| ExTechOp | Good Morning, everyone! | 06:59 |
|---|---|---|
| rainemak | #startmeeting Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 24th April 2025 | 07:00 |
| sailbot | Meeting started Thu Apr 24 07:00:08 2025 UTC. The chair is rainemak. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 07:00 |
| sailbot | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic. | 07:00 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 24th April 2025)" | 07:00 | |
| rainemak | #info Meeting information and agenda can be found here: | 07:00 |
| rainemak | #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/community-meeting-on-24th-april-2025/22836 | 07:00 |
| rainemak | I am the meeting's chairperson today, and will be doing my best to keep time and order. Please respect the timings and bee-hive. | 07:00 |
| rainemak | #topic Brief introduction (5 min). Please prefix your name/handle with #info | 07:00 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to "Brief introduction (5 min). Please prefix your name/handle with #info (Meeting topic: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 24th April 2025)" | 07:00 | |
| rainemak | Good morning everyone! | 07:00 |
| rainemak | Good morning ExTechOp | 07:00 |
| ExTechOp | #info Otto Mäkelä, community | 07:00 |
| pherjung[m] | Hi! | 07:00 |
| rainemak | #info Raine Mäkeläinen, Jolla | 07:00 |
| tuplasuhveli[m] | #info tuplasuhveli, community | 07:00 |
| rainemak | welcome pherjung[m] | 07:00 |
| tuplasuhveli[m] | Good morning everybody 8) | 07:00 |
| rainemak | welcome tuplasuhveli[m] | 07:00 |
| rainemak | We have four topics and few bonus questions from the meeting topic comments. Let's try to stick with the reserved time slots. | 07:02 |
| pvuorela | #info Pekka Vuorela, Jolla | 07:04 |
| rainemak | #topic Sailfish OS roadmap checkpoint (15 mins -- rainemak) | 07:05 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to "Sailfish OS roadmap checkpoint (15 mins -- rainemak) (Meeting topic: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 24th April 2025)" | 07:05 | |
| rainemak | #info <rainemak> As discussed 10th April on our community meeting let’s have a | 07:05 |
| rainemak | #info <rainemak> roadmap checkpoint / update. This might well be just a textual | 07:05 |
| rainemak | #info <rainemak> update. | 07:05 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> Textual update it is. Following bigger update items that we have on | 07:06 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> the roadmap. Good part of these will likely land to Sailfish OS 5.1. | 07:06 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> Items are not in priority order. | 07:06 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> glibc | 07:06 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> systemd | 07:06 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> lvm | 07:06 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> pulseaudio | 07:06 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> python | 07:06 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> rpm | 07:06 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> openssl | 07:06 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> gcc | 07:06 |
| pherjung[m] | #info pherjung, community | 07:06 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> and tons of other updates. | 07:06 |
| rainemak | Some of these items are closer and the others. Actually, glibc got integrated last week. Then there are other bigger things like esr102. | 07:07 |
| tuplasuhveli[m] | Ooh, ESR102 sounds good! | 07:08 |
| rainemak | Above is here to give you more visibility regarding what we have on the table | 07:08 |
| rainemak | esr102 is big one, let's first get all related repositories visible | 07:09 |
| rainemak | Please bare in mind that all items listed above will not land to Sailfish OS 5.1. | 07:10 |
| rainemak | Plan/Expectation is that we have one or two 5.0 updates still before 5.1. | 07:11 |
| rainemak | I should actually say, regarding esr102 that related repositories & branches visible | 07:14 |
| pherjung[m] | Really nice! And do you have any news related to open-sourcing parts? | 07:16 |
| flypig- | #info David Llewellyn-Jones, community + late (sorry!) | 07:16 |
| rainemak | Not yet on that. | 07:16 |
| rainemak | flypig-, welcome | 07:16 |
| rainemak | let's move on | 07:19 |
| flypig- | I'm looking forward to seeing esr102 land in gecko-dev; I've heard good things :) | 07:19 |
| rainemak | +1 | 07:19 |
| rainemak | #topic New vendor blobs available from Sony (5 mins -- asked by cquence) | 07:20 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to "New vendor blobs available from Sony (5 mins -- asked by cquence) (Meeting topic: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 24th April 2025)" | 07:20 | |
| rainemak | #info <cquence> any timeline of when can we get feedback for those blobs? (i.e. do | 07:20 |
| rainemak | #info <cquence> they fix some/all of the existing 10IV/V problems). | 07:20 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> These new blobs require work on NFC, GPS, sensors and VoLTE at least. | 07:20 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> With these new blobs, we need to adapt NFC, GPS, sensors and VoLTE | 07:20 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> from HIDL to AIDL. So getting those working will require time and | 07:20 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> development efforts. Flypig wrote back in August 2021 a nice summary | 07:20 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> about libgbinder that opens up also HIDL and AIDL. | 07:20 |
| rainemak | #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/sailfish-community-news-12th-august-libgbinder-4-2-0-l10n/7582#a-detailed-look-at-driver-access-through-libgbinder-2 | 07:20 |
| flypig- | Just to say, krnlyng deserves credit for all of the good bits in that libgbinder summary. | 07:21 |
| flypig- | Is there a link anywhere to the announcement about the new blobs from Sony? | 07:22 |
| flypig- | This one maybe? https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/new-binaries-blobs-for-xperia-v-and-iv-what-is-happening-actually/22584 | 07:23 |
| rainemak | Announcement from us or Sony | 07:23 |
| flypig- | From Sony. | 07:23 |
| flypig- | I'm just being curious about it. | 07:23 |
| rainemak | https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/sailfish-community-news-3rd-april-2025-harbour/22658 | 07:23 |
| flypig- | Perfect; thank you! | 07:24 |
| rainemak | Moving on | 07:25 |
| rainemak | #topic Make sfdk manual pages available online (5 mins -- asked by Managor) | 07:25 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to "Make sfdk manual pages available online (5 mins -- asked by Managor) (Meeting topic: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 24th April 2025)" | 07:25 | |
| rainemak | #info <Managor> For ease of access reasons it would be good if all of the command | 07:25 |
| rainemak | #info <Managor> line options were listed somewhere. | 07:25 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> We understand reasoning that you have here. This kind of feature | 07:25 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> requests shall be looked also from maintenance point of view. | 07:25 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> Currently you can find all commands with different --help commands. | 07:25 |
| ExTechOp | Obviously, the minimal information in --help (mostly listing what options are available) does not really replace a proper manual page where there usually is a larger explanation of why one would need to use each of the options. | 07:28 |
| rainemak | let's move to the next topic | 07:30 |
| rainemak | #topic AppSupport without libhybris (15mins -- asked by affe_null) | 07:30 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to "AppSupport without libhybris (15mins -- asked by affe_null) (Meeting topic: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 24th April 2025)" | 07:30 | |
| rainemak | #info <affe_null> The AppSupport packages currently provided to Sailfish OS users | 07:30 |
| rainemak | #info <affe_null> (at least on the C2) rely on an Android HAL being present in / | 07:30 |
| rainemak | #info <affe_null> vendor. Android vendor HALs can be very messy, and the time spent | 07:30 |
| rainemak | #info <affe_null> on maintaining compability with them might be better spent on | 07:30 |
| rainemak | #info <affe_null> writing upstreamable kernel drivers for the devices. This is | 07:30 |
| rainemak | #info <affe_null> hopefully going to become easier with time as more support for | 07:30 |
| rainemak | #info <affe_null> major SoC families lands in upstream Linux. Would Jolla be able | 07:30 |
| rainemak | #info <affe_null> to provide AppSupport packages for ports that are not based on | 07:30 |
| rainemak | #info <affe_null> Android? How much work would that need? I am not asking about | 07:30 |
| rainemak | #info <affe_null> AppSupport for community ports, this is a question about the | 07:30 |
| rainemak | #info <affe_null> feasibility of an official port without libhybris. | 07:30 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> AppSupport itself does not depend on hal. For example, our collegues | 07:30 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> at Seafarix run AppSupport on Rpi5 with Ubuntu and Mesa drivers among | 07:30 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> other things. If there would be hw accelerated mesa for phone devices | 07:30 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> that could be also used in phone in future. However as we know, this | 07:30 |
| rainemak | #info <Jolla> is more easily said than done in mobile soc side. | 07:31 |
| flypig- | Does this also mean that -- more generally -- there's no benefit to upstreaming kernel driver changes in relation to AppSupport? | 07:37 |
| flypig- | I suppose, as you say, it's things like the Mesa drivers that are important. | 07:38 |
| rainemak | yeapp | 07:39 |
| rainemak | I guess this is covered | 07:44 |
| rainemak | #topic Open PR discussion (5 mins -- asked by Jolla) | 07:44 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to "Open PR discussion (5 mins -- asked by Jolla) (Meeting topic: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 24th April 2025)" | 07:44 | |
| tuplasuhveli[m] | The latest changelog mentions the ability to add reboot option on topmenu. However, I still find holding down the lock button to be the only way to achieve this. I couldn't find any related toggles in Settings -> Topmenu. Am I missing something? | 07:45 |
| flypig- | There's an option in Developer tools. I'm not sure whether you need Developer Mode enabled for that? | 07:46 |
| flypig- | (if I'm understanding correctly) | 07:47 |
| rainemak | hey, let's move to generic... | 07:48 |
| AffeNull[m] | Sorry I'm late, I misread the time | 07:49 |
| rainemak | #topic General discussion (8 mins) | 07:49 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to "General discussion (8 mins) (Meeting topic: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 24th April 2025)" | 07:49 | |
| rainemak | AffeNull[m], no worry | 07:49 |
| flypig- | @tuplasuhveli[m], I suppose you mean this item from the changelog? | 07:49 |
| rainemak | tuplasuhveli[m], that could also be mind2 related note which is missing mind2 context | 07:49 |
| flypig- | - [lipstick-jolla] Allow to enable both reboot and lock options on topmenu. | 07:49 |
| Nico | This meeting timeslot nowadays is exactly in the middle of one of my work meetings, so sadly I can mostly only follow by reading :) | 07:49 |
| Nico | But gcc on the roadmap sounds great! | 07:50 |
| dodoradio[m] | sorry I wasn't able to join at the beginning | 07:50 |
| Nico | (I somehow always depend on some newer features and then need to backport for my packages... :D) | 07:50 |
| ExTechOp | Indeed, the upgrade path looks promising. | 07:50 |
| dodoradio[m] | rainemak the roadmap looks excellent! I hope this stays a consistent part of meetings | 07:51 |
| rainemak | dodoradio[m], thanks | 07:51 |
| rainemak | tuplasuhveli[m], it's actually new experimental dconf | 07:51 |
| rainemak | mankir asked as a comment about how long xa2 will be supported? | 07:51 |
| rainemak | Usual it is about kernel version requirements that triggering stopping of a support for an older device. | 07:51 |
| tuplasuhveli[m] | Okay, I saw it mentioned in the mind2 segment and also in lipstick segment. | 07:52 |
| dcaliste | Sorry, coming late on the topic, about opened PR, I've noticed some PR by Nephros in spectacle and Perl. In case you don't know about them yet... | 07:52 |
| AffeNull[m] | I've also opened a new PR: https://github.com/sailfishos/lipstick/pull/66 | 07:52 |
| rainemak | dcaliste, noted that | 07:53 |
| rainemak | Then there were comments about Mozilla Location Service (MLS) in community meeting topic and how to replace that. Before we noticed those comments, we actually contacted beaconDB maintainer exactly for the very same reasons. Surely, we'd like to see A-GPS alive as well. | 07:53 |
| ExTechOp | rainemak Looking at https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/sailfish-community-news-3rd-april-2025-harbour/22658 it seems updating the Android blobs is a bit of an experimental prospect, | 07:53 |
| ExTechOp | any ideas what the timing would be for it to become a bit more "mainstream", would it just be included in a SFOS update? | 07:53 |
| rainemak | ExTechOp, no idea... looks to be months away | 07:54 |
| rainemak | #link https://forum.sailfishos.org/t/community-meeting-on-24th-april-2025/22836/11 | 07:54 |
| flypig- | I read that beaconDB provides a MLS API; does it look like it might be quite straightforward to integrate? | 07:54 |
| rainemak | flypig-, yes... mal actually already integrated it (made url configurable) but there are some issues in geoclue hybris/binder plugin with the cell tower reporting | 07:56 |
| rainemak | I would expect to have it by Sailfish OS 5.1. | 07:57 |
| flypig- | Nice; that's really exciting. It'd be a great feature. | 07:57 |
| rainemak | we're running out of time | 07:57 |
| flypig- | There was an great talk at FOSDEM about OpenAGPS, which looks interesting, but looks more experimental than beaconDB (so I'm not suggesting it as an alternative right now, just something to keep an eye on maybe). | 07:57 |
| flypig- | https://openagps.net/ | 07:57 |
| flypig- | https://fosdem.org/2025/schedule/event/fosdem-2025-6739-openagps-open-source-gnss-assistance/ | 07:57 |
| rainemak | #link https://openagps.net/ | 07:58 |
| rainemak | thanks flypig- | 07:58 |
| rainemak | let's schedule next meeting | 07:58 |
| rainemak | #topic Next meeting time and date (2 mins) | 07:58 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to "Next meeting time and date (2 mins) (Meeting topic: Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration -- 24th April 2025)" | 07:58 | |
| rainemak | Proposing Thursday 8th May at 07:00am UTC | 07:58 |
| rainemak | going once | 07:59 |
| ExTechOp | ✅ | 07:59 |
| flypig- | ✅+1 | 07:59 |
| rainemak | #info Next meeting will be held on Thursday 8th May 2025 at 07:00am UTC: 2025-05-08T0700Z | 07:59 |
| rainemak | thank you everybody! great meeting! we managed to squeeze in many topics and some adhoc comments from the meeting topic | 08:00 |
| Nico | Thank you for your time :) | 08:00 |
| Nico | (And answers) | 08:00 |
| ExTechOp | Thanks everyone! | 08:01 |
| iolala | wait, it's over? | 08:01 |
| flypig- | Thanks rainemak and all! | 08:01 |
| iolala | my calendar said it starts now 😂 | 08:01 |
| ExTechOp | Summer time? | 08:01 |
| tuplasuhveli[m] | Thank you! | 08:01 |
| dcaliste | Thank you, and thanks for the roadmap also ;) | 08:02 |
| dodoradio[m] | thank you! | 08:02 |
| iolala | there's something wrong with the calendar invite from the forum post that announced the meeting | 08:02 |
| iolala | it set the wrong time in the calendar | 08:02 |
| rainemak_ | #endmeeting | 08:02 |
| dcaliste | iolala, I agree. Indeed, the time is set to 8.00 UTC, while it should be 7.00 UTC... | 08:04 |
| ExTechOp | rainemak remember to update the /topic | 08:05 |
| *** rainemak is now known as Guest14300 | 08:05 | |
| *** rainemak__ is now known as rainemak | 08:05 | |
| rainemak | #endmeeting | 08:05 |
| sailbot | Meeting ended Thu Apr 24 08:05:44 2025 UTC. | 08:05 |
| sailbot | Minutes: https://irclogs.sailfishos.org/meetings/sailfishos-meeting/2025/sailfishos-meeting.2025-04-24-07.00.html | 08:05 |
| sailbot | Minutes (text): https://irclogs.sailfishos.org/meetings/sailfishos-meeting/2025/sailfishos-meeting.2025-04-24-07.00.txt | 08:05 |
| sailbot | Log: https://irclogs.sailfishos.org/meetings/sailfishos-meeting/2025/sailfishos-meeting.2025-04-24-07.00.log.html | 08:05 |
| *** sailbot changes topic to "Next meeting will be held on Thursday 24th April 2025 at 07:00am UTC: 2025-04-24T0700Z" | 08:05 | |
| *** flypig- is now known as flypig | 08:06 | |
| flypig | Test post. | 08:07 |
| tuplasuhveli[m] | Sorry flypig for not answering to your question, for some reason I don't see your messages. | 08:07 |
| tuplasuhveli[m] | Oh, now I see your post :D | 08:07 |
| flypig | I think there was something odd about my nick that caused problems for the Matrix bridge! | 08:08 |
| tuplasuhveli[m] | Glat it got sorted out at the end! | 08:08 |
| tuplasuhveli[m] | s/Glat/Glad/ | 08:08 |
| flypig | Yes, same here :) But my question wasn't a very sensible one: you were right, the option in developer mode only affects the long-press top menu, from what I can tell. | 08:09 |
| flypig | I tried to search for the dconf option but wasn't able to find it. | 08:09 |
| dcaliste | iolala I've submitted a PR to update the time of the meetings: https://github.com/sailfishos/docs.sailfishos.org/pull/440 | 08:10 |
| iolala | dcaliste, how did people know tge right time to show up? I used my Jolla calendar and it notified me to late appatently | 08:11 |
| iolala | *the *too | 08:11 |
| tuplasuhveli[m] | Placing the reboot option to developer mode tab is a bit odd, in my opinion. I thought the latest update was going to fix that, but perhaps that is something for a future update. | 08:12 |
| tuplasuhveli[m] | After all, it's not only developers, who might have a need to reboot their phones.. | 08:13 |
| flypig | I agree tuplasuhveli[m] that it's a useful option, whether you're developing or not. | 08:13 |
| *** ChanServ changes topic to "Next meeting will be held on Thursday 8th May 2025 at 07:00am UTC: 2025-05-08T0700Z" | 09:21 | |
| *** rainemak_ is now known as rainemak | 12:27 | |
| *** rainemak is now known as Guest14314 | 12:34 | |
| *** rainemak_ is now known as rainemak | 12:34 | |
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