMS/harbour-puzzle-master-2.5.0-1.armv7hl.rpm10:32
Venemoand then it takes forever10:32
w00tVenemo: ok, not quite so straightforward: QQuickView has a statusChanged, you'd then want to look for QQuickView::Error, and quit10:33
w00tunless I'm missing a good alternative10:33
TurskiVenemo: don't deploy as rpm...10:33
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Turski(it's still slow, but no so slow)10:34
VenemoTurski: ok, worth a try10:34
Turskii'm using my own hack to deploy qml-only changes and it takes about one second to deploy :P10:36
Turskicoding with vim and deploying with rsync10:36
Turskia bit dirty hack but deos to job10:36
VenemoTurski: my app only has a binary. the QMLs are inside the binary10:38
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Nicd-Turski: one guy hacked a system during the sailfish hack day where his app reloads whenever he saves a qml file10:39
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fluxI wonder how difficult/useful would it be to integrate that inside the app?10:42
fluxyou might even be inside a view in the app and it could update itself10:43
Nicd-that could get pretty hairy easily10:43
fluxwouldn't work in all cases10:43
fluxbut probably in most gui-fiddling ones10:43
Venemothe problem is that "deploy by copying binaries" doesn't work10:44
Venemohm, it works now10:45
Venemobut it copies an awful lot of files that it shouldn't copy10:45
Venemoit copies all my qrc_*.cpp files10:45
Venemoand then fails to launch the executable because it put it in the wrong place10:46
Venemothis is ridiculous10:46
Venemowhat's even more ridiculous is that it runs rpmbuild even when I just want it to copy binaries10:48
Skorpyhey, any cli command for clipboard on jolla?10:50
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VenemoSkorpy: what do you mean?10:50
SkorpyVenemo: a command for putting something (and clearing) to the clipboard10:51
VenemoSkorpy: do you mean an API for it, or an actual command?10:51
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Skorpyactual command would be nice.10:52
Skorpythough the API seems nice enough10:52
Skorpymight not need to do it on the command line10:53
TurskiNicd-: i have similar hack10:53
VenemoSkorpy: I'm unaware of such commands, but the terminal app has copy/paste functionality10:53
VenemoSkorpy: Qt's clipboard API should work10:54
Nicd-the terminal's copy/paste doesn't integrate with the rest of the OS though10:54
SkorpyVenemo: yeah, thanks. I'm just looking at it.10:54
VenemoNicd-: it doesn't?10:54
Skorpyyea the terminals copy paste isn't enough.10:54
TurskiNicd-: except that is resyncs the files when app is closed and relaunches then automatically10:54
Nicd-Venemo: anything you copy in fingerterm isn't available elsewhere and vice versa, that's what I've heard10:55
TurskiNicd-: so the workflos is edit files in vim, save, swipe to close and app is then resynced and relaunched10:55
Nicd-Turski: sounds nice10:55
Nicd-my laptop takes up to a minute to deploy even with just qml changes :/10:55
VenemoNicd-: that is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard in my entire life. is there a bugreport for it?10:55
TurskiNicd-: took about two seconds over wlan :)10:55
TurskiNicd-: and over usb it would be lot faster10:55
Nicd-Venemo: there's a patch for it in the fingerterm repo, I don't know if it's in the OS yet10:56
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TurskiNicd-: since rsync wouldn't tranfer unchanged files again10:56
TurskiNicd-: but as i said, my hack was really dirty10:57
Nicd-otto's hack is in OBS but I don't remember its name10:57
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TurskiNicd-: my hack uploads files straight to /usr since sailfish-qml can't launch qml app from custom path :P11:00
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Guest62672Is there a way to take a screenshot in sailfish?11:09
ElleoGuest62672: there's a couple of screenshot apps in the store11:10
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TofeAL13N_work: request forwarding ? :p11:18
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viviadoes anyone have enough knowledge of maliit? p2-mate is a friend of mine and we decided to try making a swype-like input method (at least a proof of concept)11:31
vivianeed to ask some questions though :)11:31
* Stskeeps looks at vacation list.. 11:31
Nicd-silly Stskeeps, slaves don't get vacation11:32
Stskeepsvivia: can you send it to sailfish-devel@ ? guy isn't around11:33
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viviaStskeeps: cool, thanks :)11:35
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Venemovivia: wow, can I betatest?11:39
viviaVenemo: sure, but there's next to 0 code right now11:40
viviai just hacked together a small module that produces a word list from a letter-to-probability map using aspell, but that's all11:41
Venemovivia: okay, I'm just saying that when you have something to betatest, I'll be here to betatest11:42
viviaVenemo: sure :D11:42
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Venemook, it's come to this11:49
Venemoplease vote:
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faenilCan anyone send me a list of their installed packages on Update5? "rpm -qa | sort" should do11:59
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rauzhi, has anyone a problem with call logs too ? sometimes a placed call shows in my call logs sometimes not this is extremly annoying12:31
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Morpog_PCVenemo_j, you definately need ssd's12:35
robororauz: are the entries appearing in the commhistory database?12:36
Venemo_jMorpog_PC: why?12:36
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Morpog_PCto shorten your deploy to emulator times :)12:36
robororauz: do: sqlite3 .local/share/commhistory/commhistory.db12:36
Venemo_jMorpog_PC: I already have an ssd12:36
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Venemo_jMorpog_PC: I wasn't talking about the emulator, though12:37
Morpog_PCoh, ok, strange then, tweetian takes like 15 to 20 seconds for me12:37
Morpog_PCah, you deploy to device?12:37
Venemo_jMorpog_PC: yes, like i said12:37
robororauz: then you can select from Events to see if the actual call is being logged12:37
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roboroif it appears there... then there is probably a bug in jolla's code for the calllog UI... if the call isn't in the db... then more likely a problem with telepathy or something12:38
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rauzroboro: only the same two contacts are displayed in the call log other contacts when called are note displayed12:46
Andy80do you think it will be possible in the future to have glance notifications like we had on N9 or is there some limitation with Jolla display?12:47
rauzin the sqlite db seems all calls are logged correctly12:47
p2-mateAndy80: unlikely I think, that relies on the partial updates of the amoled screen12:47
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Andy80p2-mate, oh :(12:53
Stskeepswell, you can stil do hover-glance like thing12:53
p2-mateit is kind of strange that samsung doesn't implement this though, even though they also use amloed12:55
cos-would it be possible to make custom gestures? for example i'd like to have global gesture to lock the screen12:56
cos-perhaps swipe from top to side could be used as a shortcut to lock screen12:57
lbtVenemo_j: voted : ... but I think it'd be quite useful to get some community info together on how to optimise the SDK whilst maintaining the flexibility we have12:57
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Venemo_jlbt: should I open another one about that topic?12:59
lbtVenemo_j: I don't think so - I put an answer in yours which I think is the right way to solve the problem as a community13:00
Venemo_jthank you lbt it's nice13:03
Venemo_jlbt: I'll think some more about it :)13:03
lbtI think kaltsi is trying to make this quicker too13:04
robororauz: sounds like a bug in the calllog ui... post on tjc and I'll upvote you... I personally think the calllog stuff could do with a whole lot of improvement13:05
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rauzroboro: thanks i post it wannted to be sure i'm not an idiot and did something wrong13:06
robororauz: if the entries are appearing in the database but not in the calllog ui... I would say that the problem is there13:07
robororauz: you're far from an idiot... the UI for calllog is weak imho13:07
roborosomeone mentioned something about not being able to see older calllog entries recently as well13:08
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squiddwhen is this "next update" coming? with 4g14:02
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Guest62672Anyone here using patchmanager while still on
Sfiet_KonstantinGuest62672: hello14:10
Sfiet_Konstantinwhy are you still on ?14:10
Guest62672Nexus 4 :)14:10
Guest62672New update isn't released yet for nexus haha14:10
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Sfiet_KonstantinGuest62672: I see14:14
Sfiet_Konstantinso I need to maintain legacy support for PM ...14:14
Sfiet_Konstantinhum ... let me try to do this14:14
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Guest62672ah awesome14:16
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Sfiet_KonstantinGuest62672: ping14:29
StskeepsAgenda for tomorrow's meeting:
Guest62672Sfiet_Konstantin: pong14:30
Sfiet_KonstantinGuest62672: tell me your version of lipstick-qt514:30
Sfiet_KonstantinGuest62672: zypper info lipstick-qt514:30
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Sfiet_Konstantinthx Stskeeps14:30
Sfiet_KonstantinGuest62672: from terminal14:30
Sfiet_KonstantinStskeeps: sounds great for the first meeting14:31
Sfiet_Konstantinhope that this happens often14:31
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Guest62672Version: 0.20.7-1.23.914:32
squiddis anyone allowed to join?14:32
Sfiet_KonstantinGuest62672: thx14:32
sledgessquidd: yes ofc14:36
squiddjust asking, maybe this is something that you had to sign up for earlier, never know with stuffs14:37
Sfiet_KonstantinGuest62672: building14:39
Guest62672Sfiet_Konstantin: Thanks!14:41
Sfiet_KonstantinGuest62672: updated TMO post14:42
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Guest62672I see, will try it right now.14:42
Sfiet_KonstantinGuest62672: please do, because I'm not sure that this will work out of the box14:44
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Guest62672Sfiet_Konstantin: The Pandora patches don't seem to work. At least they don't light up when selecting them. And Gallery crashed when I applied the "Better video controls" patch.15:00
Sfiet_KonstantinGuest62672: interesting15:00
Sfiet_Konstantinenabled pandora mode before trying pandora patches ?15:00
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Sfiet_KonstantinGuest62672: ah, and please update patchmanager etc.15:01
Guest62672Sfiet_Konstantin: Pandora mode?15:01
Sfiet_KonstantinGuest62672: yep, pull down the menu and check manage lipstick pandor15:01
Guest62672Sfiet_Konstantin: Yeah, I did that. It restarts lipstick when dumping the QML.15:03
Sfiet_KonstantinGuest62672: did you read the TMO page ?15:04
Sfiet_Konstantinplease do before doing anything else15:04
Guest62672Sfiet_Konstantin: Of course. I posted there under the name Wreck requesting the lipstick-qt515:04
Sfiet_KonstantinGuest62672: :)15:04
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Sfiet_Konstantinthen, you should know that you need to enable pandora mode ;)15:05
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Guest62672Sfiet_Konstantin: Ah I missed that line. How ignorant of me. Excuse me :)15:07
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Sfiet_Konstantinno problem15:08
Sfiet_Konstantinbut be sure to have your SSH enabled and be able to save your device if it bricks15:08
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n1ckyhey i saw you guys pushed a new version since I last checked in, does the nexus 4 have the HAL set up yet?16:17
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xaoshi guys17:31
xaosjust did a factory reset...17:31
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hil1235hi everyone..tried installing the sdk but it freezes after I choose the directory to install it in. any help? I'm on elementary os Luna by the way17:36
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Nicd-now this is strange17:45
Nicd-I'm trying to make a wrapper for moment.js so I wouldn't have to touch the actual file17:46
Nicd-but it doesn't want to work17:46
Nicd-so I made a simple modification to the file which should be completely equivalent but it works17:47
Nicd-the file has this structure: (function () { ... }).call();, which I changed to function init() { ... } init();17:47
Nicd-to my knowledge they should be the same, shouldn't they? but the latter one works17:47
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tango_Nicd-: does (function () { ... })() work?17:55
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tango_also, maybe by calling it init() you're actually triggering some other funky behavior. does it work with asdf as function name?17:55
Nicd-first suggestion doesn't work17:56
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Nicd-but calling it asdf() works17:58
Nicd-it's a shame I have to edit the actual file but I'll probably go with it17:58
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ClowReeddHi. I'm a Nexus 4 owner and I'm very interested in trying out Sailfish. I read that there is a "SailfishOS Early Adopter" program for Android users and I would like to give it a try. Am I in the right place?18:03
Nicd-ClowReedd: yep18:04
tbrClowReedd: send sledges your email address as private message18:04
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ClowReeddThank you so much for the info and the fast response, I'll do as you say.18:05
tbralso include some basic info why you want to do it and how you could maybe help18:07
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n1ckydid anything get fixed lately with nexus 4 and HAL support? is voice working yet?18:18
n1ckyalso, is there a public sailfish git?18:18
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ClowReeddI'm using, do you happen to know how to send a private message to an user?18:26
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n1cky /msg <user>18:29
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Nicd-so, here's my instructions on how to use moment.js in QML: (ping jake9xx)19:42
Nicd-could possibly be applied to other JS libraries too19:43
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UmeaboyI heard that there are Alpha-images out of Sailfish for the i9305, but I can't find it.20:20 is the place to search for it, right?20:20
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Nicd-Umeaboy: send a private message to sledges with your email. explain what devices you have and why you want to be in the early access20:24
UmeaboyNicd: I did a while ago.20:26
UmeaboyNicd-: ^^20:26
Nicd-then I think you should've received instructions with links to the public images20:26
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john24hi guys20:31
john24how would i check that the phone screen is off from my application?20:31
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