| *** ChanServ sets mode: +o rainemak | 15:53 | |
| ExTechOp | Hello, everyone! | 15:55 |
|---|---|---|
| rainemak | Hello ExTechOp | 15:57 |
| rainemak | #startmeeting Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 25th September 2025 | 16:00 |
| sailbot | Meeting started Thu Sep 25 16:00:03 2025 UTC. The chair is rainemak. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 16:00 |
| sailbot | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic. | 16:00 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 25th September 2025)" | 16:00 | |
| rainemak | #info Meeting information and agenda can be found here: | 16:00 |
| rainemak | #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/community-meeting-on-25th-september-2025/24781 | 16:00 |
| rainemak | I am the meeting's chairperson today, and will be doing my best to keep time and order. Please respect the timings and bee-hive. | 16:00 |
| rainemak | #topic Brief introduction (5 min). Please prefix your name/handle with #info | 16:00 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to "Brief introduction (5 min). Please prefix your name/handle with #info (Meeting topic: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 25th September 2025)" | 16:00 | |
| ExTechOp | #info Otto Mäkelä, community | 16:00 |
| rainemak | Missed few seconds... I have usually on time on this, please feel free say about the delay. | 16:00 |
| direc85[m] | #info Matti Viljanen, Jolla | 16:01 |
| rainemak | usually been on time | 16:01 |
| Cryx[m] | Hello... Cryx - Community... | 16:01 |
| rainemak | #info Raine Mäkeläinen, Jolla | 16:01 |
| Venty[m] | # Info Venty - Community | 16:01 |
| FireFly | #info FireFly - Community | 16:02 |
| rainemak | We have five topics today. Let's try to respect requested time slots so that we can cover them all. | 16:02 |
| Cryx[m] | Sorry, forgot the #info Cryx, Community | 16:02 |
| rainemak | I think did not extend any of them. For one I chose the longer one. | 16:02 |
| rainemak | I'm very pleased to see so many topics. Let's stay on this course. | 16:04 |
| rainemak | #topic The future for Xperia 10 series devices beyond the IV and V (5 mins -- PeegeeTips) | 16:05 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to "The future for Xperia 10 series devices beyond the IV and V (5 mins -- PeegeeTips) (Meeting topic: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 25th September 2025)" | 16:05 | |
| rainemak | #info <PeegeeTips> Is the J3 a new direction for Jolla; moving to selling | 16:05 |
| rainemak | #info <PeegeeTips> factory-flashed and bootloader locked devices? | 16:05 |
| rainemak | #info <PeegeeTips> It has been suggested by Xiaomi that they’re ending their | 16:05 |
| rainemak | #info <PeegeeTips> bootloader unlocking function to maintain compliance with EU | 16:05 |
| rainemak | #info <PeegeeTips> regs in the digital safety act. Does Jolla consider this a | 16:05 |
| rainemak | #info <PeegeeTips> threat to their existing business model, such that they are | 16:05 |
| rainemak | #info <PeegeeTips> moving away from selling device licences to pre-flashed | 16:05 |
| rainemak | #info <PeegeeTips> devices? I ask as Sony continues to release new versions of the | 16:05 |
| rainemak | #info <PeegeeTips> 10 series, and they remain well built and and affordable | 16:05 |
| rainemak | #info <PeegeeTips> mid-range handsets: | 16:05 |
| rainemak | #link https://www.gsmarena.com/sony_xperia_10_vii-review-2879.php | 16:05 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> Good question but difficult to give you a good answer. We have not | 16:05 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> said that we are moving away from downloadable & flashable | 16:05 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> Sailfish OS images. At this point, we do not have an update | 16:05 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> regarding the next downloadable & flashable Sailfish OS image. | 16:05 |
| rainemak | Based on forum comments it looks that Fairphone could plausible be a good candidate for the future. No decisions made. | 16:06 |
| ExTechOp | Has any contact been made with the Fairphone people? I understand the hardware spec is pretty open. | 16:07 |
| rainemak | I think we, as Jolla, shall think how do we enable AppSupport for some community ports so that it would be a business for us. Trust me, have spend quite a bit on tinkering that. | 16:08 |
| rainemak | ExTechOp, unfortunately I rather not open those discussions. | 16:08 |
| ExTechOp | ;-D | 16:09 |
| rainemak | We have a good communication with Sony Open Device Program. | 16:09 |
| ExTechOp | Though, not good enough to have them push new firmware? | 16:10 |
| rainemak | ExTechOp, it's not like that. | 16:10 |
| rainemak | Like said, let's try to respect reserved time slots. We can come to topics that were left at the end in Generic discussion. | 16:11 |
| rainemak | let's move on | 16:12 |
| rainemak | #topic Speed up a Device (5mins -- Cryx) | 16:12 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to "Speed up a Device (5mins -- Cryx) (Meeting topic: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 25th September 2025)" | 16:12 | |
| rainemak | #info Plausible substitute Seven.of.nine | 16:12 |
| rainemak | #info <Cryx> There is that thread in the forum for some time now, and I wonder if | 16:12 |
| rainemak | #info <Cryx> anyone from Jolla ever looked a this. I also feel the handling of | 16:12 |
| rainemak | #info <Cryx> SFOS is sometimes slow and would like to see some things happening | 16:12 |
| rainemak | #info <Cryx> faster. And as these things seem to be tied into the system and force | 16:12 |
| rainemak | #info <Cryx> a device to (re-) act slow I ask myself why… | 16:12 |
| rainemak | #info <Cryx> | 16:12 |
| rainemak | #info <Cryx> I will sadly be on work travel that day so I don’t know if could make | 16:12 |
| rainemak | #info <Cryx> it into the meeting (nevertheless I will try) , but I missed to point | 16:12 |
| rainemak | #info <Cryx> to this topic already three or four times. On the other hand | 16:12 |
| rainemak | #info <Cryx> everything relevant is already said in the linked thread, so the main | 16:12 |
| rainemak | #info <Cryx> questions are: | 16:12 |
| rainemak | #info <Cryx> | 16:12 |
| rainemak | #info <Cryx> - Is Jolla aware of this topic? | 16:12 |
| rainemak | #info <Cryx> - Is there anything that stands against bringing such speed up tweaks | 16:12 |
| rainemak | #info <Cryx> into the system with a SFOS update for all users? | 16:12 |
| rainemak | #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/speed-up-a-device-by-system-tweaks-in-the-qml-files/19769 | 16:12 |
| abr | The one for the notes app could be a PR now :) | 16:13 |
| rainemak | ^ PRs or generic please | 16:13 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> Yes, we aware of this topic and we understand reasoning that you have. | 16:14 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> Practical thing that stands in between of implementing this is | 16:14 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> resourcing and time. When done properly, we'd review (evaluate) and | 16:14 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> verify each change on each officially supported devices. Usually | 16:14 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> during review there would be discussion whether this or that look | 16:14 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> better. Then we'd repeat after plausible adjustments. The whole | 16:14 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> process takes much more time than sed'ing changes to the device. | 16:14 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> Implementing this so that we'd have device spefic variants is no go. | 16:14 |
| rainemak | I'm all for reducing animation times but it takes time. | 16:15 |
| rainemak | 5 mins for a slot is definitely too sort. | 16:17 |
| rainemak | slot == topic | 16:17 |
| rainemak | Yes, this is acknowledged. Anything to add? | 16:18 |
| rainemak | 2mins extra | 16:18 |
| rainemak | more like a minute | 16:18 |
| Cryx[m] | No, as most was said in the topic. | 16:19 |
| Cryx[m] | But agreed, that device specific changes are not good... | 16:19 |
| rainemak | Cryx[m], device specific things are extremely time consuming to handle | 16:19 |
| Cryx[m] | Fully understandable... | 16:20 |
| rainemak | Like said, we can continue random discussion on Generic topic at the end | 16:20 |
| rainemak | moving on | 16:20 |
| rainemak | #topic Cell Broadcast alerts (5 mins -- asked by CLMA31) | 16:20 |
| rainemak | #info <CLMA31> There has been multiple reports that cell broadcast alerts aren’t | 16:20 |
| rainemak | #info <CLMA31> working: Cell Broadcast alerts (Germany) - #165 by davidrasch. Is | 16:20 |
| rainemak | #info <CLMA31> this known problem and if so is there any idea how to mitigate this | 16:20 |
| rainemak | #info <CLMA31> problem? | 16:20 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to "Cell Broadcast alerts (5 mins -- asked by CLMA31) (Meeting topic: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 25th September 2025)" | 16:20 | |
| rainemak | #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/cell-broadcast-alerts-germany/13528/165 | 16:20 |
| rainemak | We need to check are AIDL and HIDL based devices implemented right. So, it is also | 16:20 |
| rainemak | that much device adaptation specific. Based on discussion comments this could be | 16:20 |
| rainemak | AIDL related issue. To be confirmed. | 16:20 |
| mal | it's difficult to test since those alerts happen rarely | 16:21 |
| rainemak | Do we have mal on the line? Maybe he have some ideas / thoughts? | 16:21 |
| piggz[m] | I can confirm not getting UK alerts, using my Volla port and the binder driver ... no logs unfortunately | 16:21 |
| mal | piggz[m]: aidl or hidl? | 16:22 |
| piggz[m] | hidl i think | 16:22 |
| abr | last I heard you had to subscribe to the right broadcast channels | 16:22 |
| mal | yes, that needs to be checked if that works correctly | 16:22 |
| rainemak | piggz[m] and abr , nice to see you both | 16:22 |
| mal | unfortunately I haven't heard anyone would have gotten debug ofono logs from those alert tests | 16:23 |
| piggz[m] | :) .. i forgot the time, and just sawthe meeting happened! .. you should make a way to subscribe to a calendar invite for the meetings | 16:23 |
| rainemak | maybe just maybe, we could try to simulate thing for example with local HÄKE (emergency center) | 16:23 |
| abr | there's an ics calendar on the sfos wiki! | 16:23 |
| piggz[m] | oh cool | 16:24 |
| rainemak | abr, could you paste the link please | 16:24 |
| rainemak | use #link prefix | 16:24 |
| rainemak | please | 16:24 |
| abr | #link https://docs.sailfishos.org/Support/community.ics | 16:24 |
| rainemak | +1 | 16:24 |
| rainemak | abr, kiitos :-) | 16:25 |
| abr | we should put that in the room topic maybe? | 16:25 |
| rainemak | let's do so | 16:25 |
| rainemak | it's time to move forward | 16:25 |
| abr | sorry for the distraction! | 16:25 |
| rainemak | #topic Android apps mobile data connection problems (10 mins -- asked by CLMA31) | 16:25 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to "Android apps mobile data connection problems (10 mins -- asked by CLMA31) (Meeting topic: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 25th September 2025)" | 16:25 | |
| rainemak | #info <CLMA31> It seems that there has been a lot of discussion in history related | 16:25 |
| rainemak | #info <CLMA31> to the data connection problems inside the AAS. Has Jolla been able | 16:25 |
| rainemak | #info <CLMA31> to identify main reason for the problem and is there what kind of | 16:25 |
| rainemak | #info <CLMA31> development plan related to that? Will 5.1 update bring | 16:25 |
| rainemak | #info <CLMA31>improvements to the situation? If I have understood correctly | 16:25 |
| rainemak | #info <CLMA31> sometimes the problems occur if you switch between WLAN and mobile | 16:25 |
| rainemak | #info <CLMA31> data and sometime the problem occurs randomly. As many people | 16:25 |
| rainemak | #info <CLMA31> still rely to some Android apps and new comers even more, reliable | 16:25 |
| rainemak | #info <CLMA31> internet connection is quite crucial. Here are some topics from | 16:26 |
| rainemak | #info <CLMA31> the forum I found: | 16:26 |
| rainemak | #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/4-6-0-13-xperia-10-iii-android-apps-mobile-data-connectivity-worse-then-ever/19311/34 | 16:26 |
| rainemak | #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/no-mobile-internet-with-android-apps-on-c2/20586/75 | 16:26 |
| rainemak | #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/release-notes-tampella-5-0-0-68/23427/22 | 16:26 |
| rainemak | #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/release-notes-tampella-5-0-0-70-jolla-c2-only/24477/19 | 16:26 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> Thank you for bring this up. Tracked already on several fronts. | 16:26 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> There seems to be something operator specific involved but we have | 16:26 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> not yet figured what triggers / causes it. | 16:26 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> That said, we have a different kind of implementation approach in | 16:26 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> internal testing which is similar to the approch that we had years | 16:26 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> ago (maybe it was around XA2, Xperia 10, Xperia 10 II). A lot of | 16:26 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> things have changed since. | 16:26 |
| rainemak | If this approach is good, we target to roll it for Jolla C2 5.0. The change is | 16:27 |
| rainemak | not yet ported for older devices, and frankly I don't have an effort estimate | 16:27 |
| rainemak | for porting and testing it for all devices. I don't know the internals of the | 16:27 |
| rainemak | implementation but it may have AIDL vs HIDL differences. | 16:27 |
| rainemak | So far this new approach has been rock solid on my Jolla C2 device. To be said | 16:27 |
| rainemak | that I am mostly testing mobile data only as that caused most issues for me. | 16:27 |
| rainemak | IMO AppSupport do not need to know exact connection type. Root cause looks to be somewhere in the mobile operator data. How it is coming and what bits it provides. For some people, they do not have any issues and for example I had it quite frequently. | 16:30 |
| rainemak | As we didn't quite figure the root cause, we took the alternative path. | 16:30 |
| rainemak | It'll be far better already. | 16:30 |
| abr | and more stable across different devices | 16:31 |
| direc85[m] | AppSupport should be aware of if it's on WLAN or mobile data, that affects some apps' data usage. | 16:31 |
| rainemak | not yet across devices as we have not ported it to different devices | 16:31 |
| rainemak | direc85[m], that's a nuance nowadays | 16:31 |
| abr | but when you do, it should be more consistent | 16:31 |
| rainemak | in Europe flatrate is a standard | 16:31 |
| rainemak | direc85[m], data usage control is anyways visible in Sailfish OS side | 16:32 |
| abr | yeah but some apps really want to know which one they're on. early on we tried just calling it ethernet, but some apps refused to work properly. | 16:32 |
| rainemak | Now we'd calling it wlan which helps a bit (compared eth) | 16:33 |
| rainemak | mobile data would be kind of on and mimic'ed for the AppSupport | 16:34 |
| direc85[m] | Deezer for example has different settings for WLAN and mobile data behavior. The difference in data usage can be substantial. | 16:34 |
| rainemak | direc85[m], with this approach it wouldn't matter | 16:34 |
| rainemak | if you want to be on WLAN then you go to WLAN | 16:34 |
| rainemak | WLAN takes always precedence over mobile data anyways | 16:35 |
| rainemak | direc85[m], like said this will be already much better. | 16:35 |
| direc85[m] | rainemak, that's good | 16:36 |
| rainemak | target is that we'd have some sort of a toggle for you so that you can choose whether you take the fallback or try respect the mobile data | 16:36 |
| rainemak | surely, when traveling this might be a issue but same applies to Sailfish OS -> if you have denied roaming then you don't have mobile data | 16:37 |
| rainemak | 2mins (5mins again not enough) | 16:38 |
| rainemak | I can go to extra time, no worry there | 16:38 |
| rainemak | direc85[m], I can through these packages to you as well if you have phased this issue. | 16:39 |
| rainemak | ^ let's take offline | 16:39 |
| direc85[m] | rainemak, sure, let's get back to it later | 16:40 |
| rainemak | I'm pretty sure that after these topics we have plenty for general / generic discussion... let's move on | 16:40 |
| rainemak | #topic Open Pull Requests (PRs) to discussion (2 mins -- asked by Jolla) | 16:40 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to "Open Pull Requests (PRs) to discussion (2 mins -- asked by Jolla) (Meeting topic: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 25th September 2025)" | 16:40 | |
| rainemak | reduced to two mins on the fly | 16:40 |
| rainemak | instead of usual 5 | 16:41 |
| rainemak | I can say that gcc13 is close to get it. Maybe even today evening. | 16:41 |
| rainemak | get in | 16:42 |
| rainemak | Oh, I missed one. I take the GPS topic next in a minute | 16:44 |
| rainemak | My bad | 16:44 |
| rainemak | #opic Timeline of GPS development (5mins -- asked by CLMA31) | 16:45 |
| rainemak | #info <CLMA31> @hildon has asked clarification on GPS development on C2. My guess | 16:45 |
| rainemak | #info <CLMA31> is that this is regarding A-GPS implementation which has been | 16:45 |
| rainemak | #info <CLMA31> talked by @Rainemak in Open source discussion. I guess the main | 16:45 |
| rainemak | #info <CLMA31> interest is to ask if the A-GPS will be implemented already in | 16:45 |
| rainemak | #info <CLMA31> next release? | 16:45 |
| rainemak | This one before General discussion | 16:45 |
| rainemak | #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/sailfish-community-news-18th-september-2025-issue-reporting/24830/11 | 16:45 |
| rainemak | #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/open-sourcing-proceeding/24689/39 | 16:45 |
| rainemak | To clarifi first, A-GPS is supported on all devices (more or less). It could well | 16:45 |
| rainemak | be that it is not working/functioning properly for all devices. There are two | 16:45 |
| rainemak | things that are relatively simple to tackle. Updated SUPL server (hopefully we | 16:45 |
| rainemak | don't end up having adaptation specific SUPLs) and offline/online data providing | 16:45 |
| rainemak | fixed location points. Former provides satelite position information through | 16:45 |
| rainemak | Internet rather from satelites themselves (low bandwidth). Later providing | 16:45 |
| rainemak | fixed location points that are usually mobile cell towers or wireless access | 16:45 |
| rainemak | points. Cell tower triangulation can be used to narrow down location rather | 16:45 |
| rainemak | close precise location. | 16:45 |
| rainemak | #info If you do not mind, I'll extend the meeting by 10mins | 16:46 |
| direc85[m] | rainemak, the reply doesn't have the usual prefix | 16:47 |
| mal | just to mention that the location obtained from external sources like MLS (beacondb or whatever) is inserted via gps android api and device hardware gps can then use that as help for getting location sooner, what actually happens inside the firmware is not really known | 16:47 |
| mal | rainemak: typo in topic it probably didn't get logged correctly | 16:48 |
| mal | and didn't change the topic | 16:48 |
| rainemak | replay | 16:49 |
| rainemak | copy-paste error | 16:50 |
| rainemak | <rainemak> #topic Timeline of GPS development (5mins -- asked by CLMA31) | 16:50 |
| rainemak | <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> @hildon has asked clarification on GPS development on C2. My guess | 16:50 |
| rainemak | <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> is that this is regarding A-GPS implementation which has been | 16:50 |
| rainemak | <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> talked by @Rainemak in Open source discussion. I guess the main | 16:50 |
| rainemak | <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> interest is to ask if the A-GPS will be implemented already in | 16:50 |
| rainemak | <rainemak> #info <CLMA31> next release? | 16:50 |
| rainemak | <rainemak> This one before General discussion | 16:50 |
| rainemak | <rainemak> #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/sailfish-community-news-18th-september-2025-issue-reporting/24830/11 | 16:50 |
| rainemak | <rainemak> #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/open-sourcing-proceeding/24689/39 | 16:50 |
| rainemak | <rainemak> To clarifi first, A-GPS is supported on all devices (more or less). It could well | 16:50 |
| rainemak | <rainemak> be that it is not working/functioning properly for all devices. There are two | 16:50 |
| rainemak | <rainemak> things that are relatively simple to tackle. Updated SUPL server (hopefully we | 16:50 |
| rainemak | <rainemak> don't end up having adaptation specific SUPLs) and offline/online data providing | 16:50 |
| rainemak | <rainemak> fixed location points. Former provides satelite position information through | 16:50 |
| rainemak | <rainemak> Internet rather from satelites themselves (low bandwidth). Later providing | 16:50 |
| rainemak | <rainemak> fixed location points that are usually mobile cell towers or wireless access | 16:50 |
| rainemak | <rainemak> points. Cell tower triangulation can be used to narrow down location rather | 16:50 |
| rainemak | <rainemak> close precise location. | 16:50 |
| rainemak | <rainemak> #info If you do not mind, I'll extend the meeting by 10mins | 16:50 |
| rainemak | <direc85[m]> rainemak, the reply doesn't have the usual prefix | 16:51 |
| rainemak | <mal> just to mention that the location obtained from external sources like MLS (beacondb or whatever) is inserted via gps android api and device hardware gps can then use that as help for getting location sooner, what actually happens inside the firmware is not really known | 16:51 |
| Keto | no, not like that :) | 16:51 |
| rainemak | #topic Timeline of GPS development (5mins -- asked by CLMA31) | 16:51 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to "Timeline of GPS development (5mins -- asked by CLMA31) (Meeting topic: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 25th September 2025)" | 16:51 | |
| rainemak | #info <CLMA31> @hildon has asked clarification on GPS development on C2. My guess | 16:51 |
| rainemak | #info <CLMA31> is that this is regarding A-GPS implementation which has been | 16:51 |
| rainemak | #info <CLMA31> talked by @Rainemak in Open source discussion. I guess the main | 16:51 |
| rainemak | #info <CLMA31> interest is to ask if the A-GPS will be implemented already in | 16:51 |
| rainemak | #info <CLMA31> next release? | 16:51 |
| rainemak | This one before General discussion | 16:51 |
| rainemak | #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/sailfish-community-news-18th-september-2025-issue-reporting/24830/11 | 16:51 |
| rainemak | #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/open-sourcing-proceeding/24689/39 | 16:51 |
| rainemak | To clarifi first, A-GPS is supported on all devices (more or less). It could well | 16:51 |
| rainemak | be that it is not working/functioning properly for all devices. There are two | 16:51 |
| rainemak | things that are relatively simple to tackle. Updated SUPL server (hopefully we | 16:51 |
| rainemak | don't end up having adaptation specific SUPLs) and offline/online data providing | 16:51 |
| rainemak | fixed location points. Former provides satelite position information through | 16:51 |
| rainemak | Internet rather from satelites themselves (low bandwidth). Later providing | 16:51 |
| rainemak | fixed location points that are usually mobile cell towers or wireless access | 16:51 |
| rainemak | points. Cell tower triangulation can be used to narrow down location rather | 16:51 |
| rainemak | close precise location. | 16:51 |
| rainemak | #info If you do not mind, I'll extend the meeting by 10mins | 16:51 |
| rainemak | <direc85[m]> rainemak, the reply doesn't have the usual prefix | 16:51 |
| rainemak | <mal> just to mention that the location obtained from external sources like MLS (beacondb or whatever) is inserted via gps android api and device hardware gps can then use that as help for getting location sooner, what actually happens inside the firmware is not really known | 16:51 |
| rainemak | Keto, yeah sure | 16:51 |
| mal | about supl server, it is usually defined by android side in gps configuration file, not sure what happens if it's not | 16:52 |
| mal | also often android uses google supl server which of course might cause some privacy issues | 16:53 |
| rainemak | mal, that's indeed a good point. | 16:53 |
| abr | beacondb should make things much faster for the initial rough fix from a user point of view. | 16:54 |
| rainemak | and same applies to SUPL server | 16:54 |
| mal | our geoclue plugin does allow overriding the supl server defined by gps config file | 16:55 |
| mal | I'll do some checking of the code for that part to verify if things work correctly like setting the server | 16:56 |
| rainemak | back in the days when we had HERE assisted GPS it was a piece of software not in GPS ship. My gut feeling is that it's nowadays even more common to have the whole shebang as software | 16:56 |
| rainemak | or at least partially a piece of SW on top of GPS HW | 16:57 |
| mal | yeah, not sure what is done inside the google services in terms of location | 16:57 |
| mal | it might have all kinds of things there hidden in the closed project | 16:57 |
| abr | yes I wonder if android even uses the gps chip much anymore | 16:58 |
| rainemak | nonetheless, there are room to improve and those small improvements should be relatively easy to tackle. | 16:58 |
| FireFly | does this discussion affect SFOS in general (through libhybris) or moreso the appsupport/aliendalvik side? | 16:59 |
| rainemak | I would not like call the release train yet, but if it is as simple as think maybe that could even land to 5.0.0 | 16:59 |
| mal | this is about sfos side, and appsupport gets location from sfos side anyway | 17:00 |
| FireFly | *nod* | 17:00 |
| rainemak | correct | 17:00 |
| rainemak | I think this is covered and sorry for the copy-paste hassle | 17:00 |
| mal | unless microg or something has some extra location things on devices which have it installed | 17:00 |
| rainemak | #topic General discussion (10 mins) | 17:00 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to "General discussion (10 mins) (Meeting topic: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 25th September 2025)" | 17:00 | |
| ExTechOp | Ceterum censeo, the glacial progress of the Xperia 10 IV / V port bug fixes. | 17:01 |
| ExTechOp | A year ago we were waiting for Sony fixes, has anything really happened since? https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/confused-about-sony-xperia-10-v/19895/20 | 17:01 |
| rainemak | I think we do not much time for scheduling next meeting, so let's use this general wisely | 17:01 |
| rainemak | ExTechOp, I'd say baby steps. We need to confirm some bits but we're not far. | 17:02 |
| ExTechOp | You know I'm a very long-time user, but even so, I am getting impatient. | 17:03 |
| ExTechOp | Also a quick side question to other SFOS users: Android software unexpected “backgrounding”, anyone else see this happening? | 17:03 |
| ExTechOp | https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/android-software-unexpected-backgrounding/23149/1 | 17:03 |
| rainemak | ExTechOp, I feel you, I have been using Xperia 10 V as my daily as well | 17:03 |
| abr | the wrong app launching you mentioned in that link is fixed for the next release! | 17:04 |
| abr | in the meantime make sure you don't click more than one app launcher while appsupport is starting up | 17:04 |
| ExTechOp | The bit with microG popping up is painful, I was out geocaching last weekend and it kept repeatedly happening. | 17:06 |
| ExTechOp | It'd be nice if SFOS developers could note in that thread which parts of this is known stuff and which are weird things they've not seen? | 17:06 |
| rainemak | ExTechOp, I have seen that happening as well | 17:07 |
| rainemak | Let's see if we can figure out something | 17:08 |
| ExTechOp | ✅ | 17:08 |
| yusssufff | As you mentionned HERE and its Agps, nowadays the Agps included in Pure Maps (from Huawei's appgallery) seems to work excellent on Sailfish (with AppSupport... I get a fix in seconds, even with Gps not open in the device. | 17:08 |
| rainemak | Hey all, should start scheduling next meeting or do you need still more for this? | 17:08 |
| ExTechOp | I think we're done. Two weeks from now works. | 17:09 |
| rainemak | yusssufff, what do you mean Pure Maps + Huawei appgallery? | 17:10 |
| rainemak | I do know Huawei App Gallery but that's an Android app | 17:10 |
| yusssufff | It is a huawei app, distributed via its own appgallery (installable apk) | 17:10 |
| ExTechOp | yusssufff I'm a bit confused, was that a reply to me since I did *not* mention HERE maps? | 17:11 |
| rainemak | that shouldn't be able to influence Sailfish OS gps - I might miss something | 17:11 |
| yusssufff | Yeah all android apps. Oh sorry my bad i misspelled, its named Petal Maps | 17:11 |
| rainemak | ExTechOp, it was for me I think | 17:11 |
| yusssufff | The surprizing part being that it finds you with Sailfish's gps off. | 17:12 |
| FireFly | I've been meaning to try to figure out why getting a GPS fix takes a long time (~10 min, so seemingly no assist) each time despite having it enabled/installed.. but probably less of a meeting topic | 17:12 |
| rainemak | yusssufff, then it's A-GPS not GPS | 17:12 |
| piggz[m] | waydroid -can- affect sailfish GPS, so appsupport might be similar? ... sometimes it seems waydroid can lock out sailfish from reading gps | 17:13 |
| yusssufff | Right right Agps. But pretty amazingly working within this app | 17:13 |
| rainemak | there are things like IP-based, WLAN-based, cell-tower-based positioning... | 17:13 |
| abr | some of these things look up your connected cell towers and nearby wifi networks to get a fix. that's not gps at all. | 17:13 |
| abr | but afaik appsupport isn't allowed to scan for wifi networks | 17:13 |
| rainemak | yeap, same here | 17:14 |
| yusssufff | Therr is also HMS core downloadable from Appgallery, that include the same Agps for other android apps to use | 17:14 |
| rainemak | nonetheless, that is GPS positioning, it's A-GPS positioning broader context | 17:14 |
| rainemak | nonetheless, that is not GPS positioning, it's A-GPS positioning broader context | 17:14 |
| rainemak | alright, this is covered | 17:15 |
| rainemak | #topic Next meeting time and date (1 mins) | 17:15 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to "Next meeting time and date (1 mins) (Meeting topic: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 25th September 2025)" | 17:15 | |
| rainemak | Proposing Thursday 9th October at 04:00 PM UTC | 17:15 |
| ExTechOp | Two weeks from now (the default, also already in the calendar mentioned above) works4me. | 17:15 |
| rainemak | Usual biweekly | 17:15 |
| rainemak | :-) | 17:15 |
| direc85[m] | +1 | 17:15 |
| rainemak | #info Next meeting will be held on Thursday 9th October 2025 at 04:00pm UTC: 2025-10-09T1600Z | 17:15 |
| yusssufff | Okay yes right. Anythow thats Huawei's tools that with Petal Maps or HMS can currently offer real good Agps on android apps wirh Appsupport. | 17:15 |
| mal | piggz[m]: pretty sure waydroid uses gps via libs or binder directly which can mess up sfos side gps, unlike in appsupport which gets location via qtlocation | 17:16 |
| rainemak | yusssufff, good to know, but it's not GPS. On Forum people tend to confuse GPS and A-GPS (heavily) | 17:16 |
| piggz[m] | mal: yeah, thats what i suspected | 17:17 |
| rainemak | mal, piggz[m], that's a completely different aspect | 17:17 |
| piggz[m] | sure, i wasnt sure how appsupport was getting it, but if its like that then sure, unrelated | 17:17 |
| abr | yes a lot of these things can't be shared so simply. that's why bluetooth in appsupport is so difficult. but that's another story. | 17:17 |
| rainemak | 20mins extra this will be. I'll keep this scheduling open as discussion continued | 17:18 |
| rainemak | so 2mins left | 17:18 |
| yusssufff | Right | 17:18 |
| abr | appsupport gets an emulated location provider instead, so it can share | 17:18 |
| yusssufff | Well its always possible anyhow to advice folka to install Huawei Mobile Services HMS from Appgallery to get a good Agps. Maybe i'll make a forum thead about that.. | 17:19 |
| mal | that also means appsupport gets the location from any external source like beacondb mentioned | 17:20 |
| rainemak | Once again my apologies regarding location topic... loved to see this vibrant discussion! You all rock! | 17:20 |
| mal | because that is gotten via qtlocation the same way as any other location info | 17:20 |
| rainemak | We the location topic covered as well I think. | 17:20 |
| abr | beacondb should provide a similar experience to that huawei thingy | 17:21 |
| rainemak | If you mal & yusssufff like to discuss still I can leave this open for a moment | 17:21 |
| rainemak | or abr | 17:21 |
| abr | i'm done :) | 17:21 |
| mal | we can also continue on some other channel if needed | 17:21 |
| rainemak | sure, but logs are good some people | 17:21 |
| rainemak | Thank you all! | 17:22 |
| rainemak | See you in two weeks | 17:22 |
| ExTechOp | Thank you everyone! | 17:22 |
| yusssufff | I'm done too :). Just adviae you folks to test Petal maps, thats quite a thing to get a fix in seconds on Sailfish 😉 | 17:22 |
| rainemak | #endmeeting | 17:22 |
| sailbot | Meeting ended Thu Sep 25 17:22:47 2025 UTC. | 17:22 |
| sailbot | Minutes: https://irclogs.sailfishos.org/meetings/sailfishos-meeting/2025/sailfishos-meeting.2025-09-25-16.00.html | 17:22 |
| sailbot | Minutes (text): https://irclogs.sailfishos.org/meetings/sailfishos-meeting/2025/sailfishos-meeting.2025-09-25-16.00.txt | 17:22 |
| sailbot | Log: https://irclogs.sailfishos.org/meetings/sailfishos-meeting/2025/sailfishos-meeting.2025-09-25-16.00.log.html | 17:22 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to "Next meeting will be held on September 25th 2025 at 04:00pm UTC: 2025-09-25T1600Z" | 17:22 | |
| direc85[m] | Thanks all! Great discussion today! | 17:22 |
| rainemak | +1 | 17:22 |
| *** rainemak changes topic to "Next meeting will be held on October 9th 2025 at 04:00pm UTC: 2025-10-09T1600Z" | 17:25 | |
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