#jollamobile log for Wednesday, 2015-06-10

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kimmoliNokius: i can force too big ones be opened in browser ?05:40
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tango_so the native browser doesn't support webrtc and android browsers detect the mic but others don't hear me06:15
tango_suggestions? ways to test the mic?06:16
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pp__there must be some android recorder app (or 10000 of them)06:17
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Stskeepstango_: "Recorder" app06:17
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tango_Stskeeps: pp: thanks. I've tested the native Recorder app and Sound Recorder from F-Droid06:33
tango_and they both work06:34
tango_hm06:34
Stskeepsok, then we have a bug somewhere, or the android browsers don't request resource permissions06:34
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tango_Stskeeps: actually I've only tested opera right now06:35
tango_I'll have to test other browsers too06:35
tango_it does ask me which mic I want to use, btw06:35
tango_but neither option works06:35
tango_(earpiece or speakerphone)06:35
tango_hm let me see if I can install an updated opera06:35
tango_oh btw Three now works06:38
tango_so I just 'close' the issue I opened?06:38
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chem|stI'd so love to have a tripple layer Jolla by now... when again is it comming *troll*08:49
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ggabrielin the spirit of random conversation, i updated nokia maps yesterday on my n908:55
ggabrieland i haven't used it for a while08:55
ggabrielwhat a nice phone :)08:55
ln-map data version 0.2.54.223?08:56
clauI seem to recall reading about some maintenance which is performed on Wednesday nights, if the phone is connected to the charger. I just can't find anything about this anymore. Can anyone say what kind of maintenance is done, and how can I trigger it manually (eg. from terminal)?08:57
Nicd-clau: tuesday night it runs btrfs balance08:57
ggabrielclau: i think it's in the early hours of tuesday, and what happens is a btrfs rebalancing. you can do this yourself ofc08:57
clauok, thanks :)08:58
ggabrielln-: that's correct09:00
chem|stggabriel: indeed a nice phone, but I'd buy a N950 like phone with SFOS on it in a heartbeat09:01
ggabrielchem|st: well, it's hard to get that... also, sfos doesn't have a proper maps (and especially drive) application09:01
chem|stwhat I miss most since n900 is the hardware keyboard and the precision stylus09:01
ggabrielalso, my n9 is made in finland :)09:01
zuttoi've been trying to hunt down some n900 for some days09:02
chem|stggabriel: that is only a catch phrase09:02
ggabrielfwiw, i'm planning to use the n9 for satnav only09:02
ggabrieli really can't see a reason why to buy a dedicated device09:02
chem|stggabriel: so you arent using alien-dalvik?09:03
ggabrielchem|st: hehe, yeah, i know it's a catch phrase... still one of the last things made by the nokia factory09:03
chem|stggabriel: I have a preproduction N9...09:03
ggabrielchem|st: i try to avoid it... did you find anything that's close enough to nokia maps/drive in android?09:03
ggabrielchem|st: you mentioned that in the past, yeah, good collector's piece09:04
chem|stggabriel: ehrm Nokia HERE, is just the next evolution09:04
ggabrielyup, i know about it, just didn't get around to trying it. i guess this whole account thing to download offline maps put me off a little bit09:05
chem|stdoes Uber buy Nokia HERE now?09:05
ggabrieli haven't read they have09:05
ggabrielfacebook was the other one, right?09:05
TemeVggabriel: wasn't an account needed with N9 also?09:05
ggabrielTemeV: maybe, maybe it uses the ovi account09:06
chem|stggabriel: no, car manufacturers.. Daimler BMW etc09:06
chem|stggabriel: yeah you need an account there too09:06
TemeVggabriel: oh yeah of course, it used the same account09:06
ggabrielwell, i have a work android phone09:06
ggabrieli can try here there :P09:06
ggabriel(if that makes sense)09:06
TemeVwell, these days you need accounts everywhere. It is annoying but imo stupid reason not to use some good service09:07
chem|stggabriel: N9 uses the old backend iirc so you are actually talking to Microsoft first, the new here interface is new, with new accounts but you can import your favs and stuff to Nokia HERE09:07
ggabrieli'll give it a go09:07
chem|stI hope that the sailfishos-maps just get upgraded to current HERE09:08
ggabrielthat would be nice09:08
ggabrielit wants to send sms's09:11
ggabrielwtf09:11
ppyup, but nontrivial :(09:11
chem|stTemeV: the HERE account is just for HERE and I find a very good reason for it, I go to the HERE website and plan my vacation, saving all POIs and then just sync those09:11
ggabrielsee why i tend to stick with the ole trusty nokia drive of the n9? :)09:11
chem|stggabriel: you are overshooting, question is why does it want that... answer is, to share your location by sms09:12
TemeVchem|st: yeah, there is some good use for it. But if I just wanted to download maps an account is unnecessary09:12
ggabrielchem|st: i imagined...09:12
chem|stit does not send random sms to nokia....09:12
TemeVBut I don't complain, creating an account is not that complicated09:12
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chem|stggabriel: on N9 it took me ages to get a proper location2sms going, there it is integrated (I used it only once or twice but there it was necessary...)09:14
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ggabrielchem|st: presumably on the other end they can click on the sms and get some maps application open with that?09:15
ggabrielotherwise a postcode should do09:15
birdzhangmorning~09:15
chem|stggabriel: on N9 it was a proper vcf format location... but as the world is stupid, we do not send those things by sms anymore09:16
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chem|stJolla is one of those stupid... MMS for a phone number, guess who invented that...09:16
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chem|stggabriel: I don't know how your postcodes do work but I am in the woods, only location service there is are those rescue-pickup-points09:18
ggabrielchem|st: ok, it depends what kind of location you want to share... i used to give coordinates and that used to works (still should)09:19
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ggabrielbut i'm sure that even if your house is in the middle of the woods, it will have a post code09:19
chem|stan address yes but that might not help that much... do you know those postboxes on the streets in nowhere, that is the address... now find the cabin!09:20
ggabrieloh, come on, i'm sure you'll come meet me at the post box ;-)09:22
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chem|sthehe09:22
ggabrielbtw, tried here on the android phone, it's a lot better than the apk that i donwloaded ages ago for the jolla09:23
ggabrielso may give it a go09:23
chem|stsince HERE for android is mature the N9 is sad... gets only love so the battery does not die!09:24
chem|stI should probably get a new one from somewhere09:24
ggabrielmind you, the n9's drive is still fully functional for what i want it for09:24
ggabriel(i don't drive too much :P )09:25
chem|styeah as alien is still buggy you might want to switch back from time to time.... offline mode started to pester me for a connection...09:25
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chem|stit does not do that on android... other apps that have an offline mode do that to...09:26
chem|stdon't know if it is google something in the background triggering it though09:26
chem|stbut in general it is very usable09:27
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chem|stI am a bit lost here how do I invoke that? -t btrfs ‘-o nospace_cache,clear_cache,enospc_debug,nodatacow’10:18
chem|stis that right?10:18
chem|stmounting it is10:18
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chem|stor can I just send mount -o nospace_cache... /dev... /mnt..10:23
till-why not just use "mount -t btrfs -o nospace_cache,........"?10:25
chem|sttill-: or that10:25
till-that's how I would use the mount command unless there is a reason for the 's10:26
till-btw what is current fastest/cheapest way to get a new/working screen for the jolla?10:29
chem|stcare10:30
till-I guess it's the only way except for buying a new/used phone?10:31
ggabrieltill-: erm....10:32
ggabrieltalk to care10:32
ggabrieli broke mine10:32
ggabrielthey won't repair it, or they may in the future for about 150e10:32
ggabrielbut they offered me a new phone for 200e, albeit you have to send yours, but you can keep toh and the battery10:32
ggabrieli didn't think it was a bad offer tbh10:32
ggabrielexcept that i'd be left without a phone :D10:32
till-I read something about 120e for the repair, excluding shipping10:33
ggabrielok, could be 120e10:33
ggabrielbut they didn't offer that10:33
chem|styou can sell teh spare battery for 50eur though^^10:33
till-:D10:33
ggabrielthey said "i'll add you to the list for when it's available"10:33
ggabrielor i can keep the spare battery :D10:33
till-I guess there are also no rumors about a new jolla phone in the next months right?10:33
ggabrieltill-: the rumours are that jolla won't make another phone any time soon10:34
ggabrieland that partners will do that instead10:34
chem|stI really don't know what you guys do with your phones... I had no spare battery since my first Nokia in 200210:34
ggabrielchem|st: but you build your own batteries10:34
ggabrielit's not fair10:34
chem|stnot that kind of batteries10:34
ggabrielalso, they do degrade 25% in the first year10:34
till-my battery is at 80%10:35
ggabrielif you use them10:35
till-after almost exactly 18 months of usage10:35
ggabrieli don't care any more as i charge the phone daily10:35
ggabrielbut it's good to have another [charged] battery for when you're out and about camping and so on10:35
till-i've bought a 10.000mAh power bank for such purposes :)10:36
ggabrielyou can give your phone a good 1wk with minimal services10:36
ggabrielok, yeah, i have a laptop with usb ports :P10:36
till-for camping? :)10:36
ggabrielwell, if you take a brick that's just a battery, i may as well get a slightly bigger brick that's a battery _and_ a laptop10:36
ggabrielor i just take my jolla with an extra battery :D10:37
chem|stggabriel: when I am out and about camping I have a car charger & probably do not care, with everything off but some calls I can probably survive a 4 day weekend without cahrging it10:37
ggabrielchem|st: that's another option10:37
ggabrielstill, the extra battery takes no space10:38
ggabrieland saves me the hassle10:38
ggabrieltbh, i used it once in the mountains while skiing10:38
chem|st10Ah that is ~4.5 charges that gives alot of camping^^10:38
ggabrielthe only caveat is that you have to remember to keep them relatively warm10:38
till-well I use it for a tablet and other phones as well10:38
till-and it's about the size of the jolla10:39
chem|stggabriel: I have to admit I once bought a spare battery but as I barely used it it degraded and died eventually10:39
chem|stI was thinking about getting a solar-powerbank10:39
ggabrielyeah, i guess the jolla is the first phone i don't use spares so much10:39
ggabrielthe n9 i couldn't ofc10:39
till-but you would need a big solar cell to have fun10:40
chem|sttill-: no you dont10:40
chem|stthe Jolla is 2.1Ah fully charged...10:40
till-well I had a cell slightly larger than the jolla and it has 200mA with perfect conditions10:41
till-when I connect my jolla to it the power consumption is still positive, according to hunger meter10:43
till-unless i switch everything of, than it's charging with 1/10-1/20 of the original charger's speed10:44
chem|stI am not talking TOH charger sizes...10:46
chem|st4W fits a commuter's bag10:46
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till-sure, but it a common solar-powerbank is not much bigger than TOH, I thought you were refering to one of those10:50
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chem|stI am referring to Changers, 4.4Ah powerbank with alternater integrated for their solarpannels11:08
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chem|stcan someone jump in please https://together.jolla.com/question/95490/jolla-phone-data-lost-because-disk-is-full/11:59
narchie3but its just a feature!12:00
narchiebalancing is hard12:00
chem|stshould be fine to leave it as long as the charger is connected right?12:01
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ggabrielchem|st: yes12:03
ggabrielbut i did hear about one case where the person saw a few errors in dmesg12:03
ggabrielessentially, they chose to factory reset12:03
chem|stthat is what he does not want, he wants at least to mount it once to save his data12:05
ggabrieli guess i mean that you should check dmesg while you're rebalancing just to confirm that it's working ok12:05
ggabrielworst case, of course, you lost your data12:06
ggabrielit happens to the best of us12:06
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chem|stggabriel: he is not balancing, that is just mounting12:08
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chem|stmaybe some quota come handy after all12:09
ggabrielsorry, didn't have time to read the whole post :(12:11
chem|stno btrfs junkies available?12:11
arnejMaybe ask in #btrfs ?12:11
arnejI'm sure there are btrfs junkies in there :)12:12
chem|stsure but I guess they are all, "upgrade your kernel"12:12
ggabriellol12:13
ggabrielthat's a valid guess12:13
fennekkiinstall gentoo update kernel12:18
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chem|stfennekki: I will probably never in my life touch gentoo (for myself) again!12:20
fennekkiloving the "again"12:21
chem|styeah, that claim does need experience with gentoo doesn't it!12:21
chem|stI'd rather slack than gentoo12:22
ggabrielfunny how gentoo is like marmaite (spelling?)12:22
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chem|stdoes it work to open a second recovery-shell to read logs?12:29
ggabrieluhm... no12:31
ggabrielthat comment is only valid if you're rebalancing12:31
ggabrielbecause it happens in the background12:31
ggabrielso you can always journalctl -f or something12:31
ggabrielbut i haven't checked if the recovery console comes with screen12:31
ggabrielso that may be an option12:31
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chem|stpita with that China certification failure... some guys are boiling hot...15:28
Stskeepsthings don't always go like in the movies15:29
Yanielcontext?15:30
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chem|stYaniel: Jolla is sending out emails to China indiegogo supporters about issues with getting the device certification15:32
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chem|stthey offer a refund or alternate shipping destination15:33
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Yanielbummer15:33
chem|stI guess it went something like, "Oh this is FOSS - denial - MUHAHAHA"15:34
ppdoes china still have e.g. their own wlan crypto?15:34
chem|stpp: they have all their own15:34
ppyour chipset doesn't support our crypto, fail.15:34
chem|stthey even have regulations for available services15:35
pptho i suppose the intel wifi is software enough to do that fine if necessary15:35
chem|st"You cannot suppress device encryption - denied - MUHAHAHA"15:36
ppbut that can be tricky, my zyxel ap got new software that checks for radars in the vicinity for 10 minutes if you use certain channels15:36
ppand that's for the EU15:36
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chem|stpp: yeah that is the 2015 ruleset some 2 idiots wrote, thats it for all ISM if it is not doing 10% TDS15:37
ppPRC, politically repressive country ;)15:37
pperk15:37
chem|stmy RC remote is all going nuts...15:38
chem|stif you cannot make sure that you are transmitting in between other transmissions you are forced to send less then 10% of the time15:39
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Sailor6988hi all15:42
Sailor6988whatsup is having contact sync problem, time and again15:48
Sailor6988the contact list gets empty under whatsup, although there are contacts stored on the phone, and don't get visible even after syncing whatsup.15:49
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attahSo.. anyone want to bet on if the tel://-link issue was fixed this time around?16:18
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Venemochem|st, do you maybe know how to properly install google play on the jolla?16:21
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chem|stVenemo: yes I do16:40
Venemochem|st: so what's the right way? I've tried to do what's in that together post, but it didn't work for me16:41
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chem|stso you installed just the 3 apk files?16:43
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chem|stVenemo: the old way was to copy /system too16:47
chem|stbut that did only work properly with a fresh and clean aliendalvik install iirc16:48
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Venemochem|st: I ended up doing a hard reset on my jolla (via the excellent recovery menu thing)16:49
chem|sthttp://jollafin.blogspot.de/2013/11/play-store-for-jolla.html16:50
chem|stis what I did16:50
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chem|stthe goo.im is down but I am sure you find another suitable gapps jb file16:51
chem|strelated t.m.o http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=9194216:51
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Venemothank you chem|st17:04
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Venemothank you chem|st - what kind of gapps jb file should I search for?17:05
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attahI get the feeling that my pet bug has flown under the radar permanently :(17:21
Stskeepscan't wait to be more open source17:21
Stskeeps:P17:21
locusflets see how much more :)17:23
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Stskeepssufficient to not be embarassed about it :)17:24
* Stskeeps goes grab a beer17:24
attahthat would sure be nice17:25
attahany word currently on how open?17:26
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r0kk3rzwait a few months until 2.0 and all shall be revealed i guess17:39
r0kk3rzbut having open UI bits would be awesome, then we can do real things like patch in group chat support in the messaging client17:39
TemeVr0kk3rz: it looks to me that group chat support can be patched in already17:40
r0kk3rzwell, hacked in but not submitted upstream17:41
TemeVmiddleware is open, it can be upstreamed17:41
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r0kk3rztrue, i thought most of the middleware supported it already, could be wrong though17:41
r0kk3rzi just know its something thats been on the list for some time17:42
r0kk3rzsame with voip support17:42
TemeVyeah, middleware supports it, but afaik it is not complete on middleware side either17:42
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TemeVAnd actually group chat is somewhat working already17:43
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chem|stStskeeps: +117:50
chem|stVenemo: any newer than that linked should do17:51
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VenemoStskeeps: +1+118:07
Venemochem|st: ok. thanks18:07
Venemohave a nice evening!18:07
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attahApparently i have been living under a rock.. i totally missed google's project soli19:34
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chem|stattah: if that counts as living under a rock... I do not follow google progress since I learned that android is really bad and google became a monster... so I must be living under a mountain19:49
ortylpchem|st: hi19:50
attahhehe :) but this is hardware... so it can't be *that* bad19:50
ortylpchem|st: have you got CalDAV and CardDav in Jolla working with radicale?19:51
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chem|stortylp: radicale no... but I had issues with certs blocking buteo19:56
chem|stortylp: have you set the base_prefix?19:58
ortylpchem|st: yes, I did, or at least I think so19:59
chem|stcheck that again maybe, that seems to be the most common error why davdroid does not work19:59
ortylpchem|st: CalDAV seemed to work, but probably not reliably enough, CardDAV did not work at all19:59
ortylpchem|st: I could not get davdroid to work properly for CardDAV either20:00
chem|stI am scared of any contact sync stuff, it is always a mess20:00
ortylpchem|st: both services (CalDAV and CardDAV) have been detected, but only CalDAV did something20:01
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chem|styeah had that with owncloud too.. thought it was because the server side is empty...20:01
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ortylpchem|st: Till now I was always using one phone as a "single source" of my data, backuped through PC as a file...20:03
Nokiuskimmoli: to big files get a 503 (Time out)20:03
kimmolihow big?20:03
ortylpchem|st: I thought that these very old standards should be finally implemented and work reliably...20:03
Nokiuskimmoli: ~1,5GB20:04
ortylpchem|st: If you ever get these to work please ping me and let me know...20:04
chem|stortylp: Jolla does not even export vcfs properly to backup what do you expect... it is probably one sailor doing everything sync and userdata related on his own...20:05
chem|stortylp: will do20:05
ortylpchem|st: thx20:06
chem|stortylp: don't count on me... I backup my contacts after each change by hand20:07
chem|stnighlty backup of $user-data to server20:07
ortylpchem|st: :D yep... I know this method too well...20:07
chem|stortylp: I will be all LVM as soon as I have the tablet20:07
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Nokiuskimmoli: may I ahve to try when it kicks in20:08
kimmoli?20:09
HtheBsorry for being offtopic: does any of you have knowledge about modems, routers and ISP's?20:09
ortylpchem|st: in the last months I am out of the game... I am not even betatesting sailfishos updates for Jolla...  We'll see if/how the tablet works...20:09
ortylpHtheB: only basic one, what is the problem?20:10
Nokiuskimmoli: the 50320:10
Nokiuswhich size I get a 50320:10
Nokiussince gist is made for sharing text files and I use it to share other stuff20:11
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kimmoliok, if i just redirect to browser if > 200k ?, something > 80k starts to get slow20:12
HtheBortylp: check pm20:12
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Nokiuskimmoli: ok20:21
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Nokiuskimmoli: how about value: (thisGist.size / (1024)).toFixed(2) + " kB" for GistInfo.qml20:24
kimmoliok20:24
Nokiuskimmoli: I should start to fork it :P20:25
kimmoli;) that "kB" code is there already, not in that place though20:26
Nokiuskimmoli: hum so if the gist is bigger then > 200k will it show on  the preview a oops file is to big press here to see it online?20:27
Nokius:D20:27
kimmolisomething like that20:27
Nokiuskimmoli: :)20:28
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Aciidwhen is jolla tablet?20:37
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DrainBamagedJuly perhaps? I asked the Internets though :D20:38
Liekeend of next month20:38
Liekehttps://blog.jolla.com/jolla-iteration-4/20:39
narchiebut not shipping to china20:39
narchiemade in china20:39
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Nokiusdid Jolla toled which display the tablet has now? iirc they wanted to tell this20:43
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Nokiuswhile speaking about the blog20:46
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NokiusStskeeps: will we see again some Hack'n'Play post on the blog looong time since last or are u busy with the tablet atm?20:46
r0kk3rzyeah it is a little retarded how they wont let a device made in china get sold in china20:47
r0kk3rzbut thats not jollas fault, thats the PRC governments fault20:47
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xalbarchhey there20:57
xalbarchdoes anyone know of some open source jolla apps to download for inspiration?20:57
* DrainBamaged looks to the bottom of his glass for inspiration...20:58
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SfietKonstantinWxalbarch: what kind of inspiration do you need ?20:59
SfietKonstantinWgo for coderus's apps20:59
r0kk3rzmost things on openrepos are opensource21:00
r0kk3rzjust check the description for a github link21:01
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xalbarchI was originally looking for the source code to the Spotra GPS tracker, but didn't find anything on google21:02
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prometoyshi, i run "rm -rf /opt/alien/*", but it seemed that there where links to /bin /home etc21:17
prometoyshow i can reinstall sailfish?21:18
Nokiusprometoys: there is a recovery mode but I assume u may since with someone how went true this before so fellas here know how to help u21:21
prometoysi tested once recovery mode. but when large parts of / are removed, does this still work? is there a way to "reflash" the jolla phone?21:23
TemeVprometoys: there is no actual reflash, but the recovery restores the snapshot21:25
Nokiusprometoys: reflash like N900 or N9 is not possible due to some regulations with the chip vendor :(21:25
prometoysTemeV: thanks. so its safe to reboot to recovery and then afterwards i have a working phone again??21:26
Nokiusprometoys: say a bit here may someone has an idea how to fix the issue if not only Care can help u21:26
TemeVprometoys: yes, You can't destroy the snapshot with "usual" commands21:26
TemeVif you're feeling adventorous you can mount the snapshot and copy missing stuff back21:27
TemeVand then update everything from repos to right versions21:27
TemeV(I don't know if this really works, just made that up) :)21:27
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prometoys_sorry, was disconnected21:31
prometoys_Temev, Nokius: ok, i will read the manual and try it21:31
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r0kk3rzwhen recovery modeing, make sure you put in your jolla account in the out-of-box- setup21:55
r0kk3rzand immediately update21:55
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prometoys_TemeV, Nokius: It worked, its empty, totally empty, but it works again... Running the update marathon22:06
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