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| SirCmpwn | can I install sailfish on a samsung galaxy s5? Or is it just nexus devices | 01:08 |
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| jcbjoe__ | SirCmpwn: go to #sailfishos-porters | 01:20 |
| jcbjoe__ | SirCmpwn: - https://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Adaptations/libhybris/Install_SailfishOS_for_hammerhead | 01:21 |
| SirCmpwn | thanks jcbjoe__ | 01:21 |
| jcbjoe__ | yep | 01:22 |
| SirCmpwn | another question: can I install a package manager and use it like a proper GNU/Linux system? | 01:22 |
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| sandsmark | SirCmpwn: it ships with a package manager | 06:19 |
| sandsmark | how do you think it installs applications? | 06:19 |
| sandsmark | (the default is to use the command line interface to packagekit; pkcon) | 06:19 |
| SirCmpwn | I mean a more standard package manager backed by a more standard repository like yum | 06:19 |
| SirCmpwn | + fedora repos or whatever | 06:19 |
| sandsmark | ? | 06:20 |
| sandsmark | it uses rpm | 06:20 |
| SirCmpwn | the package format, sure | 06:20 |
| SirCmpwn | I want to know if I can yum install nginx on sailfish | 06:20 |
| sandsmark | if you're not familiar with packagekit, it is an abstraction over normal package managers | 06:20 |
| tbr | and it uses pkcon | 06:20 |
| sandsmark | I don't know what it runs underneath packagekit (haven't bothered to check) | 06:20 |
| sandsmark | SirCmpwn: here's a repo with nginx: https://openrepos.net/content/edgley/nginx | 06:21 |
| tbr | SirCmpwn: that's again something different, as nginx would need to have been compiled to match the sailfishos environment. neither fedora nor RH are binary compatible | 06:21 |
| SirCmpwn | thanks folks | 06:21 |
| * tbr would probably take a rpm spec for nginx and rebuild it on OBS | 06:22 | |
| sandsmark | yeah, there's several third-party repos for sailfish on openrepos.net | 06:22 |
| SirCmpwn | it looks like I can get a toolchain fairly easily so compiling stuff wouldn't be too hard | 06:22 |
| sandsmark | yeah | 06:22 |
| sandsmark | SirCmpwn: the easiest is to use OBS | 06:22 |
| SirCmpwn | OBS? | 06:22 |
| sandsmark | at least if you're building a large amount of packages | 06:22 |
| SirCmpwn | open build system? | 06:22 |
| tbr | as with OR, I have to trust that what was uploaded is matching the source. with OBS, I can check and prove that | 06:22 |
| sandsmark | yeah | 06:22 |
| SirCmpwn | service | 06:22 |
| tbr | build.merproject.org | 06:23 |
| tiwake | compile and package all the things for sailfishOS | 06:23 |
| SirCmpwn | which init system does sailfish use? Refrain from flaming | 06:23 |
| tbr | systemd | 06:23 |
| SirCmpwn | I might consider seeing if I can get something working with arch packages (my distro of choice), then | 06:23 |
| tbr | does arch use RPM? | 06:23 |
| sandsmark | no | 06:24 |
| SirCmpwn | nah | 06:24 |
| sandsmark | it uses libalpm tarballs | 06:24 |
| tbr | then it will hardly work | 06:24 |
| SirCmpwn | why? | 06:24 |
| SirCmpwn | can I not write to /usr/bin and such? | 06:24 |
| sandsmark | well, you could probably do a takeover | 06:24 |
| SirCmpwn | does rpm get pissy if you install stuff into /usr without telling it | 06:24 |
| tbr | running two different package managers that are unaware of each other, what could possibly go wrong | 06:24 |
| SirCmpwn | also, I could just use /usr/local/ or something else | 06:24 |
| SirCmpwn | I can't imagine any of this being too particularly difficult to get cooperation out of | 06:25 |
| sandsmark | you could try to replace sailfishos with alarm, just repackaging everything needed :p | 06:25 |
| sandsmark | but I'm not entirely sure why you would do that (except for fun) | 06:25 |
| SirCmpwn | but I want the AUR :D~ | 06:25 |
| SirCmpwn | and also fun | 06:25 |
| tbr | again, whatever you install must match the environment. so you likely won't be able to take random packages from arch arm builds | 06:25 |
| SirCmpwn | mostly fun, actually | 06:25 |
| SirCmpwn | the AUR contains software that is built on the system it's being installed to | 06:26 |
| SirCmpwn | the official repos use the same system, so you can compile any package locally with one command | 06:26 |
| sandsmark | well, the spectacle .yaml files that OBS uses aren't that complicated | 06:26 |
| sandsmark | unlike the traditional .spec files | 06:26 |
| sandsmark | (the reason I run arch is partly because PKGBUILD files are dead easy to write) | 06:27 |
| SirCmpwn | out of curiosity, what makes it binary incompatible? | 06:27 |
| SirCmpwn | you kind of have to try to make your GNU/Linux system binary incompatible | 06:27 |
| sandsmark | different versions of libraries? | 06:27 |
| sandsmark | libraries are (mostly) backwards compatible, not forward compatible (that would be interesting :p) | 06:27 |
| SirCmpwn | oh | 06:27 |
| SirCmpwn | that doesn't really count | 06:27 |
| SirCmpwn | I thought you were implying that they ditched elf or something | 06:28 |
| tbr | if you are compiling on the device, it will compile against the right stuff | 06:28 |
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| tbr | while all this is possible, it's going to be really messy, like installing lots of -devel packages to get necessary headers | 06:29 |
| SirCmpwn | or you could just upgrade the relevant libraries in the rpm-controlled enviornment | 06:29 |
| SirCmpwn | arch took the sane route of distributing headers in the same package :) | 06:29 |
| tbr | and probably break the system so that the phone won't boot, yeah | 06:29 |
| SirCmpwn | nah | 06:30 |
| SirCmpwn | probably not | 06:30 |
| tbr | sounds like arch is the ideal distro for constrained space and CPU environments then *snerk* | 06:30 |
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| SirCmpwn | headers are like two bytes each | 06:30 |
| SirCmpwn | they are the smallest part of basically every package by a large margin | 06:30 |
| sandsmark | tbr: cpu doesn't matter, and the headers are like a couple of kilobytes :p | 06:30 |
| sandsmark | considering that modern phones ship with gigabytes of internal storage it doesn't really matter | 06:31 |
| SirCmpwn | you can probably cross compile pretty darn easily anyway | 06:31 |
| tbr | sandsmark: I was refering to constrained environments, like 10M RAM and 32M flash | 06:31 |
| SirCmpwn | just coping over your root filesystem somewhere else and do stuff in a jail would probably work well enough | 06:31 |
| sandsmark | tbr: there you want a dedicated cross-compiling toolchain anyways, and not build natively | 06:32 |
| tbr | SirCmpwn: if you want to go down the arch route, I'd recommend using a chroot or such, keep things cleaner | 06:32 |
| sandsmark | yeah | 06:32 |
| tbr | sandsmark: no sh*t sherlock | 06:32 |
| SirCmpwn | well, when the tablet comes in, I want to try being productive with it | 06:32 |
| sandsmark | :) | 06:32 |
| SirCmpwn | the reason I haven't gotten any other tablets is because I can't really be productive on android or ios | 06:32 |
| SirCmpwn | but a full blown GNU/Linux system, that'd be excellent | 06:32 |
| tbr | note that there won't be an X.org | 06:32 |
| sandsmark | SirCmpwn: try to see if you can get this done with ALARM, maybe?: https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Install_from_Existing_Linux#Arch_Linux-based_chroot | 06:32 |
| SirCmpwn | meh | 06:33 |
| SirCmpwn | xorg is the least important part of the mix, tbr | 06:33 |
| SirCmpwn | and I bet I could get it running anyway | 06:33 |
| sandsmark | wouldn't be trivial, you'd need drivers | 06:33 |
| tbr | SirCmpwn: javispedro got the xorg compat mode running, sort of | 06:33 |
| SirCmpwn | just display drivers, right? | 06:33 |
| sandsmark | how? using the vesa driver or something? | 06:33 |
| sandsmark | SirCmpwn: yes | 06:33 |
| SirCmpwn | what kind of back assward display could they be using that would need some kind of special drivers to use | 06:34 |
| sandsmark | you could try with freedreno or similar, though | 06:34 |
| sandsmark | SirCmpwn: GPU | 06:34 |
| SirCmpwn | surely some sort of legacy mode works | 06:34 |
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| sandsmark | well, ARM devices... | 06:34 |
| SirCmpwn | hmm, good point, I don't know enough about the arm scene to be confident | 06:34 |
| tbr | raw framebuffer, fun fun | 06:35 |
| sandsmark | ah, yeah, you might get it up with fbdev | 06:35 |
| SirCmpwn | I have run xorg on an ARM device that I seriously doubted I could get xorg running on in the past | 06:35 |
| sandsmark | which? | 06:35 |
| SirCmpwn | the TI-Nspire CX | 06:36 |
| sandsmark | heh | 06:36 |
| SirCmpwn | I have a calculator hobby :) | 06:36 |
| sandsmark | yeah, interesting device to run X11 on :p | 06:36 |
| SirCmpwn | now if only I could get it running on my z80-based calculators | 06:36 |
| sandsmark | hfhf | 06:37 |
| tiwake | lol, z80 | 06:38 |
| SirCmpwn | sailfish does its thing on wayland, right | 06:38 |
| sandsmark | yes | 06:38 |
| sandsmark | using libhybris and android drivers | 06:38 |
| SirCmpwn | has anyone done some research into what closed source stuff is hanging out on the device, what it does, etc | 06:39 |
| SirCmpwn | I'm wondering if it'd be possible to package them up and bring them to a different base system | 06:39 |
| tbr | yes, there is a wiki page | 06:39 |
| tbr | look at the HADK | 06:39 |
| tbr | it's essentially what you are thinking of | 06:39 |
| SirCmpwn | oooh | 06:40 |
| SirCmpwn | neat-o | 06:40 |
| SirCmpwn | under what license are the closed source bits distributed | 06:40 |
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| sandsmark | varying, I think | 06:44 |
| SirCmpwn | how about the "you can pick this up and give it to other people" license | 06:44 |
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| tbr | SirCmpwn: read the HADK, it covers all this | 06:46 |
| SirCmpwn | okay, thank you | 06:46 |
| tbr | resulting community builds are distributable under those conditions | 06:47 |
| tbr | otherwise http://images.devaamo.fi/sfe/ wouldn't exist | 06:47 |
| SirCmpwn | CC by-nc-sa is at the bottom of that file | 06:49 |
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| SirCmpwn | is that the file's license or the license of the actual system? | 06:49 |
| SirCmpwn | yeah, that's the only thing I see in this document that could be about that | 06:52 |
| tbr | you'll probably get questions about that answered on #sailfishos-porters | 06:54 |
| SirCmpwn | right, thanks | 06:54 |
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| Armadillo | QA is getting slow ahead Christmas :D | 07:56 |
| Armadillo | to many cookies? :) | 07:56 |
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| nazanin | Armadillo: hhm, do you see your app locked? | 07:59 |
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| Armadillo | yep:) | 07:59 |
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| Armadillo | has been locked on monday only a few hours after it has been submitted by me | 07:59 |
| nazanin | Armadillo: ah, I reviewed it on the same day and approved it. lemme check with our store guys | 08:00 |
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| Armadillo | thanks :) | 08:00 |
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| Armadillo | so the QA was quite fast and the store is already in the christmas holidays :D | 08:03 |
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| nazanin | Armadillo: not really :p due to some new Harbour changes, there are chances that some minor issues happen ;) | 08:05 |
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| Armadillo | I assumed something like that :) | 08:06 |
| Armadillo | but thanks to your great support all of the problems are being solved fast :) | 08:07 |
| Armadillo | only one question: should I react earlier if the app is locked more than 12 hours? | 08:08 |
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| nazanin | Armadillo: :) the limit to test apps and push them out is within 48 hours; depending on the queuewe have it may take just some hours, or it might take 48 hours. so I would say if you still see your app locked *after* 48 hours, you sure can ping Harbour QA and we check the situation | 08:13 |
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| Armadillo | nazanin roger :) | 08:14 |
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| coderus | MazeLock patch updated to v0.0.2: https://openrepos.net/content/coderus/patch-mazelock | 09:04 |
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| nadley | morning all :D | 09:14 |
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| meklu | morning | 09:15 |
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| hoodlum | morning mate | 09:23 |
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| coderus | moo | 09:32 |
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| stephg | morning guys | 10:11 |
| Stskeeps | morn stephg | 10:11 |
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| zGrr | moin :) | 10:49 |
| HoSnoopy | Huhu | 10:58 |
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| nazanin | Armadillo: check your app now :) | 11:14 |
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| Armadillo | nazanin great, thank you :) | 11:28 |
| nazanin | Armadillo: ;) | 11:28 |
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| Armadillo | nazanin and thanks for the usage hints! ;) | 11:43 |
| nazanin | Armadillo: no problem :) | 11:44 |
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| coderus | MazeLock patch updated to 0.0.3: https://openrepos.net/content/coderus/patch-mazelock | 13:00 |
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| Stskeeps | https://blog.jolla.com/jolla-tablet-hardware-adaptation-team-day-zero-bootstrapping/ | 13:38 |
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| meklu | aww, 32-bit userland :( | 13:48 |
| Stskeeps | otoh, less ram usage | 13:48 |
| meklu | eh, could've gone for -mx32 in that case | 13:48 |
| ikarus | and you can mix and match easily enough | 13:48 |
| meklu | and you'd get nicer timestamps | 13:48 |
| meklu | well, it looks like you'd have to ship your own libc etc. to get a 64-bit thing running | 13:49 |
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| meklu | thankfully wayland is a protocol rather than an API... | 13:49 |
| Stskeeps | x32 is lovely if the blobs you use are also :P | 13:49 |
| meklu | heh, yeah | 13:49 |
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| meklu | libGL{ES} is 32-bit too, right? | 13:50 |
| Stskeeps | aye | 13:50 |
| meklu | shucks | 13:50 |
| ikarus | meklu: yeah, but it is easily shimmed | 13:50 |
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| ikarus | I've done such stupidity before | 13:50 |
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| Stskeeps | 64-bit stuff should work, but don't expect anything to utilize blobby stuff | 13:51 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 13:51 |
| aknight | so is it using mesa like the other android-on-intel solutions i've seen? | 13:51 |
| Stskeeps | aknight: they aren't actually using mesa on android IA products | 13:51 |
| Stskeeps | they're using some UFO thing | 13:51 |
| ikarus | for me shipping your own libc in the package wouldn't be too painful, but I know some other countries don't have decent internet | 13:51 |
| meklu | just ship musl! :D | 13:51 |
| meklu | that should certainly fit | 13:52 |
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| ikarus | It depends on the GPU Intel uses, because they have two GPUs for Atom, one based on PowerVR and one Intel HD Graphics and I forgot to check this one was | 13:52 |
| ikarus | the PowerVR one doesn't work with mesa | 13:52 |
| Stskeeps | this might work with mesa, but i've not tried yet | 13:52 |
| meklu | it said intel hd graphics on the cpu product page | 13:52 |
| meklu | do it, for science? :) | 13:53 |
| meklu | you can always flash back the extraterrestrial solution | 13:53 |
| ikarus | meklu: uh, yeah, but they market both as HD Graphics | 13:53 |
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| ikarus | meklu: but only one design is ACTUALLY Intel HD Graphics | 13:53 |
| meklu | ikarus: hmm, that sucks | 13:53 |
| ikarus | the other one is just licensed from PowerVR | 13:53 |
| meklu | ikarus: it's starting to sound too much like poulsbo here | 13:54 |
| ikarus | and is similar to the GPU cores used on ARM processors | 13:54 |
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| Armadillo | Stskeeps interesting article :) | 14:04 |
| Stskeeps | thanks.. lots more to come | 14:04 |
| Armadillo | sounds good ;) | 14:05 |
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| aknight | crowd-funded tech journalism? ;-) | 14:05 |
| meklu | tech, journalism | 14:07 |
| meklu | pick one | 14:08 |
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| SK_work | thanks for the article Stskeeps | 14:16 |
| SK_work | the uefi thing puzzles m | 14:16 |
| SK_work | me | 14:16 |
| Stskeeps | it's a bit more complex than how things are done on arm | 14:16 |
| SK_work | what's done on ARM ? | 14:16 |
| SK_work | is ARM "less secure" ? | 14:16 |
| Stskeeps | no, just done differently, there's more possibilities to 'lock down' | 14:17 |
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| SK_work | ok | 14:17 |
| Stskeeps | whereas pc has more tradition for 'open' devices | 14:17 |
| meklu | signed PE dummy binaries... *hrr* | 14:18 |
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| m4g0g | hi | 14:34 |
| m4g0g | I have c++ class with access to api of the service. How can I give to every page access to it? Is it normal to register class in qml and create in every page Api {id: api} ? | 14:35 |
| m4g0g | or there is a better way to achieve this? | 14:35 |
| SK_work | m4g0g: put it in your ApplicationWindow | 14:36 |
| SK_work | and give it an id like id: api | 14:36 |
| SK_work | use api in all other pages | 14:36 |
| SK_work | should work | 14:36 |
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| m4g0g | thx | 14:40 |
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| TMavica | . | 14:46 |
| Stskeeps | hello TMavica | 14:47 |
| TMavica | hi | 14:48 |
| TMavica | coming soon, lol | 14:49 |
| Stskeeps | ah right, to finland | 14:50 |
| Stskeeps | i'm just preparing for my vacation | 14:50 |
| TMavica | .. | 14:50 |
| Stskeeps | well, staycation | 14:51 |
| simbrown | how do I tell which version of the SDK I have installed? | 14:52 |
| coderus | simbrown: tell? | 14:54 |
| Nicd- | simbrown: sdkmaintenancetool, check for updates | 14:54 |
| Nicd- | or package manager | 14:55 |
| Nicd- | will tell you what versions you have installed | 14:55 |
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| simbrown | it tells me that I have 1.0.1-2, is that 1407? | 14:57 |
| Nicd- | 1.0.1-2 of what package? | 14:57 |
| coderus | sdk-release file | 14:58 |
| coderus | in SailfishOS SDK folder | 14:58 |
| simbrown | SailfishOS SDK is the component name | 14:58 |
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| simbrown | coderus: Thanks, that file tells me 1410 | 14:58 |
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| ryukafalz | Hey, does anyone know offhand if there's a quick way to reset the build VM to its default state without uninstalling/reinstalling the SDK? | 16:20 |
| ryukafalz | can't seem to find an option to do so | 16:20 |
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| coderus | ryukafalz: reinstall and create snapshot in vm? | 16:25 |
| coderus | build vm is fully functional operating system | 16:25 |
| coderus | does operating system have button to reset it state? :) | 16:25 |
| ryukafalz | no, but the SDK could have created a snapshot on install ;) | 16:25 |
| coderus | ryukafalz: no, thanks | 16:26 |
| coderus | if you want so you need to care it yourself :) | 16:26 |
| ryukafalz | fair enough :P | 16:26 |
| ryukafalz | agh, looks like the problem I'm running into wouldn't have been solved by that anyway | 16:27 |
| ryukafalz | oh, wait | 16:28 |
| ryukafalz | I'm being dumb | 16:28 |
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| ryukafalz | dang case sensitivity tripping me up | 16:40 |
| ryukafalz | I'm not even a new Linux user, what am I doing? XD | 16:40 |
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| coderus | Help me testing LauncherGrid Advanced + FolderIcons combined patch: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1452535#post1452535 | 17:03 |
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| SK_work | coderus: thought about writing a gui for your dconf keys ? | 17:03 |
| SK_work | a companion app / settings plugin to configure this patch easily ? | 17:04 |
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| coderus | SK_work: yes i have settings applet for my own, will finish and release it a bit later | 17:08 |
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| Venemo | here's a pretty crazy question | 19:01 |
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| Venemo | is it possible to run the sailfish build engine on kvm, instead of virtualbox? | 19:01 |
| Stskeeps | probably | 19:01 |
| Stskeeps | but no shared folders then, you'd have to use another technology | 19:01 |
| locusf | 9p exists, but doesn't really work as well as virtualboxes shared folders | 19:02 |
| Venemo | ah, didn't imagine it required such stuff | 19:03 |
| locusf | I guess it really doesn't tbh | 19:03 |
| locusf | it just makes devs lives easier | 19:03 |
| locusf | hmm I'm wrong | 19:03 |
| locusf | qtc building uses it quite heavily | 19:03 |
| coderus | Venemo: you can use chroot | 19:04 |
| Venemo | coderus: I know, that's how the mer platform sdk works | 19:05 |
| coderus | this is the only way to use sdk with no virtualbox i know | 19:05 |
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| locusf | you can get the target from hadk instructions, if thats all you need | 19:05 |
| Venemo | hadk=? | 19:06 |
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| locusf | http://bit.ly/hadk-doc-rev2 | 19:07 |
| locusf | Venemo: chapter 6 | 19:08 |
| Venemo | ah | 19:09 |
| Venemo | okay | 19:10 |
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| ryukafalz | is there a way to disable device lock from the command line if I have SSH access? | 19:16 |
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| ryukafalz | beidl: unfortunately it doesn't appear the KDE connect protocol is documented much outside of the source, but it seems fairly flexible | 19:18 |
| coderus | /usr/lib/qt5/plugins/devicelock/encpartition --clear-code 12345 | 19:19 |
| ryukafalz | what's "12345" for? | 19:19 |
| Morpog_PC__ | i guess your code | 19:19 |
| beidl | ryukafalz: means I'll have to contact the developers when I've got time | 19:19 |
| ryukafalz | Morpog_PC__: ooh boy, well that's the problem :P if it's used to decrypt stuff... hmm | 19:20 |
| ryukafalz | oh, actually that may have worked | 19:21 |
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| beidl | ryukafalz: I hope they have plans for routing audio samples. because I'd like the tablet to function both as the desktop and the mobile device, depending on my needs. | 19:23 |
| ryukafalz | beidl: if not, you can do that with pulseaudio | 19:23 |
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| beidl | ryukafalz: I know | 19:24 |
| beidl | ryukafalz: there's actually a GUI for that in openrepos | 19:24 |
| * ryukafalz nods | 19:24 | |
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| newbie007 | Greetings, could someone make the case to me as to why I should learn SailFishOS opposed to FirefoxOS. Android compatibility has no value to me, and Firefox OS has a much easier learning curve... So what does SailFishOS bring to the table? | 19:29 |
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| Morpog_PC__ | better UI/UX, more performance, native code, great SDK | 19:30 |
| ryukafalz | newbie007: For me, it's largely that it's a full linux distribution and has all the capability associated with that. But I'm perhaps a bit of an edge case. :P | 19:31 |
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| ryukafalz | I love being able to SSH to my device and having a full package manager, etc. | 19:33 |
| newbie007 | can I drop to a command line and run an ssh command? What about install blender, gimp, abiword, gnumeric etc.. ? | 19:34 |
| Morpog_PC__ | enable developer mode and you got terminal installed | 19:34 |
| ryukafalz | Traditional desktop apps generally won't work, as there's no X11 - command line apps will, however. | 19:34 |
| Morpog_PC__ | it's wayland based, so not that easy to get desktop apps to run | 19:35 |
| ryukafalz | not that it would be a great experience trying to run blender on a mobile phone anyway ;) | 19:35 |
| newbie007 | Another question.. the indigogo campaign had some sort of thing to "unlock" dual screen mode.. I do not understand. This is just a fun lets raise some more money? Dual screen I understand to be some sort of software enhancement to the GUI.. ? | 19:36 |
| Morpog_PC__ | not dual screen, splitscreen | 19:36 |
| Morpog_PC__ | and yes it's just a software enhancement | 19:36 |
| Morpog_PC__ | which they can now prioritize | 19:37 |
| newbie007 | Seems like this enhancement would have come around sooner or later either way | 19:37 |
| Morpog_PC__ | sure | 19:37 |
| Morpog_PC__ | but Jolla is not Mozilla which can spend millions on dev's and got a huge dev community | 19:37 |
| beidl | newbie007: but it's coming sooner now rather than later | 19:37 |
| Morpog_PC__ | it's a small 100+ employe company | 19:38 |
| newbie007 | I'm unfamiliar with "wayland". This is a gui similar to what I understand as X11 perhaps more streamlined for this family of devices? | 19:38 |
| Morpog_PC__ | wayland is the successor of x11 | 19:38 |
| Morpog_PC__ | it will be default on desktops too in some years | 19:38 |
| beidl | to be a little more accurate, wayland is a protocol, which means what X11 did until now compositors do themselves. | 19:39 |
| newbie007 | I was a huge maemo fan, as that fades away I am looking for an alternative and latched onto FirefoxOS, which I would categorize as "just-a-phone" | 19:39 |
| ryukafalz | so e.g. on the desktop where you would have kwin and x11, now you would just have kwin | 19:39 |
| Morpog_PC__ | well, sailfish should be alot more familiar to you compared to FF OS | 19:40 |
| ryukafalz | and kwin implements the wayland protocol | 19:40 |
| beidl | newbie007: it is possible to use wayland-capable desktop apps on sailfish, as long as the GUI toolkit is there in compiled form | 19:40 |
| newbie007 | So anything that uses kwin could be compiled for sailfishos ? | 19:40 |
| Morpog_PC__ | on jolla lipstick implements the wayland protocol | 19:41 |
| beidl | nothing "uses" kwin | 19:41 |
| ryukafalz | (also kwin was an example re: another popular desktop environment) | 19:41 |
| Morpog_PC__ | Fedora 21 can use waland from Gnome 3.14 | 19:41 |
| newbie007 | I see I'm looking in to it now. I am unfamiliar with kwin | 19:42 |
| Morpog_PC__ | I think there was a prrof of concept for Xwayland on sailfishos somewhere | 19:42 |
| ryukafalz | newbie007: kwin isn't particularly relevant to sailfish, it's just KDE's window manager | 19:43 |
| Morpog_PC__ | there it is: http://213.128.137.28/showthread.php?p=1439987#post1439987 | 19:43 |
| ryukafalz | newbie007: in any case, sailfish is pretty much the closest thing to maemo at this point | 19:44 |
| Morpog_PC__ | better link: http://213.128.137.28/showpost.php?p=1439988&postcount=11 | 19:44 |
| ryukafalz | Morpog_PC__: ooh, fancy | 19:44 |
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| newbie007 | This does sound very promising | 19:45 |
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| Morpog_PC__ | but be sure to know, it's just the beginning, they have a long way in front of them | 19:45 |
| Morpog_PC__ | there are still lots of bugs | 19:45 |
| Morpog_PC__ | but steady updates | 19:45 |
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| Morpog_PC__ | oh and the browser is gecko based :D | 19:46 |
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| newbie007 | There are a couple of applicaitons from maemo that I hope get ported, I didn't write them. I'm going to reach out to those developers to see if they plan to port to sailfishos (Almost-TI and abiword) | 19:46 |
| ryukafalz | the biggest issue I have with it is that some parts (the UI mostly) are not open source - but there is work on an open source alternative | 19:47 |
| ryukafalz | but then, harmattan UI was not open source either so... | 19:47 |
| newbie007 | ryukafalz: some parts of what? | 19:47 |
| ryukafalz | sailfish | 19:48 |
| newbie007 | I'd like to know the down and dirty details of why things like this are closed source.. | 19:48 |
| ryukafalz | the core distribution (mer) is open source and jolla contributes heavily, so I'm fine with it overall | 19:49 |
| beidl | the funny thing is: people would argue that android is more "open" since the framework and everything is open, but in practice that's not the case, talking about OEM modifications, where the only open part is the kernel | 19:49 |
| Morpog_PC__ | the UI is closed practically | 19:49 |
| Morpog_PC__ | and some jolla core apps | 19:49 |
| Morpog_PC__ | and drivers, etc. | 19:49 |
| beidl | and since most android system applications are being replaced by proprietary Google-branded apps there is no difference. | 19:50 |
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| ryukafalz | There was actually an open source meeting recently where topics like this were covered. There's now a page here with open/closed components: https://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/SailfishOSS | 19:50 |
| ryukafalz | most of the closed packages are UI and default apps | 19:50 |
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| Morpog_PC__ | but if you wish you can replace the UI (silica) with fully open source Glacier UI | 19:50 |
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| Morpog_PC__ | built by community | 19:51 |
| locusf | err, replace the homescreen :) ? | 19:51 |
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| Morpog_PC__ | thats pretty much the whole UI :D | 19:51 |
| ryukafalz | homescreen and QML components | 19:51 |
| ryukafalz | the latter is potentially trickier | 19:52 |
| Morpog_PC__ | well, you can get whole nemomobile on Jolla device | 19:52 |
| * ryukafalz is hoping the "TBD" licensed packages on that wiki page end up open | 19:52 | |
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| ryukafalz | particularly messages | 19:53 |
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| Morpog_PC__ | but as newbie007 came from maemo, he should be used to closed stuff | 19:54 |
| newbie007 | Mu understanding was that just the screen drivers to maemo were closed | 19:54 |
| ryukafalz | Morpog_PC__: no reason to not want more open software though hmm? ;) | 19:55 |
| Morpog_PC__ | ryukafalz, sure | 19:55 |
| Morpog_PC__ | newbie007, nope | 19:55 |
| ryukafalz | Also relevant: which version of Maemo? Harmattan, Fremantle...? | 19:55 |
| locusf | in what ways was Harmattan more open than Fremantle because I completely missed out Harmattan? | 19:56 |
| Morpog_PC__ | in none I guess | 19:56 |
| ryukafalz | locusf: I think it was less open | 19:56 |
| ryukafalz | IIRC Harmattan UI was closed | 19:57 |
| locusf | I remember there was essentially nothing that could be done wrt to ui in fremantle | 19:57 |
| Morpog_PC__ | and it was locked down with aegis crap | 19:57 |
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| locusf | chinook and diablo were also closed | 19:58 |
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| locusf | also remember ryukafalz that the table might be largely changed in u10 | 19:59 |
| Morpog_PC__ | if u10 just would be ever released :) | 19:59 |
| locusf | since _a lot_ of hardware adaptation specific packages have been free softwared by Jolla | 19:59 |
| Morpog_PC__ | it starts to feel like waiting fpr PR1.3 on N9 :D | 19:59 |
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| locusf | ok well depends on the definition of a lot :p | 19:59 |
| ryukafalz | locusf: I'm certainly looking forward to it :) | 19:59 |
| locusf | oh yeah | 20:00 |
| locusf | some of the packages are only in mer-hybris repo afaik | 20:00 |
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| locusf | okay the problem really is that the packages _are_ open source, but they can't be built for Jolla usage | 20:01 |
| ryukafalz | hm, like which ones? | 20:01 |
| Morpog_PC__ | oh and newbie007 there even is a hw keyboard now made by community, so the jolla is more like the n900 ever | 20:01 |
| Morpog_PC__ | latest prototype video: http://t.co/bBSX6D7EJ3 | 20:02 |
| newbie007 | nice | 20:02 |
| newbie007 | is there a list of applicaitons? | 20:02 |
| Morpog_PC__ | it was on kickstarter and gained lots of €€€ | 20:02 |
| Morpog_PC__ | https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/2028347278/tohkbd-the-other-half-keyboard-for-your-jolla | 20:02 |
| Morpog_PC__ | newbie007, not for official store, but you can check openrepos | 20:03 |
| Morpog_PC__ | https://openrepos.net/ | 20:03 |
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| locusf | ryukafalz: pulseaudio-modules-droid, libhybris-sbj packages and hwcomposer | 20:03 |
| ryukafalz | I can see why libhybris-sbj could be a problem but why the other two? | 20:05 |
| locusf | well it is because pulseaudio-modules-droid-sbj depends on something only found in the sbj (Jolla) android headers, afaik | 20:06 |
| ryukafalz | oh, you left the -sbj off the name before :P | 20:07 |
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| locusf | hmm actually even that is wrong | 20:08 |
| locusf | the spec file just says %device sbj, nothing else is different | 20:09 |
| locusf | I mean from the other adaptations | 20:09 |
| ryukafalz | ahh I see what you mean | 20:10 |
| ryukafalz | https://github.com/mer-hybris/pulseaudio-modules-droid/blob/master/rpm/pulseaudio-modules-droid-sbj.spec | 20:10 |
| locusf | yup | 20:10 |
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| locusf | I've tried to build the sbj package for Jolla from Nexus 5 headers and libhardware but it doesn't work in runtime | 20:11 |
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| * ryukafalz is jealous of Jolla owners now that TOHKBD is coming out | 20:16 | |
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| ryukafalz | it reminds me of my old N810 | 20:17 |
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| sledges | locusf: Nexus 4 headers are much closer to the SoC (nearly 1:1) | 20:22 |
| locusf | sledges: oh ok :) | 20:22 |
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| urjaman | who the f got the idea to vibrate on low battery -.-... i know its low, would you now just focus on sleeping :| | 21:52 |
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| ryukafalz | now that I think about it I don't think I've ever heard the sailfish low battery tone | 22:00 |
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| ryukafalz | if there is one | 22:00 |
| ryukafalz | which is a good thing of course :P | 22:00 |
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