#jollamobile log for Thursday, 2014-02-13

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Abby28 I give you some pictures. I hope you like! http://bit.do/my_videos6906:05
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sjtoikrandom reboot problem seems to be a battery issue07:12
sjtoikor then it's just another reported false alarm07:12
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Siddemine have just random shutdowns. Not reboots07:15
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SiddeOften occurs when the phone has been outside in my pocket for i while, or while i am still outside07:16
Stskeepspull battery for 10 minutes and see how it fares after that07:16
Grauwolfis there a kind of wishlist of apps that users want to be made?07:17
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Abby23 I give you some pictures. I hope you like! http://bit.do/my_videos6908:05
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Nicd-can you just ban Abby*!*@*?08:09
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fluxI doubt it's being done manually, so it would be to easily avoided08:11
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fluxthe ip ban suggested on #sailfishos might work better?08:11
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AL13N_workhmm, i hope noone is called Abby will join our channels08:12
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tbrtough luck, no cookies08:13
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AL13N_workthe ip was the same in previous spams08:13
suyIs a freenode-wide problem, better fixed there. although I don't see how to block a spammer if is using a botnet for example08:13
AL13N_workexcept that the ip has been the same so far08:13
tbrI thought they had k-lined that, but maybe it expired08:14
suyyes, but once you block it, they will use another. That's the problem with spam in general08:14
suyThey always figure out something08:14
AL13N_workof course08:14
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AL13N_workbut do you want to miss some real abby's in the channel?08:15
AL13N_work:-)08:15
AL13N_workwell, don't ask me, cause i'm married08:15
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AL13N_workthis reminds me, i don't think i saw any female in the fosdem roundtable08:15
AL13N_work:-(08:15
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fluxsuy, well, it doesn't need to originate from a botnet, could just as easily originate from some single not-very-technical person from his (her?-)) home computer.08:20
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suyflux: you mean a compromised computer?08:21
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fluxno, I mean some person just loads an application for doing this and runs it on his/her come computer08:21
Accemore likely it's dem toolbars08:22
Accehaving all kinds of malware in them08:22
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ballockAcce: that's basically a compromised computer08:24
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Acceballock: well, true08:24
slatewhich is part o a botnet.. :)08:25
slateof08:25
slateI hate fingerterm keyboard..08:25
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HtheBi hate you...08:32
HtheB:p08:32
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stephgyey my other halves have shipped08:53
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Nicd-Yaniel: have you gotten Jolla to work with the TUT email?09:15
AcceNicd-: I have, the old mail, that is09:17
Accehaven't tried the new exchange stuff yet09:17
Nicd-Acce: I have the new mail but had the same problem with the old mail too, I can't send09:17
Nicd-I'm using the new one with IMAP09:17
Nicd-receiving works fine but sending never does09:18
Accehmm, did you put "password" to the combobox at the bottom of the email settings?09:18
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Acceto the "Authentication"09:19
Nicd-yes09:19
Accewhat about the ports?09:19
Nicd-they are as instructed in POP09:20
Accehmm.. TLS?09:20
Nicd-when I try to send, it says "updating" for a while and then "Problem with sign-in"09:20
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Nicd-even though I've written and rewritten the password many times09:20
Nicd-Acce: yep09:20
AcceI guess you double checked your credentials already09:20
Nicd-done that, yes09:20
Nicd-I tried exchange too but it didn't work, just had some generic error when trying to create an exchange account09:21
Nicd-it sucks not being able to send email09:21
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Accewell, I have: receive: imap.tut.fi, TLS port 143, and for outgoing I have mail.tut.fi TLS 587, authentication: Password, and it's working :/09:22
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Nicd-I have the new ones. outlook.office365.com, SSL port 993, sending smtp.office365.com, TLS port 58709:23
AcceNicd-: try the ones I have, they'll work for about a year still :D09:24
Nicd-Acce: actually they'll switch you over to the new email system at the end of february09:24
AcceI don't get it why they changed to that office365 crap09:24
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Acceprobably got it "free" from MS09:24
Nicd-and you'll lose your email if you don't switch manually before it09:25
Nicd-anyway, sending email didn't work with the old email settings either09:25
Nicd-gmail works fine though09:25
Nicd-I've tried this: http://pro-testing.arabuusimiehet.com/archives/596#t409:25
Nicd-but didn't seem to help09:25
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Accehmm was it that soon.. could be different for me since I just switched from student to employee..09:26
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YanielNicd-: the office365 one? yes10:37
Yanieljust set up a mfe account10:37
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AcceYaniel: it's working for you?10:43
Yanielyep10:45
YanielI see one extra calendar on my jolla10:46
Accedo you have something different in your email settings compared to Nicd?10:46
Yanielbut otherwise works fine10:46
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YanielI had to go to server settings to set my login name since it is different from the address10:48
Yanielhmm secure connection is checked but port is 443?10:51
Accehmm is exchange different from office365..10:51
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Yanielthey are not directly related10:56
Yanielbut office365 is a service, exchange is ahm protocol?10:58
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* pahartik tried to use "osc" for building "bridge-utils" on "https://build.merproject.org/" but damn thing does not seem to like IPv6-only network11:01
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Nicd-Yaniel: did you use automatic discovery for exchange?11:07
YanielI don't remember, likely not11:07
Nicd-it didn't work for me. it wen through "checking credentials" fine but after the next dialog it failed11:07
Nicd-went*11:07
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Yanieloutlook.office365.com is the server url11:08
Nicd-I'll try again now11:08
Yanieldoes your login have the @tstudent.ut.fi part?11:09
Nicd-yes11:09
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Nicd-retrieving settings from server...11:11
Nicd-ooh, now it worked!11:11
Yanielyay!11:12
Yanieldo you have phantom calendars?11:12
Nicd-I don't know11:12
Nicd-now email app doesn't start :D11:12
YanielI have one shown twice in calendar->manage calendars11:12
Nicd-I didn't sync calendars or contacts11:12
Yanielah11:12
Nicd-email won't start :/11:13
Yanielthe duplicate does not have any events though11:13
Nicd-I'll try rebooting11:13
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Nicd-yay, email app started11:15
Nicd-and I can send mail!11:16
Nicd-thanks Yaniel <311:16
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AcceAnd then they lived happily ever after...11:17
ballockwith Exchange? yeah, right :p11:18
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Acceballock: no, Yaniel and Nicd of course :D don't you see the "<3"11:18
ballocka happy couple and Exchange? Sounds like a horror story to me11:19
Accewell, I don't blame people for what they love11:20
Acceor what they're forced to love11:20
Acceor at least, forced to use11:20
ballockYou know, those things are not love, it's either obsession, posession, or being posessed.11:21
ballocklike in http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qeMFqkcPYcg11:21
Acceheh, sounds like semantics to me11:22
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* covox has spent the last week developing for Exchange11:23
covoxI'd describe the relationship as extremely passive aggressive11:23
Accecovox: :D11:23
AcceI wonder why Jolla implemented exchange first.. did they feel it's something the phone has to have to be accepted for corporate use?11:24
covoxboth people are in a rut and they know it, no-one tells each other why they're upset, occasional shouting matches11:24
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ballockI guess it was just ready from some post-Nokia stuff.11:25
covoxalso developing in .NET makes a lot more sense after being smacked in the head a few times with a MSDN binder11:26
ballockcovox: a MSDN binder? what's that?11:27
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covoxballock: at one stage you could order a printed copy of e.g. the complete win32 API11:28
covoxthink a rack full of telephone books, only about twice as thick and three times as dense11:29
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covoxplus if you needed any metalwork done, you could put one next to your iron forge and use it as a replacement anvil11:30
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ballockcovox: I get it, I get it. Just don't dump it on the IRC.11:31
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covoxor an easy way to stop your 1,100 ft ocean liner from floating away, just chain two of them together and toss them overboard11:32
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ballockI just checked the #msdn and #microsoft channels, next to nobody to dump the stuff on...11:33
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covoxballock: they all deved for the windows 8 store launch and are too busy being millionaires11:36
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Yanielwell, exchange activesync is pretty good12:19
Yanielbut it is microsoft's proprietary stuff :/12:20
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jubo2how do I send sms12:54
jubo2I cannot from gallery12:54
jubo2which is, once again, stupid12:54
Yanielwhat12:54
jubo2no. I mean mms12:54
Yanielyou can't12:54
jubo2multimedia message12:54
jubo2sry, my bad12:54
Yanielit is not implemented yet12:54
Yanielcoming soonâ„¢12:54
tbrartemma: being fixed right now apparently12:55
AL13N_workwell, i'm more interested in the bluetooth stuff :-)12:56
AL13N_workalso, an SFTP (SCP) share method would be nice :-)12:57
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AL13N_workwell, i just do it in fingerterm, it's not that big of a deal :-)12:57
AardAL13N_work: you could try adding a generic sharing plugin calling arbitrary scripts :p12:59
AL13N_workyes, i was thinking of something like that13:00
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artemmatbr: hopefully app store will actually work this time :)  You mean both Quick Launcher and Flashlight entries are being fixed? Or the whole app store thing?13:01
fluxyeah, a script sharing system would rock13:01
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AL13N_workAard: but otoh, it would not be used alot...13:01
fluxI would copy it over ssh to somewhere and make the URL for it to appear in my IRC, as well as in jolla clipboard13:01
Yanielssh sharing?13:01
AardAL13N_work: I'd use it :p it's been on my todo-list for over half a year, but unfortunately I have so much other stuff to do13:01
AL13N_workAard: that's EXACTLY my point13:02
tbrartemma: it sounded like more than just your packages13:02
AardI've been using it on the n900, and missing that functionality on n9 was the biggest issue there for me13:02
AardAL13N_work: what, I'm not good enough for you? :p13:02
AL13N_worki mean that i TOO have other, higher priority stuff to do13:03
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tbrAL13N_work / Aard - bt-sync works out of the box on jolla, also pretty cool as it syncs selected directory in the background13:03
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AL13N_worklike my WLAN issue/or AppSec PoC13:04
Aardtbr: bluetooth is fancy new technology, still didn't get used to it ;)13:04
AL13N_workand i'll need to do a new openvpn systemd file so that i have a .target file which can stop all the vpns13:04
tbrAard: no bittorrent-sync. let me find an url13:04
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tbrhttp://www.bittorrent.com/sync/downloads13:05
tbrthe ARM binary works ootb on the jolla13:05
tbrsadly this is binary only13:05
AL13N_workwhat about aria?13:05
tbrit was pretty impressive and useful to sync certain directories between all my jolla, android devices, laptop AND server13:06
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tango_copy files to the jolla from linux. suggestions?13:15
salami`usb? sftp?13:15
tango_usb connection13:16
tango_(otherwise I'd just use rsync)13:16
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Yanielsshfs13:17
Yanielfor maximum comfort13:17
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tango_Yaniel: it's via usb, I'd have to setup a network over usb13:23
pahartiktango_: "scp -pr"13:23
Yanieltwo commands13:23
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Yanielnot much of an issue13:23
tango_btw mtpfs mounted it13:24
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tango_but then it says "Transport endpoint not connected"13:24
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tango_oh well13:25
tango_now it works13:25
tango_meh13:25
tango_very flaky13:25
Aardtango_: try jmtpfs, seems to be a bit more stable than mtpfs13:25
tango_Aard: thanks, I'll keep that in mind13:27
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Turskitango_: i have set up a udev rule that triggers a script that mounts jolla with sshfs when plugged in14:26
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_Razor_not bädmän...clash of clansia pelannu, irssiä ssh:n yli kuten nyt14:43
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_Razor_mailit synkkaa.. twitterin ja nettisivujen pläräystä mutta ei puheluita14:44
joonahoi_wrong channel maybe?)14:45
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_Razor_yup :P14:45
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_Razor_since speaking about jolla phone; so 18% battery to go and took from charger tuesday morning at 7:3014:50
_Razor_not bad imo14:51
_Razor_usage: playing games, mail/tweetian/web/weather browsing, some txt-messages but no calls14:52
joonahoiyup, the battery life is really good14:53
_Razor_can you find droidphone with same batterylife14:53
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Dima^true, after update, battery life is significally better14:57
Dima^even better than in n914:57
SpeedEvil:)14:58
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Sail0rit's the first time since my n900 that I not searching for charger every evening ^^14:59
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Dima^but indeet the sound of the black toh are not functional15:06
Dima^indeed..15:06
Dima^have to change to jolla original ones15:07
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Sail0roO15:08
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Dima^but clock alarm is good :)15:10
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jussiSo, the brother in law is having lots of issues with his phone - its shutting down whenever it seems to have CPU load - during a call, opening gallery, using the net etc. If he leaves it for 10 mins with battery removed, then every is ok for soem time, but then it begins again. anyone seen this/can help?15:27
Yanielrandom shutdowns? yeah many people have reported those15:29
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Yanielthere should be discussion on tjc15:29
_Razor_i had those shutdowns after 1.0.3.815:30
_Razor_removed battery couple of times for ~10min..now the problem seems to be gone15:30
Yanielnever had the issue15:31
_Razor_I tried to get logs for those resets but log timing was always wrong15:31
_Razor_Only bootup in log15:32
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tango_Turski: care to share it?15:38
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Turskitango_: this sets up the networking for the device with interfacename "jolla" http://paste.dy.fi/2A816:03
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tango_Turski: ah, cool16:04
Turskiand i have host jolla defined in my ssh config, and then i do just $ sshfs :jolla ~/jolla16:04
Turskilooks like i didn't have sshfs part automated yet16:04
tango_of course16:04
tango_the thing that I seem to be learning here is that you can trivially ad a network interface for a usb thingie16:04
Yanielyep ^^16:05
Turskiand of course your jolla usb should be in developer mode16:05
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tango_of course16:07
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AL13N_workSage: i got several things on wifi: IPv6 looks like it does fuck up the state of connmand (restarting connmand seems to help), there's stuff on ipv6 that isn't handled well, and op ipv4 falling back to zeroconf happens too soon, (or it doesn't retry), and it stores the fallback ip in connman settings, making the next connection more difficult16:10
rangoy~.16:10
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AL13N_workSage: then the wlan itself, the openwrt "iw station dump" returns tx rates that are satisfactory, the jolla itself seems to not go further than MCS7 (even with the distance to wlan antenna being less than 5 cm), but more importantly, the rx RATE (on openwrt) is never more than 6.0Mbps... while other devices have sometimes 104 or more mbps16:11
AL13N_workwhile the jolla is reportedly sending at 52MBps, the openwrt is receiving it at 6.0 mbps16:12
AL13N_worki don't know much about wifi, but that doesn't look good16:12
AL13N_work(this was with tests at work, so different openwrt hardware)16:12
AL13N_work(and no ipv6 stack here)16:13
AL13N_workSage: anyway, my guess is more toward firmware... is the reported transmit speed actually correct?16:13
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SageAL13N_work: my transfer speed on my wifi network is ~6MB/s on wifi with my jolla at least so maybe something on the ap side different that is not handled that well.16:18
SageAL13N_work: with WPA2-PSK encryption and ipv4 only16:18
Sagethough my wifi ap is not very fast one :P16:19
AL13N_worki didn't test sustained transfer rates, gonna try that16:19
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AL13N_workmaybe it'll be better if i push more data into it16:20
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SageAL13N_work: quick test on my network ~6MB/s in and ~5.2MB/s out16:23
Sageand I was talking on the phone at the same time fwiw :)16:24
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AL13N_workSage: gonna see tonight if i get the same16:31
AL13N_workwhat did you do? did you just scp something?16:32
AL13N_workSage: did you check your openwrt ap, the 'iw dev wlan0 station dump'16:32
AL13N_work?16:32
AL13N_workSage: btw: why is the wlan device split into 2 managed ones?16:33
AL13N_workwlan0 and p2p016:33
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TurskiAL13N_work: 52 MB or Mb and 6 MB or Mb?16:39
TurskiAL13N_work: 52 Mb = 6.5 MB16:39
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SageAL13N_work: just plain scp and MB16:40
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SageAL13N_work: unfortunately I'm not near the openwrt ap I have (it is 160km from my home :))16:40
Turskiand supposedly at least not mb...16:40
Turski(millibits)16:40
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AL13N_workSage: i've copied a file over of 2.9GB and at first i get 3.4MB/s, but now down to 100kb and i notice the rx rate dropping16:44
SageTurski: :)16:44
AL13N_workscp too16:44
SageAL13N_work: well I tried with ~1GB file16:44
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AL13N_workthe rx rate is now stuck on 6.0Mbit16:45
AL13N_worksignal is very flaky it seems16:46
AL13N_workfrom -67 to suddenly +5616:46
AL13N_workdBm16:46
SageAL13N_work: what is the openwrt version you are using and what hw? I'm possibly going next to one openwrt box during the weekend maybe I can check if it works for me16:46
AL13N_workah, this is because it disconnects16:47
AL13N_workatheros chipsets16:47
AL13N_worknetgear and tplink16:47
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AL13N_workthe netgear is 10.03.1 and the TPlink was trunk (daily build)16:48
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tanghusFreaking great. Harbour removes notifications about app status. Now I have to try to remember the rejection reason :(16:49
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AL13N_workSage: afaict it's because i have disconnects16:49
AL13N_workin the middle of the file transfer16:49
AL13N_worksignal is mostly between -65 and -75 dBm16:50
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AL13N_workbut then suddenly it's 38dBm or something16:50
AL13N_workpostitive, i mean16:50
AL13N_workeach time that happens, the rx rate drops back to 1.0Mbit and climbs upward again16:51
AL13N_workthe scp file transfer keeps going, just sometimes it stalls during these times16:51
AL13N_worki should make a graph out of this or something16:51
AL13N_worktx retries is huge, but that might be normal-ish16:53
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louisdkI hope that more coloured other half would be released soon. I think it a bit overkill to create a new wallpaper and ringtone for every colour.16:57
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AL13N_workSage: going home... ttyl17:00
chem|stwtf, no stickers with toh order... they are seriously in trouble when they are so short on stuff that they need to charge 29eur a piece and not even put stickers in a package with 2 toh...17:00
Yaniel:D17:02
YanielI too order TOHs just for the stickers17:02
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Aardchem|st: should I send you some?17:03
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tango_tohs for the sticker?17:05
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Sail0rlol https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BgXlkkCIcAAeR5E.png17:25
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chem|stYaniel: +117:50
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louisdkHave anyone brought this case for their Jolla: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Leather-case-cover-sleeve-pouch-padded-lined-brown-soft-slim-lightweight-strap-/141127749211?pt=US_Cell_Phone_PDA_Cases&var=&hash=item20dbde8e5b20:18
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Quudo people really use that kind of cases?20:26
Dima^no, they are nightmares20:26
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louisdkbecause you get tired of the lock mechanism?20:32
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pdanekThe aluminium frame on Jolla is quite soft material., just light drops on the ground and noticeable damages.20:50
pdanekAt least I passed the "new thing" period, when I was worrying to even scratch the Jolla. :D20:51
Yanielyeah we need aeroplane steel phones20:51
pdanekYaniel: Actually I believe that plastic is much better material for phones than aluminium, why do they use aluminium anyway?20:52
kehnooaluminium is nice as it deforms instead of cracking20:53
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pahartikpdanek: Aluminium is easily reusable, plastic often not so easily reusable20:57
pdanekRight.20:57
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Quuleft20:58
ShadowJKPlastic will also act as cushion :)20:58
pdanekStill I believe that much more damage-proof phone can be made out of right plastic material than from Al.20:59
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ShadowJKyep20:59
pdanekThat's why all the modern cars have plastic bumpers.20:59
Quuthats why moped-cars are made from plastic21:00
Quuand almost can handle "bump" with bicycle21:00
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ShadowJKYou could make phone out of cast iron, and it'd be unbreakable on the outside, but if you dropped it on the floor, your floor would be ruined, and all the electronics inside the phone would be ruined, but the outside of the phon would look brand new21:01
kehnooeh, cars have plastic bumpers because it's cheap, easy to fix and by deforming and breaking it consumes the kinetic energy21:03
FireFlyYour phone would also be heavier than an N90021:03
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kehnooI've got phone made of steel, it's great but pain in the ass in winter :p21:03
FireFlyShadowJK: couldn't there be something softer inside the cast-iron shell to protect it from such damage?21:04
ShadowJKNo because then it becomes too thick21:04
ShadowJKbut yeah, that'd be pretty good21:04
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Dima^omg.. I can't change a ringtone?!21:06
FireFlyUm, yes you can? I think21:06
FireFlyIn the settings for the ambience21:06
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Dima^changed TOH to Keira black, then in settings choose jolla-ringtone..21:07
Dima^now friend called me an it was stilla Keira tone21:07
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Quuyeah21:07
Quubecause you cant change it21:07
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Quuthats why you dont use those ambiences21:08
FireFly...that sucks D:21:08
Yanielyou can't?21:08
Dima^I have to use other ambiance to change the ringtone21:08
kehnoojut rip the picutre from internet and make own ambience :p21:09
Dima^but I like this background and alarm tone :P21:09
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Quuor find the .ambience file and edit it21:09
FireFlyOr just locate the picture in the fs and copy it to ~/Pictures21:09
FireFlyhm, where are the .ambience files?21:09
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Quuwell, thats why you need to _find_ the file.21:10
FireFlyOh21:10
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FireFlyOkay, so /usr/share/ambience/21:11
FireFlyat least that's where the poppy red ambience was installed21:11
Quuyeah21:12
Quuambience-black21:12
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Quucreating ambience from wallpaper creates blue-ish hilights21:15
Quuand they are green-ish with kiera-whatever21:15
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Dima^this greenish is quit good21:31
Dima^*quite21:31
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Quuindeed it is21:31
Quumaybe i need to waste time and clone the ambience with my custom sounds21:31
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Dima^maybe I'l keep the original keira.. and get used to these tones :P21:32
Quumeeh, sould be pretty easy to edit21:32
Quuadd .mp3's, change couple lines and rename the theme21:32
Dima^tell me when you'll be done with that21:33
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Quuprobably tomorrow evening21:33
Dima^So I'll waste a little bit less time21:33
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Dima^*lesser21:33
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Quuwell, there were guide with TOH dev-kit21:34
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Dima^there is?21:35
Quuyes21:35
Dima^and the template for an ambiance21:35
Quukinda yeah21:35
kehnooI got highlights when I just rotated and resized the picture pulled from internet21:35
Dima^but I though that the have to be in the store and combined with own toh21:35
kehnoored highlights21:35
QuuDima^: pretty sure you can just move them to /usr/share/ambience and *magic*21:36
Quubut ill tinker with those tomorrow21:36
Dima^love this kind of magic21:36
Yanielkehnoo: do you have the red TOH?21:36
Yanielin use21:36
Dima^I's damn orange :D21:36
Yanielyeah21:36
kehnoono, black one without nfc chip21:37
Dima^all my friend see it as orange :P21:37
Yanielorange as a carrot21:37
Yanielwell, if get all pedantic I'd say it is vermilion21:38
QuuDima^: bad habit, i use *magic* as excuse for being too tired to write long lines of useless shit noone bothers to read anyway21:38
Dima^why it's not named honestly "First one orange"21:38
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Quubecause its bit more red than orange21:38
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Dima^Quu: between two engineers this word like "magic" explains enough stuff.21:39
Dima^or is it in the between21:39
Dima^but if almost all people see it as orange, so nature tells more than some rgb-pickup tool21:40
Dima^"it's 1/255 more red!" - "no, it's orange. period."21:42
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FireFlyIt's certainly on the red side of orange22:30
FireFlys/side/end/22:30
FireFlyThe physical TOH at least22:31
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Grauwolfare there actual jolla developers in here?23:34
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stephgif you're lucky23:34
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stephgmight be nap-time for most of them tho'23:34
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Grauwolfi would be interested in what they think a possible approach to application permission management would be. what they where thinking of and if there is already work being done in this field23:36
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Dima^Grauwolf: try to search Together23:40
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stephgGrauwolf, there's an open topic about it as Dima^ says23:42
* stephg goes running off to find the link23:42
Dima^damn this mamoni spams in /msg23:42
stephghttps://together.jolla.com/question/27076/roundtable-discussion-application-security/23:44
stephgGrauwolf ^ that's from the community side but involved sailors who happened to be at FOSDEM23:44
Grauwolfstephg: thanks23:46
stephgplease add thoughts/comments23:46
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Grauwolfi just came from the local devops meetup which included beer. so i am not in the best condition to comment on technical matters. but i'll try not to forget it tomorrow23:48
stephgif it's any consolation I'm also smashed23:49
Grauwolf:)23:49
Grauwolfbut regarding SELinux https://grsecurity.net/~spender/pics/mac_security_sesamestreet.jpg23:52
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