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| danielboston26 | poop | 00:16 |
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| stephg | good morning everyone | 08:01 |
| Stskeeps | good morning stephg | 08:01 |
| stephg | word! :) | 08:03 |
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| nadley | hi all | 08:34 |
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| m4g0g | hi | 09:16 |
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| m4g0g | I try to use ListModel with translatable items as in this article: http://qt-project.org/wiki/Qt_Quick_Carousel#70b4903abcb62ace84264ad0443ae759 | 09:20 |
| m4g0g | but I got all items with first name | 09:20 |
| Armadillo | can you show us the code? | 09:22 |
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| m4g0g | of course | 09:24 |
| m4g0g | http://codepad.org/6bX1Dr4p | 09:25 |
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| Armadillo | m4g0g try "index" instaed of "menuView.currentIndex" at line 50 | 09:33 |
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| m4g0g | Armadillo: works. Thx | 09:36 |
| Armadillo | :) | 09:37 |
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| coderus | why not to use onCompleted: append({name: "1"; title: qsTr("Friends")}) and etc.? | 10:04 |
| m4g0g | coderus: Is it better? | 10:05 |
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| coderus | m4g0g: you will put translated string to the model, no need to call external function for each delegate you have | 10:14 |
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| m4g0g | guys. who can help me with attach page? | 12:03 |
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| m4g0g | I have feed page with attached page. I add new one and want to have 3 pages in result: feed - new page - attached page | 12:04 |
| m4g0g | How I can do it? If I use push (newPage) I get 4 pages | 12:04 |
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| Acce | pushAttached()? | 13:06 |
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| Acce | I'm not sure what you mean by getting 4 pages though.. you mean feed -> new page -> new page -> attached page or something? | 13:07 |
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| coderus | m4g0g: https://github.com/CODeRUS/mitakuuluu2/blob/master/client/qml/ChatsPage.qml#L13 | 13:33 |
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| Nokius | any one interested to share a apartment (airbnb) in Brussels during FOSDEM? | 14:29 |
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| Nokius | a two bedroom apartment | 14:31 |
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| enzio00 | Hi! | 15:06 |
| enzio00 | Is anyone here? Could I ask a few questions? | 15:07 |
| chem|st | enzio00: just shoot! | 15:08 |
| enzio00 | OK! I wanted to start learning onhow to develop for Android. But I saw Sailfish OS, how different are the two OSes regarding development? | 15:09 |
| sandsmark | very | 15:10 |
| sandsmark | having written both android-applications and sailfish apps, sailfish is a bit better to work with, imho. | 15:10 |
| enzio00 | What my first "big" project would be to make this: http://forums.thecustomsabershop.com/mhsbuilder/mhsbuilder.php for Android, how easily could I make it for sailfish? | 15:11 |
| anYc | hm, regarding technology, QT is available for android as well now, isn't it? | 15:11 |
| chem|st | question is what is easier to port to the other | 15:12 |
| enzio00 | And what is QT exactly? Sorry for the noob questions... | 15:13 |
| Nicd- | Qt* | 15:14 |
| sandsmark | Qt is an application framework | 15:14 |
| Nicd- | enzio00: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qt_%28software%29 | 15:14 |
| enzio00 | Sorry, Qt. Is it similar too the Qt Wallets for Bitcoin? | 15:14 |
| sandsmark | you write your application with Qt, and you can run it basically everywhere (including android) | 15:14 |
| Nicd- | enzio00: that app was made with Qt | 15:15 |
| Nicd- | that is why it has Qt in the name | 15:15 |
| enzio00 | OK, so is it easy for a beginner to learn? | 15:15 |
| enzio00 | And if I'm on a budget whicjóh mobile would you recommend? Nokia N9? | 15:17 |
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| coderus | enzio00: you want to develop apps? did you developed any apps in past? | 15:22 |
| enzio00 | Well a few in C#, not big ones, just small projects. | 15:23 |
| coderus | thats okay. Qt is similar. Libraries with API, just C++ instead of C#. And QML for UI. | 15:24 |
| coderus | so you want to develop for sailfishos? | 15:24 |
| enzio00 | Ok thanks! | 15:25 |
| enzio00 | I think so | 15:25 |
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| enzio00 | But I would rather make it for android, the port it to sailfish | 15:25 |
| coderus | don't start with sailfish on N9, it's bad experience | 15:25 |
| coderus | better start with sailfish emulator on PC | 15:26 |
| enzio00 | OK | 15:26 |
| coderus | you can buy some android phone with proper sailfishos port: https://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Adaptations/libhybris | 15:26 |
| enzio00 | But if I want a cheap sailfish os handset what shouldI choose? | 15:27 |
| anYc | (when there is one ^^) | 15:27 |
| enzio00 | What about the galaxy nexus? | 15:27 |
| coderus | check link i posted | 15:27 |
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| coderus | and ask about details in #sailfishos-porters channel :) | 15:28 |
| enzio00 | Yes, that's where I saw it, but any thoughts? | 15:28 |
| anYc | isn't it still more expensive than the jolla? | 15:28 |
| anYc | ah, no, jolla is back at 350€ | 15:29 |
| coderus | anYc: well, if you can buy second hand jolla cheaper than n4 | 15:29 |
| enzio00 | And what's the problem with the N9? | 15:30 |
| Yaniel | old hw, bad driver availability | 15:30 |
| Yaniel | something like that iirc | 15:31 |
| enzio00 | OK | 15:31 |
| coderus | 3.x kernel is not optimized, gfx glitches, etc. | 15:32 |
| enzio00 | BTW Do you like Star Wars? Because I recently got into a custom saber craze. Check out these: http://genesiscustomsabers.com/ | 15:32 |
| enzio00 | And thanks for the help! | 15:35 |
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| cos- | isn't there any 100€ discount codes around anymore? | 15:44 |
| locusf | I guess even the tohkbd codes are gone now | 15:45 |
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| ln- | toh kbd codes are valid until 24th dec. | 15:46 |
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| Mano | hi, i have just started developing my first sailfish app | 16:19 |
| Mano | i have a small doubt. | 16:19 |
| Mano | when i push a new page to the page stack, i am able to send some properties along with it using the properties parameter. now how do i receive it in the newly pushed page?? | 16:20 |
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| kontio | Mano: see: https://github.com/d0b3rm4n/harbour-sidudict/blob/master/src/qml/SearchPage.qml#L57 is the call, and in https://github.com/d0b3rm4n/harbour-sidudict/blob/master/src/qml/showEntry.qml#L42 how to use, if defined in https://github.com/d0b3rm4n/harbour-sidudict/blob/master/src/qml/showEntry.qml#L31 | 16:24 |
| kontio | is pretty straight forward... | 16:24 |
| Mano | thanks so much @kontio, i will lok into it. | 16:25 |
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| coderus | Mano: properties are just being set. no magic here :) | 16:34 |
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| Mano | works like a charm. i missed the declaration of the property | 16:38 |
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| beidl | SK_work: still want to talk about user service autostart in sailfish tomorrow? | 16:51 |
| beidl | I'll won't make it to the channel due to army service, but would you like to mention it? | 16:52 |
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| SK_work | beidl: yep, ok for me | 17:04 |
| beidl | SK_work: nice. I'll try to join but I can't promise. have you read my RFC-type notes? | 17:06 |
| beidl | and thank you :) | 17:06 |
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| SK_work | beidl: nope, mind sending them to me ? | 17:08 |
| beidl | SK_work: http://pastebin.com/YqEZGxBG | 17:08 |
| beidl | if you have any comments, we can work that out today | 17:09 |
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| coderus | patched pininput qml to enter "12345" or "jolla" each third wrond code enter attempt :) | 17:23 |
| coderus | wrong* | 17:23 |
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| SK_work | beidl: I will just discuss the basis tomorrow | 17:54 |
| SK_work | ie: what about a daemon that manages daemons | 17:54 |
| beidl | SK_work: great, thanks. | 17:54 |
| SK_work | (the systemd config files thingie) | 17:54 |
| SK_work | both in term of QA and in term of dev | 17:54 |
| SK_work | ie: what would be the problem with QA, and how would the community help providing this | 17:54 |
| Yaniel | SK_work: I like the basic idea | 17:55 |
| SK_work | security, sandboxes, advanced stuff (like more api, wayland, tracker etc.) won't be discussed atm | 17:55 |
| SK_work | as I expect the daemon to stick to harbour rules ATM | 17:55 |
| beidl | SK_work: the daemon to handle daemons is already there, the systemd user session. | 17:55 |
| SK_work | beidl: userspace UI isn't here | 17:55 |
| SK_work | plus, we don't want the devs to write the systemd config file | 17:55 |
| beidl | SK_work: exactly | 17:56 |
| beidl | SK_work: thats what the "trusted daemon" would be there fore | 17:56 |
| beidl | for* | 17:56 |
| SK_work | the daemon should write it, based on a template, so that there won't be any issue with systemd | 17:56 |
| SK_work | yep, the trusted daemon | 17:56 |
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| beidl | well, most details are outlined in my proposal. I'll try to simplify and explain terminology | 17:58 |
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| SK_work | yep indeed | 17:59 |
| SK_work | you did a wonderful work | 17:59 |
| SK_work | but maybe, too much details | 17:59 |
| SK_work | :) | 17:59 |
| beidl | SK_work: thanks :) | 17:59 |
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| beidl | maybe take on the proposal in stages, first explain the need and possible use cases. stage 2 being technical overview, etc etc | 18:00 |
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| beidl | also, I figured the "trusted daemon" could become part of the compositor as "only enable by user intent" implies "the respective app window being focused" | 18:01 |
| beidl | so it effectively becomes part of the shell. | 18:01 |
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| beidl | another benefit of this: not requiring to load libraries into another process' address space. | 18:02 |
| beidl | since the compositor provides everything we need already | 18:02 |
| SK_work | ok | 18:03 |
| beidl | (does the drawing, is always there from a user perspective so it could provide the dbus interface) | 18:03 |
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| SK_work | beidl: not a fan of putting it in compositor | 18:03 |
| SK_work | 1. compositor is already heavy, as being a compositor AND a desktop shell | 18:03 |
| SK_work | 2. daemons should work without having the app window being focused | 18:04 |
| SK_work | not a huge fan | 18:04 |
| SK_work | this trusted daemons manages daemons, not really windows | 18:04 |
| SK_work | even if maybe it can later do this | 18:04 |
| beidl | SK_work: I'll rephrase | 18:04 |
| beidl | a user service should only be enabled by user intent | 18:04 |
| beidl | enabled, not started | 18:04 |
| beidl | and user intent implies that the window is in focus | 18:05 |
| SK_work | ah | 18:05 |
| SK_work | I'm not even sure | 18:05 |
| SK_work | a daemon could be enabled if the user want | 18:05 |
| SK_work | not really "at first run" or something | 18:05 |
| SK_work | an app could provide the ability to run the daemon | 18:06 |
| SK_work | can do so via dbus | 18:06 |
| SK_work | for example | 18:06 |
| Yaniel | usually it shouldn't be enabled without user consent anyway | 18:06 |
| beidl | thats why the trusted daemon provides dbus interfaces to enable/disable the service | 18:06 |
| Yaniel | not even at first run or whatever | 18:06 |
| SK_work | but if you don't want the "private data harvesting tool" to be run when the app is first launched | 18:06 |
| beidl | only the trusted daemon should be allowed to write to ~/.config/systemd/user | 18:06 |
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| beidl | and only it should be allowed to generate a valid service unit | 18:06 |
| SK_work | beidl: indeed, but I would stick to this (DBus API) alone at first | 18:06 |
| beidl | SK_work: seems logical | 18:07 |
| Yaniel | hmm maybe the daemon could pop up a window saying app x requests permission for a daemon? | 18:07 |
| beidl | Yaniel: thats the plan | 18:07 |
| SK_work | Yaniel: not a bad idea | 18:07 |
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| SK_work | let's see how it goes tomorrow | 18:07 |
| SK_work | and then maybe the implementation details will come | 18:08 |
| Yaniel | ie. have the dbus api and just hook it up to a dialog before letting it do anything | 18:08 |
| beidl | right | 18:09 |
| beidl | from an app devs perspective I write a "GUI" and a "background task daemon" | 18:09 |
| beidl | the "GUI" then asks the "trusted daemon" to enable the "background task daemon" | 18:09 |
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| beidl | the "trusted daemon" shows a dialog to the user | 18:10 |
| beidl | if the user accepts it, the "trusted daemon" generates a valid systemd unit in ~/.config/systemd/user | 18:10 |
| beidl | proposal in a nutshell | 18:12 |
| beidl | mind that the "trusted daemon" could apply resource limits as well | 18:12 |
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| SK_work | beidl: indeed | 18:21 |
| SK_work | but not the point for first meeting | 18:22 |
| beidl | right | 18:22 |
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| nadley | hi all | 19:18 |
| nadley | I'm trying to follow that to install all stuff to create an app but I don't understand why I need Virtualbox... https://sailfishos.org/develop-installation-article.html | 19:19 |
| beidl | nadley: the build toolchain is contained in a VM, building happens there. | 19:20 |
| nadley | Can I avoid it or it will be more complicated | 19:20 |
| nadley | beidl: ok so to start using virtualbox looks like the easiest way | 19:21 |
| beidl | nadley: the IDE is running on the host, just building happens in a VM | 19:21 |
| nadley | yes | 19:22 |
| beidl | if you really want to avoid the VM you could set up a scratchbox target in a chroot | 19:23 |
| nadley | hum I'll do that later when I'll be more familiar with the process :D | 19:23 |
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| TemeV | beidl: do you happen to know good instructions for that for U9 SDK? | 20:00 |
| TemeV | I only found one for older SDKs and I hear there is some differences in those | 20:00 |
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| beidl | TemeV: there shouldn't be any differences | 20:13 |
| TemeV | ok | 20:13 |
| TemeV | Maybe I'll give it a try then some day | 20:13 |
| coderus | http://katastrophos.net/andre/blog/2014/03/29/running-sailfishos-build-engine-outside-virtualbox-vm/ | 20:16 |
| coderus | still valid for u9 | 20:16 |
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| TemeV | thanks | 20:20 |
| coderus | using it every day | 20:20 |
| coderus | have two chroots for u8 and u9 sdk | 20:21 |
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| coderus | just need little patch libMer.so to disable annoying "Do you want to start virtualbox?" message, making qtc to think build vm is always running :D | 20:22 |
| TemeV | coderus: could you share that? | 20:23 |
| TemeV | e.g. as a comment to that post so others can find it too | 20:23 |
| coderus | well, i'd like to get libMer.so sources, i patched my libs with IDA Pro :D | 20:25 |
| coderus | TemeV: i have only x64 libs | 20:25 |
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| TemeV | :D | 20:26 |
| TemeV | You really must have hated that message :D | 20:27 |
| coderus | i don't think libMer is closed source, but i failed to find it's sources :D | 20:27 |
| coderus | TemeV: it appear every time you press build/run in qtc | 20:27 |
| TemeV | ah, of course | 20:28 |
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| coderus | done: https://katastrophos.net/andre/blog/2014/03/29/running-sailfishos-build-engine-outside-virtualbox-vm/#comment-96635 | 20:30 |
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| TemeV | I can't see the comment | 20:34 |
| nadley | small question, I'm looking after this tutorial, https://sailfishos.org/develop-firstapp-article.html I think I should choose the armv7hl if I want to build for the jolla ? | 20:34 |
| TemeV | nadley: yes | 20:35 |
| nadley | TemeV: and if I choose both I can build for other targets ? | 20:35 |
| nadley | may be the N9 ? | 20:35 |
| TemeV | well you can add target there | 20:35 |
| TemeV | but I don't know how it works with N9 and that modified version of Qt Creator | 20:36 |
| nadley | TemeV: for the moment my target is the jolla so I'll only check the armv7hl | 20:37 |
| coderus | TemeV: http://paste.ubuntu.com/9532639/ | 20:38 |
| kimmoli | nadley: the x86 target is for emulator | 20:38 |
| TemeV | nadley: the X86 is for the emulator if you want to use it you need to check that also | 20:38 |
| TemeV | coderus: thanks | 20:39 |
| nadley | kimmoli: TemeV it can be usefull :D | 20:39 |
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| coderus | nadley: emulator is good until you have device | 20:41 |
| coderus | armv7hl is ANY device with sailfish, not just jolla | 20:41 |
| nadley | coderus: I have the device but may be to start using the emulator is easiest no ? | 20:42 |
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| TemeV | not really | 20:45 |
| TemeV | deploying is just one click in the ide | 20:45 |
| TemeV | it's the same for the device and the emulator | 20:46 |
| nadley | ok | 20:47 |
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| coderus | nadley: if you have wifi and your pc connected to same network with device its very easy | 20:49 |
| coderus | if not you need to use cable. with cable it's even faster than wifi :) | 20:49 |
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| salyavin | Tablet is not arm7hl right? | 20:51 |
| Nicd- | tablet is x86 | 20:51 |
| Stskeeps | it's not, no | 20:51 |
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| nadley | coderus: yes I have wifi :D | 21:00 |
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| coderus | nadley: its perfect then :) | 21:01 |
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| nadley | should I learn c++ or is there a way to use Python ? | 21:01 |
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| coderus | well, you should learn C++ | 21:01 |
| coderus | it's better way to write native apps | 21:01 |
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| coderus | you can also use PyOtherSide + QML | 21:01 |
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| nadley | ok so I'll take a look to C++ but I didn't write C for years now :D | 21:02 |
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| coderus | it's cool | 21:04 |
| coderus | sailfish have best developers community ever | 21:04 |
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| beidl | coderus: +1 | 21:06 |
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| blabber | would like to join the crowd, but as there is no native SDK for FreeBSD i am not sure which way to go. played around with PyOtherSide but not convinced yet. | 21:08 |
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| coderus | blabber: you can't use linux qtc? | 21:09 |
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| M4rtinK | blabber: I can only say good things about PyOtherSide :) | 21:09 |
| M4rtinK | blabber: it is very powerful :) | 21:09 |
| coderus | M4rtinK: well, it's python + QML :) | 21:10 |
| M4rtinK | == very powerful :) | 21:10 |
| coderus | yes, i mean it's not strict :) | 21:10 |
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| M4rtinK | blabber: BTW, you can use the Mer OBS to build stuff for Sailfish OS: https://build.merproject.org/ | 21:11 |
| evk | virtualbox is available for FreeBSD? | 21:12 |
| M4rtinK | probably not ideal for building own C/C++ application if it can't be also tested on desktop | 21:12 |
| blabber | evk: yepp | 21:12 |
| M4rtinK | but good for building any dependencies or final package generation :) | 21:12 |
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| evk | blabber: I guess it'd be possible to use the image from the SDK. | 21:13 |
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| coderus | if you can use qtc you can build apps in chroot | 21:14 |
| blabber | coderus: we have qtc in the FreeBSD ports, but i expected the sailfish sdk version to have some custom patches. | 21:14 |
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| coderus | blabber: i mean if you get qtc from sailfish sdk you can launch and use it? | 21:15 |
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| blabber | i guess i'll have to play around with the different parts a little. | 21:15 |
| blabber | coderus: using the linux abi layer - maybe. | 21:15 |
| coderus | blabber: you need to try :) | 21:16 |
| coderus | if you success - you can compile | 21:16 |
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| blabber | yeah. i'll evaluate my options between the years. | 21:17 |
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| Armadillo | I hope they bring the update this week | 21:20 |
| Armadillo | my GUI crashed the third time today :-/ | 21:20 |
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| M4rtinK | would be nice to play with it during the holidays :) | 21:31 |
| Stskeeps | there's nothing like telephony errors during xmas | 21:31 |
| beidl | except for the Grinch, he'd love that | 21:33 |
| M4rtinK | what could possibly go wrong :) | 21:33 |
| M4rtinK | good enough for the opt-in phase anyway :) | 21:33 |
| M4rtinK | "how opt-in update users saved xmas!" :) | 21:34 |
| r0kk3rz | i think the people still on tahkalampi wouldnt be happy with another opt-in update | 21:37 |
| r0kk3rz | even if it was only opt-in for the xmas break | 21:37 |
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| lbt | blabber: https://katastrophos.net/andre/blog/2014/03/29/running-sailfishos-build-engine-outside-virtualbox-vm/ | 21:53 |
| lbt | one day I'll have to run through that and see if there's anything we can do to make it easier | 21:54 |
| lbt | don't know if freebsd has bind mount and unshare though | 21:54 |
| blabber | not share about unshare but freebsd has nullfs mounts which are mostly equivalent to bind mounts. | 21:56 |
| blabber | i guess i'll add this to my list of options to evaluate :) | 21:56 |
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| King_DuckZ | hello, anybody knows if there's a specific preprocessor symbol to check if I'm building for sailfish? | 22:03 |
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| King_DuckZ | or does it just define __linux__ and it's up to me to pass some ZOMG_THIZ_IZ_SAILFOSH_____ definition to the compiler^ | 22:04 |
| lbt | it's up to you | 22:09 |
| King_DuckZ | http://web.archiveorange.com/archive/v/bZBuSMQ5PSvw0n3y6yOO | 22:09 |
| King_DuckZ | I see an #ifdef SAILFISHOS there... is that a default symbol? | 22:09 |
| King_DuckZ | what do you mean it's up to me? | 22:10 |
| King_DuckZ | oh sorry | 22:10 |
| * King_DuckZ is tired | 22:10 | |
| lbt | np - there's been a bit of discussion on this and how it works at various levels | 22:11 |
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