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| M4rtinK | any remotely related news to this is | 00:11 |
|---|---|---|
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| M4rtinK | that IIRC Google won't be killing XMPP support after all | 00:11 |
| M4rtinK | from what I've heard | 00:11 |
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| keithzg | Hmm, I mean I was reminded of this by http://www.theverge.com/2015/2/24/8104195/microsoft-outlook-google-chat-facebook-chat-killed-off wherein Microsoft claims that Google is discontinuing the chat protocol and so Outlook.com will be dropping support. | 00:14 |
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| keithzg | Of course they also mention that they'll be discontinuing Facebook Chat but don't call out Facebook for doing the same thing, but I guess Microsoft has a bit more adversarial of a relationship with Google than Facebook ;) | 00:15 |
| M4rtinK | nothing of ordinary I would say | 00:16 |
| ikarus | M4rtinK: they just dumped federation which makes it rather annoying | 00:16 |
| M4rtinK | that's why people should use jabber | 00:16 |
| M4rtinK | not some basically proprietary service that just so happens to use XMPP and remains kinda compatible (for now) | 00:17 |
| keithzg | The trick was that without adoption by a large service, XMPP was never going to hold much market share and widespread platform support. Google (and Facebook) ditching XMPP kindof kills the dream. | 00:18 |
| keithzg | It does seem like Google might keep XMPP going for now: https://plus.google.com/+MayurKamat/posts/ETBvtp9VYav | 00:19 |
| M4rtinK | well, the question is why are they doing it | 00:19 |
| M4rtinK | if it is really *that* bad (I doubt it) or to create an incompatible walled garden (much more likely) | 00:20 |
| keithzg | A bit of both, I think, although definitely more towards the latter. I do think that XMPP has lagged behind a bit, but in part that's *because* the giants have pulled away from it. | 00:20 |
| keithzg | And they think it'll be a win-win if they develop a better protocol that's tied solely to themselves. | 00:21 |
| M4rtinK | anyway, Jolla or someone else needs to start cracking on improved XMPP support (MUC & co) and it will be mainstream in no time ;-) | 00:21 |
| keithzg | heh, if only! | 00:21 |
| M4rtinK | actually Jolla could really push it if they wanted | 00:22 |
| M4rtinK | like an open BBM like secure whatsap alternative | 00:23 |
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| keithzg | Still, hard to fight against the network effect. | 00:23 |
| M4rtinK | well in that case you can throw in the towel and go home :) | 00:23 |
| M4rtinK | everybody uses iOS/Android, no need to bother :P | 00:23 |
| keithzg | Ehhh, that's another story, because you can still interact with those folks via your Jolla (or just SailfishOS in general). | 00:24 |
| keithzg | An outright communication protocol and/or network is unsurprisingly a far stricter area of application for the network effect. | 00:24 |
| M4rtinK | I find it refreshing that I don't have to interact with people over Facebook :) | 00:24 |
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| M4rtinK | (and *I do* interact with people ;-) ) | 00:25 |
| keithzg | Heh, well, certainly over IRC at least ;) | 00:25 |
| M4rtinK | well yeah | 00:25 |
| M4rtinK | most people are either on IRC | 00:25 |
| M4rtinK | Jabber or email | 00:25 |
| M4rtinK | or I can call/sms them | 00:25 |
| M4rtinK | and quite a lot of them are actually doing the right thing and actively avoid Facebook :) | 00:26 |
| keithzg | Personally I love using my Jolla (and nowadays my Nexus 4 running SailfishOS) to communicate with folks over Google or Facebook, since many folks from my non-techy life interact that way (and I certainly can't SMS from my Jolla) but in SailfishOS I just get a nice clean conversation, just text. | 00:26 |
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| keithzg | No ads, no branding, just the conversation. | 00:27 |
| M4rtinK | as long as it works :) | 00:27 |
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| keithzg | Yeah, and that's why I'm worried :P | 00:27 |
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| keithzg | At this point I'm dangerously close to having to give up on my N9 (which is how I communicate via SMS and phone these days; it can't really handle data anymore) and just switch full-time over to Android for my primary device. I could still probably avoid that and use SailfishOS most of the time as long as the FB and Google chats are available, though. | 00:30 |
| M4rtinK | I suggest to start a re-qualification program for your friends immediately instead. :) | 00:31 |
| keithzg | heh | 00:32 |
| M4rtinK | Could take a form of a MOOC :) | 00:32 |
| keithzg | haha, somehow I don't think there'd be broad enrollment ;) | 00:33 |
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| M4rtinK | you can name it Facebook Detox :) | 00:36 |
| keithzg | I'm honestly not that down on Facebook, personally. I purely use it for messages and events, and that's just fine. I think the main problem with Facebook, at the core, is people not being intelligent about how they interface with it. | 00:40 |
| keithzg | I mean, they're big and evil, of course, but that's just par for the course with capitalism. | 00:40 |
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| M4rtinK | yeah | 00:41 |
| M4rtinK | it basically boils down to people willingly feeding it all the information without thinking about consequences | 00:42 |
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| m4g0g | hi | 06:02 |
| m4g0g | What it the proper way to iterate through items in SilicaListView? | 06:03 |
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| coderus | m4g0g: proper way is forget about stupid iterating through listview and use proper models | 06:38 |
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| m4g0g | I have listview with textswitches. How I can get selected items? | 06:39 |
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| coderus | textSwitch.onCheckedChanged: model.set(index, checked) | 06:43 |
| coderus | implement set or whatever yourself | 06:43 |
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| m4g0g | coderus: I thought that this is a bad way to do this. Thx | 06:58 |
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| coderus | m4g0g: bad way is trying to get data from delegates | 07:08 |
| coderus | you should write your data to model directlyand work with model data only | 07:08 |
| Juuba | had a funny issue today in Android FB client's browser.. | 07:10 |
| Juuba | couldn't type normally, everything came out CAPITAL | 07:10 |
| Juuba | even if I hit the "CapsLock" thing on the virtual keyboard | 07:10 |
| Juuba | only way to type minor case was to press shift before every character | 07:11 |
| Juuba | luckily, it was only one field in the login, not the password, ehe hehe | 07:11 |
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| m4g0g | hi, again | 07:49 |
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| chem|st | is there a way to recover from a deleted android_storage folder in $home without reinstalling dalvik? | 09:17 |
| chem|st | J4ZZ in https://together.jolla.com/question/40802/ has accidentally deleted the folder and set it up all right again but it seems that the fuse-mount does not fuse but show as a fused mount | 09:19 |
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| m4g0g | How I can connect to dialog from parent page? I want to perform action not in dialog::onDone but in parentpage::onDialogDone - something like this/ Is it possible? | 09:37 |
| m4g0g | thx. I have found answer in documentation | 09:39 |
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| Juuba | would't dalviks re-install be a quick yet simple fix for the folder? | 10:04 |
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| Juuba | usimg update11, when i leave wifi coverage my jolla will not revert back to cellular data | 13:42 |
| Juuba | just stays/tries to access the same wifi error icon visible on the connection spot | 13:43 |
| Juuba | ayone else seen this behaviour? | 13:44 |
| Juuba | i have to "close" the wifi to get it to connect or use cell data | 13:45 |
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| chem|st | Juuba: for me it just took a while, just tried... connman sometimes fsck that up... | 13:54 |
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| ShawnMcCool | hi all, i'm new here. i'm playing with the qt builder sailfish ide thing and i have a decent idea about how to layout screens with qml, etc. but, where do i find more information about actually programming behavior, like restful api access or anything like that? | 14:30 |
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| Nicd- | ShawnMcCool: this might help with making HTTP requests: http://qmlbook.github.io/ch11/index.html#http-requests | 14:33 |
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| Nicd- | dunno if there are higher level libraries specifically for QML (like jQuery would be for in-browser JavaScript) that help with HTTP stuff | 14:33 |
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| ShawnMcCool | ah ok, so i can just read through qmlbook and have a good idea about idiomatic sailfish os development? | 14:34 |
| Acce | yes, or more like any qml development | 14:35 |
| Nicd- | at least it would give you an idea about QML development | 14:35 |
| Nicd- | judging on the name | 14:35 |
| ShawnMcCool | at what point does qml development break down in capability? are there other strategies currently available? | 14:35 |
| Acce | then just add the UI element bits from the Sailfish Silica reference | 14:35 |
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| Acce | well, there are a lot of stuff that doesn't have a stable qml API yet | 14:36 |
| Nicd- | ShawnMcCool: you naturally have the C++/Python side of Qt5 at your disposal | 14:36 |
| ShawnMcCool | can i use any language with QT bindings? | 14:36 |
| ShawnMcCool | or specifically python / C++? | 14:36 |
| Nicd- | C++ and Python are officially supported | 14:36 |
| ShawnMcCool | k thanks =) | 14:37 |
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| duke_leto | Hey :) | 15:03 |
| duke_leto | So, is there any way to ship a sailfish + silica app to other platforms, like android, desktop OSes etc.? | 15:04 |
| duke_leto | Or would I have to rewrite substantial parts of the app? | 15:04 |
| Nicd- | you'd have to rewrite all silica stuff | 15:04 |
| duke_leto | So, if I manage to separate GUI and logic cleanly, that will mean a rewrite of the GUI... | 15:05 |
| duke_leto | maybe I’ll be able to live with that :) I need to think about that. | 15:06 |
| Nicd- | of course, deploying a Qt app to android/iOS/WP is another story | 15:06 |
| Nicd- | but they have been making progress on that front. dunno if you can get into official app stores though | 15:07 |
| duke_leto | Oh, why would that be? | 15:07 |
| duke_leto | License issues? | 15:07 |
| Nicd- | you can apparently publish to google play. http://doc.qt.io/qt-5/android-support.html | 15:08 |
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| Nicd- | and to the iOS app store too, I'm surprised | 15:09 |
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| duke_leto | Okay, that’s cool. Thanks for your help! | 15:14 |
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| HBP_ | spotify is breaking all the time :( | 15:56 |
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| m4g0g | lol | 16:53 |
| m4g0g | why does my SilicaListView doesn't know about menu property& | 16:53 |
| SfietKonstantinW | m4g0g: there is no menu property on SilicaListView | 16:54 |
| SfietKonstantinW | (is there ?) | 16:54 |
| m4g0g | there is | 16:54 |
| coderus | m4g0g: you again with your crazy delegates? | 16:54 |
| m4g0g | ON my work pc - there is | 16:54 |
| coderus | m4g0g: menu is in ListItem, not ListView | 16:54 |
| m4g0g | on my home - there is not | 16:54 |
| m4g0g | this | 16:55 |
| m4g0g | delegates - it is my nightmare | 16:55 |
| SfietKonstantinW | what's these crasy delegates ? | 16:56 |
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| coderus | SfietKonstantinW: he want to access listview items from outside of delegates | 16:57 |
| SfietKonstantinW | why ? :( | 16:58 |
| * SfietKonstantinW sense violating MVC principle | 16:58 | |
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| coderus | SfietKonstantinW: i have no idea really | 17:00 |
| coderus | i told how to do it prroperly, but... | 17:00 |
| m4g0g | coderus: I did it as you said. | 17:01 |
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| coderus | cool then :) | 17:03 |
| coderus | i just thought you didn't | 17:03 |
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| anandrkris | coderus: hi text selection patch needs update for new browser? | 17:13 |
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| coderus | Acce: no | 17:31 |
| coderus | oopps | 17:31 |
| * coderus hates anandrkris | 17:31 | |
| coderus | this gui have no idea how to use irc | 17:31 |
| coderus | s/gui/guy | 17:31 |
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| Acce | he just got here, asked and left? :) | 17:48 |
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| jaacoppi | don't hate people for not knowing how to use irc. Teach them. | 18:04 |
| meklu|fdf | they're too fast | 18:06 |
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| netlar | Can you run any Android app on sail fish? | 18:10 |
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| Yaniel | no | 18:10 |
| Nicd- | netlar: most of them. if it needs google play services you need to install those yourself | 18:10 |
| netlar | So all the Google apps may not work? | 18:11 |
| Nicd- | google apps will not work until you install google play services | 18:11 |
| netlar | Ahh ok, I was thinking of getting the Jolla tablet | 18:12 |
| Nicd- | there are guides to installing gplay, it's not difficult | 18:12 |
| Nicd- | personally I can live without it and install apps from alternate app stores | 18:13 |
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| netlar | How active is development and are there apps made specifically for Sailfish? | 18:13 |
| Nicd- | development of apps or development of sailfish? | 18:14 |
| netlar | Both | 18:14 |
| Nicd- | native apps are developed with Qt, there are a bunch of them. not too many because of the small userbase | 18:14 |
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| netlar | What about the OS? | 18:15 |
| Nicd- | the OS is progressing all the time, we get an upgrade every 1-2 months usually | 18:15 |
| Nicd- | it has really come far from what it was | 18:15 |
| netlar | 2.0 right now right? | 18:15 |
| jaacoppi | netlar: see www.openrepos.net for some of the apps | 18:15 |
| netlar | Based on pure linux right? | 18:15 |
| Nicd- | netlar: 2.0 is not yet here, it should be around the time the tablet arrives | 18:16 |
| netlar | The OS is rooted too right? | 18:16 |
| Nicd- | dunno what you mean with "pure" linux but sailfish has the linux kernel, systemd, btrfs, rpm packaging, wayland and qt | 18:16 |
| Nicd- | you can get root by enabling developer mode from the settings | 18:17 |
| Nicd- | there's an sshd builtin so you can ssh in then | 18:17 |
| netlar | I hate that android does not let you root 5.0 on my tablet | 18:17 |
| netlar | But what is the issue with the sdcard not having rights from MS to go above 32GB? | 18:18 |
| Nicd- | if you want to support SDXC, you need to support exFAT | 18:18 |
| jaacoppi | aI think android lets you to root but your tablet manufacturer doesn't | 18:19 |
| Nicd- | if you want to support exFAT, you need to licence it from Microsoft | 18:19 |
| netlar | Ok | 18:19 |
| netlar | jaacoppi: You are right | 18:20 |
| netlar | Do you think that new Jolla tablet is worth getting? | 18:20 |
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| Nicd- | if I had need for a tablet, I'd get it | 18:23 |
| jaacoppi | probably not worth it to preorder if you want it for regular everyday use. If you want to hack and play around, then yes | 18:23 |
| netlar | jaacoppi: So wait until it goes on sale? | 18:24 |
| Yaniel | depends what you want it for | 18:25 |
| netlar | Yaniel: I do want it to be my daily driver, for reading, research, movies | 18:26 |
| jaacoppi | just like with everything elsw, depends on what you want to do. I just ordered the phone for half the original price and less bugs, but I'm not as cool as the other people here | 18:26 |
| HBP_ | why they wanted to kill sd standard :P | 18:26 |
| Yaniel | then maybe not yet, unless you are adventurous | 18:26 |
| HBP_ | I mean, I have never ever seen a single device formatted with exfat | 18:27 |
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| pp | HBP_: it's called "standardization", flog your (patented) technologies and hope they stick | 18:27 |
| Yaniel | adventurous as in using arch linux or gentoo for your daily stuff adventurous | 18:27 |
| r0kk3rz | sdcards > 32gb will work, afaik the tablet will prompt for re-formatting to ext4 or something | 18:27 |
| Yaniel | I have a 64GB ext4 microsd in my phone right now | 18:27 |
| Yaniel | works perfectly | 18:27 |
| jaacoppi | netlar: you can do those things with an android tablet half the price or an apple tablet for double price | 18:27 |
| r0kk3rz | Yaniel: honestly the tablet will probably be fairly solid... doesnt have all the weird telephony stuff going on | 18:28 |
| Yaniel | possible | 18:28 |
| netlar | jaacoppi: yea I am never going apple again | 18:28 |
| r0kk3rz | and wont be running on btrfs for main fs | 18:28 |
| Yaniel | haha | 18:28 |
| HBP_ | :) | 18:28 |
| Yaniel | what was the reason for that in the first place anyway? | 18:29 |
| r0kk3rz | fs snapshots | 18:29 |
| HBP_ | easy recovery, i guess | 18:29 |
| netlar | jaacoppi: just kinda wondering the build quality of the table | 18:29 |
| r0kk3rz | netlar: nobody knows that | 18:30 |
| r0kk3rz | well, nobody outside jolla anyway | 18:30 |
| netlar | And it appears there are not going to be front facing speakers | 18:30 |
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| netlar | Sorry off topic stuff | 18:32 |
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| netlar | Is Sailfish updated OTA? | 18:33 |
| Nicd- | yes | 18:33 |
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| HBP_ | has anyone tried to put autoreboot to cron? :P | 18:33 |
| netlar | Does it get security updates, like Ubuntu? | 18:33 |
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| HBP_ | my phone seems to be pretty fucked up after a day or two anyway so it would be best to automate this :P | 18:34 |
| Yaniel | netlar: no, just updates that also fix security issues | 18:35 |
| Yaniel | actually heartbleed got a hotfix update just for itself | 18:36 |
| netlar | Thanks for all the info | 18:37 |
| HBP_ | Yaniel: bash was updated on the latest releasen then? (can't recall) | 18:39 |
| netlar | Is Sailfish truely open source? | 18:39 |
| HBP_ | not really (yet( | 18:39 |
| netlar | Is it controlled by a company? | 18:40 |
| HBP_ | ui stuff seems to be closed but inside the company afaik | 18:40 |
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| jaacoppi | I've understood that sailfish is 100% open source but unusable as a phone without the closed source ui from jolla | 18:48 |
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| Yaniel | the upstream project, nemomobile has a work-in-progress opensource UI | 18:49 |
| Yaniel | but there are some driver blobs that you'll need | 18:50 |
| Yaniel | which won't be open anytime soon | 18:50 |
| jaacoppi | what's the difference of mer and nemo mobile? | 18:50 |
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| Yaniel | they are (being) merged now | 18:51 |
| Yaniel | mer used to be the core os and nemomobile a middleware on top of it | 18:51 |
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| locusf | yeah now its mer core + middleware + glacier ui | 19:03 |
| locusf | (== nemo mobile) | 19:03 |
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| jaacoppi | and jolla is mer core + silica ui? | 19:09 |
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| locusf | yes + Jolla apps | 19:10 |
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| Hartzi | coderus: I can't unapply eventsview controls patch after the 1.1.2.16 update. Anyidea how to fix this? | 19:15 |
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| HBP_ | hmmh google calendar sync is still remains broken in Yliaavanlampi :( | 19:16 |
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