| *** ChanServ sets mode: +o sailbot | 06:23 | |
| rainemak | good morning | 06:58 |
|---|---|---|
| b100dian[m] | Morning! | 06:59 |
| rainemak | #startmeeting Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 5th September 2024 | 07:00 |
| sailbot | Meeting started Thu Sep 5 07:00:19 2024 UTC. The chair is rainemak. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 07:00 |
| sailbot | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic. | 07:00 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 5th September 2024)" | 07:00 | |
| rainemak | #info Meeting information and agenda can be found here: | 07:00 |
| rainemak | #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/community-meeting-on-5th-september-2024/19811 | 07:00 |
| rainemak | I am the meeting's chairperson today, and will be doing my best to keep time and order. Please respect the timings and bee-hive. | 07:00 |
| rainemak | #topic Brief introduction (5 min). Please prefix your name/handle with #info | 07:00 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to "Brief introduction (5 min). Please prefix your name/handle with #info (Meeting topic: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 5th September 2024)" | 07:00 | |
| ExTechOp | Good Morning, everyone! | 07:00 |
| ExTechOp | #info Otto Mäkelä, community | 07:00 |
| rainemak | good morning ExTechOp | 07:00 |
| rainemak | #info Raine Mäkeläinen, Jolla | 07:00 |
| b100dian[m] | #info Vlad G., community | 07:01 |
| direc85 | Good morning! | 07:01 |
| direc85 | #info Matti Viljanen, Sailor @ Jolla | 07:02 |
| rainemak | Welcome direc85! Nice to have you with us. | 07:03 |
| Thaodan | #info Björn Bidar, Sailor @ Jolla | 07:03 |
| direc85 | Thank you, great to be board! | 07:04 |
| b100dian[m] | That's great news on many levels:) | 07:04 |
| rainemak | Welcome everybody! We have two topics today. | 07:05 |
| rainemak | Let's get started | 07:05 |
| rainemak | #topic Is Jolla C2 new telephony stack going to be open source, including VoLTE/5G? (10 mins -- asked by vlagged) | 07:05 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to "Is Jolla C2 new telephony stack going to be open source, including VoLTE/5G? (10 mins -- asked by vlagged) (Meeting topic: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 5th September 2024)" | 07:05 | |
| rainemak | #info <vlagged> Some details about the topic: The “Jolla C2 Community Phone | 07:05 |
| rainemak | #info <vlagged> deliveries 3” thread starts with the mention of a new Android 13+ | 07:05 |
| rainemak | #info <vlagged> telephony stack and the recent messages there asked for support | 07:05 |
| rainemak | #info <vlagged> testing the VoLTE compatibility. As the previous VoLTE | 07:05 |
| rainemak | #info <vlagged> implementation was proprietary, I would like to know if the next | 07:05 |
| rainemak | #info <vlagged> one will have a brighter future and be open sourced. The next best | 07:05 |
| rainemak | #info <vlagged> thing - will packages be available to community ports? Thanks! | 07:05 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> Jolla C2 is a unisoc device. For VoLTE this means that ofono | 07:06 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> vendor plugin will be for unisoc hardware adaptation. Similarly as | 07:06 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> there is that qti plugin. Whether it is then open sourced eventually | 07:06 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> or not is more complex question as there's a vendor dependency. | 07:06 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> Let's make first a solid VoLTE for Jolla C2. | 07:06 |
| pvuorela | (hi on my part too!, missed the introduction it seems) | 07:06 |
| piggz[m] | morning | 07:06 |
| rainemak | pvuorela, no worry | 07:06 |
| piggz[m] | #info piggz community porter | 07:06 |
| rainemak | morning piggz[m] | 07:06 |
| dcaliste | #info Damien Caliste, community | 07:07 |
| Thaodan | Just follow up with #info and you're good to go | 07:07 |
| dcaliste | Sorry to be late... | 07:07 |
| rainemak | morning dcaliste ... no worry, we have plenty of time | 07:07 |
| Thaodan | A wizard is never late, he just arrives at the right time | 07:07 |
| b100dian[m] | Ok, I think this was also partially answered by mal on the forums.. | 07:08 |
| piggz[m] | ill just chip in with the volte support on the volla x23 community support. excellent work by notkit to make a mediatek ofono binder plugin that -should- work on all android12 based mediatek devices | 07:08 |
| rainemak | b100dian[m], yeap... let's link that answer here as well | 07:08 |
| b100dian[m] | The vendor dependency means you also have acces to vendor source code? | 07:09 |
| Thaodan | Doesn't have to be, you can also try to hook into the blob | 07:09 |
| b100dian[m] | https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/sailfish-community-news-29th-august-2024-c2-update/19793/7 | 07:10 |
| rainemak | #info The answer partially covered already in the forum | 07:10 |
| rainemak | #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/sailfish-community-news-29th-august-2024-c2-update/19793/7 | 07:10 |
| b100dian[m] | But how could this hooking impact the license? | 07:10 |
| rainemak | b100dian[m], yes, for Jolla C2 we have full source code access | 07:10 |
| b100dian[m] | @piggz So Mtk is now the better chipset:) | 07:11 |
| Thaodan | Are the vendor sources for volla x23 open? | 07:12 |
| piggz[m] | well, its actually pretty good yeah ... also, pinephone does volte natively :) | 07:12 |
| piggz[m] | Thaodan: not sure about that | 07:12 |
| rainemak | b100dian[m], first things first, let's make it first work. | 07:13 |
| rainemak | implementation is actually proceeding nicely | 07:13 |
| Thaodan | OK so the situation is similar as with the C2 from what it sounds. | 07:14 |
| b100dian[m] | Agreed. Can't wait for that round of OSS repos though.. | 07:14 |
| Thaodan | For Sony we only have blobs obviously. But at least they are generic Qti blobs. | 07:14 |
| rainemak | Next one is a nice topic, shall we move on | 07:15 |
| rainemak | b100dian[m], I think your topic is covered | 07:15 |
| b100dian[m] | Ok with me, yes | 07:15 |
| rainemak | #topic Replacing device lock maximum attempts with attempt delays (10 mins -- asked by pvuorela) | 07:15 |
| rainemak | #info <pvuorela> The device lock settings has had configurable maximum attempts. | 07:15 |
| rainemak | #info <pvuorela> When that is reached, the device is put into locked state. The | 07:15 |
| rainemak | #info <pvuorela> setting has been vague on the UI, not fully explaining what it | 07:15 |
| rainemak | #info <pvuorela> does, and also dangerous as unlock attempts might happen | 07:15 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to "Replacing device lock maximum attempts with attempt delays (10 mins -- asked by pvuorela) (Meeting topic: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 5th September 2024)" | 07:15 | |
| rainemak | #info <pvuorela> unintended in a pocket, or by a toddler, etc. It hasn’t protected | 07:15 |
| rainemak | #info <pvuorela> the sensitive data too well either as nothing gets done to that. | 07:15 |
| rainemak | #info <pvuorela> So instead of configurable maximum attempts, we are considering | 07:15 |
| rainemak | #info <pvuorela> adding pauses on retries after too many failed attempts in short | 07:15 |
| rainemak | #info <pvuorela> time. | 07:15 |
| rainemak | This is more like a discussion item for each and everybody | 07:16 |
| pvuorela | yea, so created the item get some sentiment about such a change. | 07:16 |
| Brian_ | Is there an Archive of this discussion for those of us how joined a few mins late ? | 07:17 |
| pvuorela | there's been a bunch of 'help, my device got locked' items on tjc already, wouldn't like to see more of those :) | 07:17 |
| rainemak | Does anybody know what happens when maximum attempt count is reached? | 07:17 |
| ExTechOp | (sounds a bit like the classic iPhone message "your phone is locked, you can try unlocking in 126144000 seconds", which is 4 years or so) | 07:17 |
| rainemak | Brian_, yes... both from this one and past years | 07:18 |
| Thaodan | I think it's not to bad, it matches up what's happening if enter your password wrong on your computer for example | 07:18 |
| rainemak | Brian_, https://irclogs.sailfishos.org/meetings/sailfishos-meeting/ | 07:18 |
| direc85 | I've used the device lock max attempts because I thought that reaching the limit would erase the home partition, but that is not the case. | 07:19 |
| Brian_ | @rainemak ..... thanks. | 07:19 |
| rainemak | and welcome Brian_ | 07:19 |
| rainemak | pvuorela, I don't like either those 'help, my device got locked' cases | 07:20 |
| rainemak | and some may have device lock max attempts enabled by accident | 07:21 |
| pvuorela | i guess good thing here is that i'm not hearing much objections on the idea :) | 07:21 |
| b100dian[m] | Now with qwerty you could ask them to enter a given word to prove they are human | 07:22 |
| dcaliste | Yeh, I think that a reasonable 30 s to 1 min between attempts after some failure would block any brute force. | 07:22 |
| Thaodan | I guess the option for max attempts could be changed into something like after X attempts the device shuts off | 07:22 |
| Thaodan | so that the encrypted data is safe and can't be attacked | 07:22 |
| rainemak | Thaodan, that could be an option as well | 07:23 |
| Thaodan | warm boot attack | 07:23 |
| pvuorela | that would be already better too. | 07:23 |
| rainemak | but attempt delay is something that we should look at... I mean in any case | 07:24 |
| pvuorela | yes. | 07:24 |
| Thaodan | I consider that quite important for the political minded | 07:24 |
| Thaodan | it helps in cases where autorities try to force access into a user data | 07:24 |
| Thaodan | e.g. a political activist | 07:24 |
| direc85 | Bt it still doesn't prevent dumping the partition and brute-forcing the password. This was demonstrated in the forum if I'm not mistaken... I'll try to find the thread. | 07:26 |
| direc85 | https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/how-to-unlock-the-encryption-of-your-home-if-you-dont-know-your-lock-code-bruteforce/3004/8 | 07:27 |
| Thaodan | It doesn't of course since we can't lock the bootloader on most devices since they don't support custom bootloader keys | 07:27 |
| Thaodan | only a better pin/secret can help with that. | 07:28 |
| Thaodan | and the possibilty to stop attackers from booting custom initramfs | 07:29 |
| rainemak | we're a bit overtime already | 07:29 |
| Thaodan | yeah lets move on | 07:29 |
| rainemak | I think conclusion is that there are no strong feelings against pvuorela's proposal | 07:30 |
| rainemak | #info No strong comments / feelings against pvuorela's proposal | 07:31 |
| rainemak | #topic Open PR discussion (5 mins -- asked by Jolla) | 07:31 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to "Open PR discussion (5 mins -- asked by Jolla) (Meeting topic: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 5th September 2024)" | 07:31 | |
| Brian_ | @rainemak No objection. | 07:32 |
| rainemak | flypig started opening esr91 PRs | 07:32 |
| rainemak | which is nice! | 07:32 |
| rubdos[m] | direc85, congrats | 07:33 |
| direc85 | rubdos[m], thank you :) | 07:34 |
| rainemak | ^ it's not really started... those are all open already :-) | 07:34 |
| piggz[m] | im told the native mesa support for gecko is no longer working on the PP/PPP, i havnt checked myself yet, but ill have to chip in with them! | 07:34 |
| rainemak | piggz[m], I heard as well... Emulator is an option to debug native adaptation | 07:35 |
| piggz[m] | ah, true | 07:35 |
| Thaodan | Will check how it works with virtio | 07:35 |
| Thaodan | Virtualbox isn't the same as it doesn't use mesa I think. | 07:36 |
| Thaodan | Virtualbox/Emulator | 07:36 |
| rainemak | Sounds that we do not have open PRs to discuss | 07:36 |
| direc85 | I've been testing the esr91 builds and they are in quite good shape already. Very impressive! | 07:36 |
| dcaliste | Yes, it's already a great achievement from flypig and the other contributors. | 07:37 |
| rainemak | Thaodan, I believe that the issue is similar that piggz[m] fixed in the past for native ports.... back then the issue was also visible in emulator | 07:37 |
| rainemak | I'll give 3mins more for this | 07:37 |
| rainemak | or 2mins :-) | 07:38 |
| piggz[m] | when does the 102 port start? :D | 07:38 |
| direc85 | I gouldn't get esr91 start in emulator, didn't go deep into that (yet). | 07:38 |
| Thaodan | rainemak: ok that could be similar then. However mesa would be closer to native ports. In any case that's more a topic for #sailfishos-porters | 07:38 |
| rainemak | #topic General discussion (10 mins) | 07:40 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to "General discussion (10 mins) (Meeting topic: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 5th September 2024)" | 07:40 | |
| ExTechOp | Do we have new news of SFOS availability for Sony Xperia 10 IV and V devices? We're are past the August 2024 time for the SFOS paid components originally mentioned at the love-fest. | 07:41 |
| rainemak | ExTechOp, not other than free version available asap :-) | 07:42 |
| rainemak | ExTechOp, there will be hiccups and issues | 07:42 |
| rainemak | we'll openly inform regarding known issues | 07:43 |
| ExTechOp | Is there supposed to be something at https://shop.jolla.com/downloads/ for them, the latest I see there is the Xperia 10 III? | 07:43 |
| rainemak | We'll inform | 07:44 |
| rainemak | Yesterday we updated on the Jolla C2 https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/jolla-c2-community-phone-deliveries/19468/187 | 07:44 |
| ExTechOp | What I'm trying to ask, since the shop doesn't even seem to have the free trial version available, am I doing something wrong? | 07:48 |
| rainemak | ExTechOp, no, you're not... we're working to get free version available asap | 07:49 |
| ExTechOp | Okay then. It is somewhat confusing that https://docs.sailfishos.org/Support/Supported_Devices/ lists them, and links to Jolla Shop which doesn't. | 07:51 |
| rainemak | ExTechOp, I see... I'll write a note and an internal ticket | 07:52 |
| rainemak | let's schedule next meeting | 07:52 |
| rainemak | #topic Next meeting time and date (5 mins) | 07:52 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to "Next meeting time and date (5 mins) (Meeting topic: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 5th September 2024)" | 07:52 | |
| rainemak | Proposing Thursday 19th September at 07:00am UTC | 07:52 |
| ExTechOp | Works4me. | 07:53 |
| dcaliste | That's ok. | 07:54 |
| direc85 | Works for me | 07:54 |
| Brian_ | May I ask a question ? | 07:56 |
| Thaodan | either ask now if it's something short | 07:57 |
| rainemak | Brian_, of course | 07:57 |
| Brian_ | Is this a regular group ? I am new /here/ although a Jolla user since the C1. | 07:57 |
| Thaodan | or ask next time in the meeting by posting in the forum | 07:57 |
| rainemak | Thaodan, let Brian_ ask | 07:57 |
| rainemak | Brian_, yes, this meeting takes place bi-weekly given that there are no other overlapping events or such | 07:58 |
| rainemak | Brian_, there's also #sailfishos channel on the same irc server. That can be used for generic discussion as well | 07:58 |
| Brian_ | Great. Thanks. I'll start reading archive and will join again on time. | 07:59 |
| rainemak | and #sailfishos-porters channel is for hw adaptations | 07:59 |
| Thaodan | See you next time then | 08:00 |
| Brian_ | Will do. | 08:00 |
| Thaodan | If you can't make it you can also follow this meeting on Telegram | 08:00 |
| Thaodan | https://t.me/joinchat/AAAAAFcbasJX67Fu-aGxxQ | 08:00 |
| rainemak | it's always nice to see new people | 08:00 |
| rainemak | #info Next meeting will be held on Thursday 19th September 2024 at 07:00am UTC: 2024-09-19T0700Z | 08:00 |
| rainemak | #endmeeting | 08:00 |
| sailbot | Meeting ended Thu Sep 5 08:00:53 2024 UTC. | 08:00 |
| sailbot | Minutes: https://irclogs.sailfishos.org/meetings/sailfishos-meeting/2024/sailfishos-meeting.2024-09-05-07.00.html | 08:00 |
| sailbot | Minutes (text): https://irclogs.sailfishos.org/meetings/sailfishos-meeting/2024/sailfishos-meeting.2024-09-05-07.00.txt | 08:00 |
| sailbot | Log: https://irclogs.sailfishos.org/meetings/sailfishos-meeting/2024/sailfishos-meeting.2024-09-05-07.00.log.html | 08:00 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to "Next meeting will be held on Thursday 5th September 2024 at 07:00am UTC: 2024-09-05T0700Z" | 08:00 | |
| rainemak | and Brian_ here are the logs from this meeting... There logs will soon appear in forum post | 08:01 |
| rainemak | https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/community-meeting-on-5th-september-2024/19811/5 <= here | 08:02 |
| rainemak | I'll create soonish a community meeting topic for the announcements category | 08:02 |
| ExTechOp | Thanks everyone! | 08:05 |
| dcaliste | Thank you, enjo your day. | 08:09 |
| Brian_ | Thanks everyone. | 08:10 |
| *** amccarthy is now known as Guest2639 | 20:41 | |
| *** amccarthy_ is now known as amccarthy | 20:41 | |
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