Tuesday, 2014-05-20

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ppit's not really even the income taxes, it's the 24-25% VAT that kills you :-)05:03
suosaaskiincome tax is usually higher or as high as the VAT, at least in Finland.05:09
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jake9xxsuosaaski: true, but if you run positive cashflow you can take 50k from the profit annually07:17
jake9xxsuosaaski: in company mode, that is07:18
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coderusis there any examples for accelerometer "shaking" event?07:27
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jake9xxlbt: ^07:30
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coderusor at least replacement for QtMobility TapSensor?07:32
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coderusoh, TapSensor seems to be there...07:33
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coderusand SensorGesture should be able to detect shaking. Will try it soon :)07:40
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TheBootroo_workiekku: hi !08:01
TheBootroo_workWhen will we finally have more than an empty shell on the dashboard websiet ?08:02
TheBootroo_workat least download count, reviews and likes count with real values08:02
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TheBootroo_workbecause opening Store almost every day to check my 4 apps is annoying, and as i plan to publish 4 other apps, it's gonna get more more and more annoying08:03
SK_workTheBootroo_work: +108:03
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TheBootroo_workshouldn't be so complicated to do ? what language is this ? PHP ? Java ?  i can help if you want08:04
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TheBootroo_workor at least  a web interface for the store, that we can browse on a p08:05
iekkuTheBootroo_work, ahoy08:07
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iekkuTheBootroo_work, i hope soon. but we are currently really limited with work effort we can put to harbour. it's not a good experience for developers, so it's high prio in my list08:08
TheBootroo_workiekku: can we help in any way ?08:09
TheBootroo_workdo you plan to open source at least the front end ?08:09
TheBootroo_workthere are a LOT of talented devs out there with some free time, that could help08:09
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iekkugood question actually! i need to talk with our service guys08:09
TheBootroo_workthx, that would be nice08:09
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SK_workiekku: o/08:11
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TheBootroo_workiekku: i'm asking for that because the reccurent issue is : @work i don't have much gsm signal, i can barely use phone calls, so surfing on 3G is utopic, and we don't have wifi in office, so i can't use the store client during the days because app on jolla is unusable without network, so if at least i could use it on pc, or dashboard had real data, that would help08:12
coderushah, SensorGesture.availableGestures is empty!08:13
iekkuTheBootroo_work, i pinged guys, let's see08:13
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iekkuTheBootroo_work, might take some time to set things if we are about to open it08:13
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chem|stAard: please, would you mind to elaborate on the future partitioning and mounting?08:14
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TheBootroo_workiekku: i was wondering : as Jolla Store app is a QML app, that means it uses some kind of REST api to get list of apps, or reviews and other metadata, some maybe we could simply request on this api while we still don't have ui for it08:15
TheBootroo_workan url with 2 or 3 GET params would be sufficient to me08:15
TheBootroo_worki would build a basic QML wrapper around it that i could use on PC08:15
SK_workTheBootroo_work: I think that there is a need of logging in08:16
SK_work(OAuth2 with Jolla account)08:16
TheBootroo_workSK_work: login for Read only use ? i don't mean being able to post review or vote, just see basic data08:17
TheBootroo_worknot sure login would be needed for that08:17
SK_workTheBootroo_work: don't know either08:17
Aardchem|st: what's unclear still?08:17
TheBootroo_workand even if needed, OAuth is not that hard to implement08:17
TheBootroo_worki did it for Feedly without issue08:18
coderuswhat ahppening with QtSensors? why it have no available gestures?08:20
lbtcoderus: I take it you know/can use the raw #include <QtSensors/QAccelerometer> ? You want a higher level API?08:25
chem|stAard: how do I get my 14GB of maps onto the device for example08:27
chem|stwhy is android / needed as vfat subfolder of /home/nemo/08:28
Aardchem|st: officialy, right now you don't, and in the near future you don't. it's on our todo-list, but it'll take a while08:28
AardI said android sdcard, not android /08:28
chem|stAard: that is the same thing for me... semantics hit you in the face there...08:29
TheBootroo_workhow can i avoid that upgrade snapshot use all my memory08:30
Aardchem|st: android apps have 3 areas where they can store data. app specific area, on the main filesystem. virtual sd-card, or real sd-card, if present. the move now is that the fake sd-card changes to fake-vfat, and is available under home08:30
TheBootroo_worki have pretty no image/video/music on my device but disk usage is 10.3 of 13.7 GB08:30
chem|stAard: so /data/sdcard is getting fused to ~/08:30
TheBootroo_worki'm pretty sure snapshots are eating the space08:30
Nicd-TheBootroo_work: delete old backups?08:31
TheBootroo_workNicd-: where ? how ?08:31
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TheBootroo_work(btw, i never do backups before upgrades)08:31
Nicd-TheBootroo_work: settings -> system -> backup08:31
chem|stwhere is the benefit from doing so?08:31
Aarduser finds his pictures?08:32
TheBootroo_workomg, android storage is eating 7.8GB08:33
chem|stTheBootroo_work: that is what I am on about atm!08:33
TheBootroo_workwell, in one word : Spotify08:34
TheBootroo_workhow didn't i see that before08:34
chem|stAard: if someone is using android as primary base for everything... despite the fact that they should use an android phone they are screwed with no-space-left-on-device08:35
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Aardchem|st: same if you're using sailfish apps requiring lot's of data08:35
TheBootroo_workchem|st: gimme SF apps for everything and i will be happy as hell to throw Alien from my device08:36
TheBootroo_workbut atm i can't live without Spotify at least08:36
SK_workTheBootroo_work: you can write a spotify client isn't it ?08:37
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SK_workIIRC there were many of them written for the N908:37
TheBootroo_workand the CuteSpotify app on Warehouse is a shame08:37
TheBootroo_workSK_work: i'm working on one,08:37
TheBootroo_workbut takes time08:37
TheBootroo_worklibspotify is hard08:37
chem|stAard: the problem was that I could not access the µSD from android, most heavy apps have settings for storage...08:37
TheBootroo_workand crashes has hell08:37
TheBootroo_workchem|st: i have a 64GB sdcard and most SF apps can't see it08:38
TheBootroo_workeven settings app doesn't count it in the disk usage diagramm08:38
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Aardchem|st: the only thing changing for you is which directory you need to move to sd-card for what you're doing. we don't have an official support for sd-card in android apps for storing data (but neither do we have that for sailfish apps)08:38
TheBootroo_workand i can't decide which filesystem is best for my SD card08:38
chem|stTheBootroo_work: well, disk usage diagramm is /08:38
TheBootroo_work64GB class 1208:38
TheBootroo_worki want auto mount in jolla08:39
TheBootroo_workwithout having to type CLI commands08:39
TheBootroo_worki would like to use some linux FS, a ext4 but seems that Jolla phone won't automount it08:39
AardTheBootroo_work: it should08:39
TheBootroo_workand most apps don't have switch in settings to use SD instead of mass memory08:40
TheBootroo_workAard: rly ?08:40
chem|stAard: so I need to fuse/vfat my btrfs/android/µSD to the new folder, you are moving all of it?!08:40
chem|stTheBootroo_work: I have btrfs on if, works flawless08:40
TheBootroo_worki can't use vfat on a 64 GB card with > 2GB files on it08:40
TheBootroo_workchem|st: auto mounted08:40
Aardchem|st: yes. your folder needs to be there _before_ alien starts up, and sets up the vfat mount for home08:41
TheBootroo_workwithout having to tweak fstab by hand ?08:41
TheBootroo_workwell, will try brtfs then08:41
TheBootroo_worksince it's meant to be BetterFS than ext408:41
chem|stAard: so we are again at the mount-sd.sh is to late08:41
TheBootroo_workchem|st: any particular option at format time for it to work better ?08:42
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TheBootroo_workwell after my SD card can be really used, i should be able to move and symlink the biggest folders on it08:42
chem|stTheBootroo_work: I moved /data/sdcard to a btrfs/subfolder too, that one needs a trigger in mount-sd.sh08:42
TheBootroo_workso that apps use it transparently08:43
chem|stone sec08:43
chem|stbut as Aard commented and we discuss currently, that won't work in the future08:44
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TheBootroo_workchem|st: i don't need this trick i think08:47
TheBootroo_worki only want the card ot be mounted by the phone, then i'll manually move some heavy files on it08:47
TheBootroo_workand symlink the spotify cache so that i have more free space on  my phone memory08:47
chem|stI wanted to have it 100% clean without me taking care of how heavy android might be08:47
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chem|stwithout files showing up in the mediaplayer or gallery08:49
TheBootroo_workchem|st: for me android == Spotify client08:49
TheBootroo_workso not a big deal08:49
TheBootroo_workand as soon as my SF client is ready, bye bye alien08:49
chem|stkeep in mind that everything nemo sees will end up in your gallery/mediaplayer08:49
TheBootroo_workchem|st: and that's exactly what i want08:49
TheBootroo_worki want to put my music, pictures and videos on the card but still be able to see them with the gallery08:50
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TheBootroo_workthe rare android apps i'd like to use outside of spotify aren't on Yandex or Aptoide08:50
chem|styeah sure, but if any android cache holds thumbnails or icons you will see them too08:50
TheBootroo_workso i simply can't install them08:50
TheBootroo_workchem|st: no stuff like this08:51
TheBootroo_workonly binary cache encrypted files08:51
TheBootroo_workkinda like git db objects08:51
TheBootroo_workno risk it goes in the gallery08:51
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chem|stjust want to make you aware that usually hidden from nemo should stay hidden08:51
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Nicd-btw, what's the point of having the phone search all paths for images? why can't it just search Pictures and Videos?08:51
Nicd-I don't want any of my email attachments turning up in Gallery08:52
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chem|stNicd-: you are all alone... $people want everything show up08:52
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Nicd-who are these people? I mean, now I have 15 google logos in my gallery just because they were attachments in emails08:53
kimmoli_sailingso you did save them all?08:54
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chem|stAard: that sdcard stunt might give you exactly that... thumbnails and stuff in gallery and mediaplayer...08:54
chem|stif maps have jpg tiles with calibration files you will have all tiles in the gallery^^08:54
Nicd-kimmoli_sailing: they appear if I happen to click on the attachment in the email to see what it is08:55
kimmoli_sailingyes, clicking them downloads them... is it possible to disable folders which it scans?08:56
Nicd-that is something I'd like to configure08:56
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Aardchem|st: we're not indexing it yet, we're working on indexer rules. if maps behaves properly it marks the directory as "don't index it"09:30
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squiddsomeone make me app or bash thingy that uploads stuff automatically to imgur and gives me the link to clipboard!11:37
Nicd-I'm planning to, as a part of my next app11:37
Nicd-but it's a long time away so it would be nice if someone implemented it in the meantime :P11:38
squiddplz to do, I dont want to have to do it myself11:40
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coderuslbt: well, i just thought it shoul dwork because exists. i only tried qml sensors. none of TapSensor and SensorGestures working12:32
lbtok - I only played in c++12:33
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adrutzhow to register as early adopter?12:43
cos-hmm.. any comments on this? http://www.jollausers.com/2014/05/want-a-snappier-jolla-you-have-one-line-of-command-to-enter/12:43
Stskeepscos-: we opted for a different approach, but it's still interesting12:43
Nicd-adrutz: /msg sledges with your email and list of devices12:43
adrutzthank you!12:44
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Sail0rcos-:  was longtime ago mentioned by Stskeeps12:44
cos-is there any good reason _not_ to enable performance mode?12:46
SK_workcos-: battery usage12:47
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TheBootroo_workStskeeps: which is ?12:47
cos-SK_work: the blogger says it didn't affect battery usage too much. and i could compromise some for performance.12:49
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gexc_is this performance tweak still needed if qt5.2 is used?12:56
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coderuslbt: so, in c++ TapSensor or Shake gesture working? i can't try it now, just asking for future :)13:56
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coderuscos-: heat13:56
coderusit will be very heat :)13:56
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sledgesNicd-: thanks for redirects!14:03
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Nicd-sledges: np :)14:30
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fluxhas someone tried how hot it gets if you go into performance loop & infinite loop in your pocket?-)14:31
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sledgesmy jolla once had two processes >40% CPU each, then GPS+3G and google maps live navigation with traffic data, also charging in-car, it felt like hot potato :D works fine to-date14:45
sledges(don'ŧ do this at home :P)14:46
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tango_funny, can't send to channel from  the mobile client16:35
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Stskeepsgood evening17:25
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ballockGood evening, Stskeeps! How's your day?17:40
Stskeepsi'm watching a good movie with friends and having icecream in 24 C in helsinki..17:41
Stskeepsall very unusual things for me to do17:41
faenil24C? ffs, that's hotter than here in Italy17:41
Stskeepsyeah, it's shocking to me too..17:42
Nicd-it was 29°C yesterday17:42
ballockI've got the same, no movies, though.17:42
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ballockSo, where's the good movie (link?)17:45
Stskeepswell, "Her", imdb 8.217:45
Stskeepsit's a bit unusual but interesting from a technological pov17:45
* w00t is dying from the heat17:49
tbrthe harbour is not far from jollahq, just jump in. that's cold.17:49
Stskeepsit's surprisingily close by this apartment17:50
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Stskeepstbr: hey, i'm in tampere tomorrow, would you perhaps be up for a coffee at some point afternoon-ish in center?17:50
javispedromeh, global warming17:51
tbrI'm flexible with my time. I'll be mostly bitching at debian packaging tomorrow, so might even relocate to a park at some point to keep me calm.17:51
Stskeepsdebian packaging is about as fun as rpm packaging when it goes wrong17:53
tbrhopefully it's just a couple rebuild and test cycles17:54
Stskeepsi hope it's colder up north..17:54
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tbrthe temperature thingy on the balcony claims 20.4°C17:55
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Anz_hi, any tips on: how can i use an available maliit .xml vkb layout  to make .qml file for Sailfish?18:16
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coderusjust found gconf /desktop/jolla/specials. i'm happy now :)18:21
coderusAnz_: manually only :)18:22
coderusafaik ;)18:22
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Stskeepscoderus: specials?18:22
walokraHer was a good but strange movie18:22
walokraI wish that my Jolla would talk to me like that :)18:23
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coderusStskeeps: this group for handling dialer and launching desktop files. like *#*#310#*#* ;)18:25
Stskeepscoderus: ah, right18:25
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coderusadded too much of secrets :D18:27
Stskeepsgconf keys are probably the worst secrets in the world18:27
Stskeepsas the schema will talk about it18:27
coderuswell, you catually know what i'm talking about ;)18:27
Stskeepseven in symbian people found field test displays in rom images..18:28
Stskeepsbut i guess you know a lot about that18:28
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coderusyeah, symbian :)18:28
coderusi'd like to have field test on jolla18:28
coderusandd manually switching between cells18:28
Stskeepsi don't think we have that18:28
tbrthose times are long gone I fear18:29
coderusjust my dreams, nevermind :)18:29
Stskeepsas our entry point to modem is RIL in practice18:29
tbrprobably would need a new modem fw and RIL18:29
tbror at the very least secret RIL incantations18:29
Anz_coderus: thanks. no problem, ready to copy manually :D And regarding the language code.. is there some sort of list mentioning standard codes.. does it require regional -suffix. Also any documentation to read on?18:30
Stskeepsi guess it was easier with symbian as the OS was practically running on the baseband18:31
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coderusStskeeps: http://sourceforge.net/apps/mediawiki/wildducks/index.php?title=Wild_ducks_project/Symbian18:33
coderusAnz_: sorry i dodnt understood your question18:33
Stskeepscoderus: i never understood that project.. :P18:33
coderusnostalgy :D18:34
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Anz_all i understand is: the file name has to be xx.qml & xx.conf and a string "language=xx" inside the conf file. where xx is the language code (ee, de, es  fr etc). i'm not sure of my languagr code. some language codes are of the format xx_yy.xml. where yy is the country code.18:39
javispedrothe current ofono version in jolla is "ofono-1.14+git13-1.5.1" -- what's the 1.5.1 part?18:40
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javispedroand does it match with nemomobile-packages/ofono tag "1.14+git13"18:40
VDVsxfrom the builds, can be ignored18:41
javispedroaha, thanks18:41
Stskeepsjavispedro: 1, checkin count, rebuild18:41
coderusAnz_: you can probably find in in web18:42
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Stskeepsjavispedro: 1.14+git13 being the important part18:43
javispedroyeah, so it matches what's on git then18:43
javispedrowant to see if I can get ofono's AT emulator working18:44
javispedro(yes I know about PAN)18:45
javispedrostill have some devices that won't work well with PAN18:45
javispedro*cough* N81018:46
Stskeepsi have a hunch there's a AT thingiemabob somewhere..18:46
Stskeepshang on18:46
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javispedrowell, for all I know, the only thing missing for DUN support is https://bugs.nemomobile.org/show_bug.cgi?id=72018:47
Merbot`Nemo bug 720 in .Other "Ofono is not configured with Bluez4 support" [Enhancement,New]18:47
DevBotBug 720: enhancement, Undecided, ---, need-triage, NEW, Ofono is not configured with Bluez4 support18:47
DevBotBug https://bugs.merproject.org/show_bug.cgi?id=720 normal, Low, ---, jvihrial, NEW, Application output window contains non-useful urls18:47
Merbot`Mer bug 720 in QtCreator Mer Plugin "Application output window contains non-useful urls" [Normal,New] https://bugs.merproject.org/show_bug.cgi?id=72018:47
DevBotBug 720: normal, Low, ---, jvihrial, NEW, Application output window contains non-useful urls18:47
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javispedroClearly Dev_Bot has some infinite recursion prevention system, as it didn't show the URL the second time around18:49
javispedro*Thinks :P18:50
walokraMerBot vs. DevBot. Fight!18:50
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RobertMeHi, for my app I would like to use the volume buttons to control the app, I've gotten the part of acquiring the resource set for the buttons working, but I would need to release and reacquire those when the app becomes active and gets pushed to the background again, how would I be able to do this? (in C++)18:52
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RobertMeI've installed the Qt object as eventFilter and tried to detect these switches by detecting the QEvent::WindowDeactivate and QEvent::WindowActivate event types, but those don't seem to be send18:53
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javispedrohm, you didn't need to take care of that in meego times18:54
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Stskeepsjavispedro: i can't find the log but long story short one of the /dev/smd* speaks AT18:56
javispedrothat's interesting because it would be the real AT then18:56
javispedroer.. the real modem I mean.18:56
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Stskeepswell, real modem speaks QMI19:00
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Stskeepsjavispedro: smd719:03
Stskeepsif it breaks you get to keep both pieces19:04
Stskeepsjavispedro: cat /dev/smd7 &       echo -e 'AT\r' > /dev/smd719:07
javispedro(I was building minicom =) ))19:07
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javispedroah, the all knowing qualcomm modem even knows about the battery state19:11
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Stskeepsthat's .. frightening19:12
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javispedroshould have built socat instead of minicom19:17
Stskeepssocat is awesome19:17
Stskeepsdifficult as hell to get right, but awesome19:17
Stskeepsjavispedro: did you know you can do screen /dev/ttyFOO 115200 btw?19:17
javispedronot :)19:18
Stskeepsok, small circus trick that comes in handy at times19:18
javispedrobut now I just want to redirect it to PC to avoid having to build ppp on sailfish19:18
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javispedronote stock udev rules allow access to most smd[0-9] files by nemo user19:20
Stskeepsi'll make a note of that..19:20
StskeepsAard: ^19:20
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Stskeepskinda wonder why19:20
javispedroactually bluetooth gid19:20
Stskeepshow was it again, mobile phones are like sausages, you really don't want to see how they're made..19:21
javispedrobluetooth gid actually makes me think exporting this device via bt is how android does it =)19:21
javispedroso that inspires some confidence19:21
AardStskeeps: some funny ancient mer leftover? :)19:21
StskeepsAard: naah19:21
Stskeepsprobably a rash decision on my part in the droid-* stuff19:22
Stskeepssledges: can you make a bug for us to sort this out?19:22
Stskeepsjavispedro: grep smd7 /*rc19:22
javispedro/ueventd.qcom.rc sets smd7 to bluetooth:bluetooth19:22
Aardkeep your skin problems out of your work19:22
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javispedro(and 0660)19:23
RobertMewould anyone be able to help me regarding my question in detecting the switch from the foreground to the background and the other way around? I've also found the applicationStateChanged signal on QGuiApplication, but this doesn't seem to be available yet in Sailfish' Qt version19:23
StskeepsRobertMe: maybe it'd come through silica?19:24
Nightmare__RobertMe: did you try to dedect it with an event in your qml file and call a c++ slot?19:24
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RobertMeNightmare__: that might be possible, but that would mean I'd have to expose the object to QML19:25
RobertMeStskeeps: you mean by detecting it using QML? (which would be Qt.application.active IIRC), but I'd like to avoid that, if it's possible in a pure C++ manner19:25
StskeepsRobertMe: else i would assume it'd come through qpa or whichever19:25
* sledges reads backlog19:27
javispedroStskeeps: err... also missed this "important" bit: service bt-dun /system/bin/dun-server /dev/smd7 /dev/rfcomm019:32
javispedroso yeah :)19:32
sledgeswhich device is it javispedro ?19:32
javispedroexactly as it says on the tin :)19:32
javispedrosledges: you mean device node for ..?19:33
sledgeshw phone i mean :)19:33
javispedrothough it seems to be what they exposed to BT19:33
* sledges sigh19:33
javispedroso I guess it should be reasonably safe19:33
sledgesis it jolla phone or n419:33
Stskeepsjolla phone, but we have problem on dhd in general19:34
javispedrodial home device?19:34
javispedrotoo much stargate..19:34
javispedrowell, gotta go now, will mention on whether it works but I think it will (I already got it to speak ppp 'hello')19:36
RobertMefor future reference, if someone reads the logs, I can get it going by installing the eventFilter, check if it's type QEvent::ApplicationStateChange and then cast the event to QApplicationStateChangeEvent and read it's applicationState()19:36
javispedroty Stskeeps19:36
Stskeepsjavispedro: cya19:36
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Accewhat does devel-su -p do exactly?20:21
Acceor is there man page or whatever for devel-su20:22
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zoldyckwe only know about devel-su that the source is not published yet and it's around 150 lines20:25
zoldyckas was said on the mailing list :)20:25
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tigeliAcce: it will give you "privileged" rights20:28
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Accetigeli: like the invoker?20:30
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Acceany ideas how I could let user type their password via qprocess when using "devel-su -c"?20:33
StskeepsAcce: what on earth are you doing..20:33
Turskisounds like really bad idea20:33
AcceStskeeps: just trying to give users of ShellEx some possibility to run commands as root without sudo20:35
Acceso whether it's bad or not is up to the user20:35
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Accewell.. guess it's better to leave it to sudo then20:50
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